Is Antifreeze, like Aspirin, "Hype"?
 

On my Diesels I have used everything from PepBoys to Rotella Antifreeze and sometimes I wonder if its Hype. Somethings on Turbobricks and SAABnet you hear members touting the advantages of a certain brand Antifreeze that really lower engine temperature, but if you really think about it, engine temperature heat release is controlled by thermodynamics and not what the intracacies of the cooling fluid are.
The basic component in Antifreeze, Ethylene Glycol, basically keeps the 40 to 60 percent water component from boiling over. The additives inhibit corrosion. Does the actual coolant composition make a difference? Water is the ideal thermodynamic coolant, I mean you can't use Housepaint or Lacquer Thinner, or Salad Dressing (hey could you?) but no miracle fluid is going to absorband transfer heat better than water ( or am I wrong?) I mean thats why water was always the component in steam engines driven by boilers. If there was something better, why did they still keep using water?
Does it also affect the adiabatic properties of the coolant mix? I thought that was controlled by the radiator / fan size and water pump properties and and engine thermodynamics. I mean if you have a teeny tiny radiator, no wonderbrand of antifreeze is going to help. And as long as you have basic anticorrosive additives? I wonder--then why do radiators and heater cores fail nevertheless and always lok the same inside? After all it all copper piping like the stuff in your house..

Water is indeed a better conductor of heat. However, bunch of other things come into play. Since not all the metals in the cooling system are the same, you get some nasty processes going on. Most of these are trying to eat the metals. Since your aluminum radiator core is the least noble metal in the bunch, it trys to go away first. Thats where the silicates in the antifreeze come in. They protect the aluminum. The iron wants to rust so there are corrision inhibitors in the mix for that too. The plastic neck in the radiator seems to get brittle more quickly if you use green formula antifreeze. Some engines are prone to problems with coolant boiling on the in iron blocks and the resulting cavitation erosion causes pin-holes in the block. Just ask some Ford PowerStroke diesel owners about that. I believe Ford came out with an additive package to fight that.
The PH of the coolant can make things even worse. MB has figured in the PH of the 50% water and the antifreeze and tries to come out neutral after the mix is poured into the engine. Some other brands start out bad and get worse from there. GM's Dexcool (not the same thing as MB coolant) is known as "deathcool" to a lot of Chevy owners. The PH makes a rapid change and the next thing your know, your cooling system is full of black sludge. For those guys, running green seems to be the best way to go.
For all systems, changing coolant every two years seems to be a good plan. Of course we all know what happens if you just run water in the winter. A cracked block in a horrible sight. Folks in really cold climates run a higher percentage of antifreeze to coolant. Of course when you live where it regularly get to -50 F., well, you get other things to worry about too.
Do you have to buy MB coolant? Probably not. You could just buy the generic G-05 stuff. You could use green and if you changed every two years, you might be fine. The more aluminum in the system (like my old 560SEL) the more I want the real-deal MB coolant. For an old 617 with a brass/copper radiator and heater core, green wouldn't hurt my feelings.

This may interest you.....
top
Q. Does Prestone® Antifreeze/Coolant contain phosphates?

A. Some European automobile manufacturers request that a phosphate-free antifreeze be used in their vehicles. This issue is related to the extremely high mineral content of the water in Europe. If you were to mix an antifreeze that contained phosphates with the type of water they have in Europe, it may produce deposits that can settle in the cooling system and promote corrosion. However, in North America we do not have this type of water problem. Typical North American coolants have contained phosphates (which is part of the corrosion inhibitor package) for many years. Therefore, the question of phosphates is a non-issue here in North America. Prestone® Antifreeze/Coolant is completely safe for use in both foreign and domestic vehicles. For those consumers who would feel more comfortable using a phosphate-free antifreeze, our Prestone® Extended Life 5/150 Antifreeze/Coolant is phosphate, silicate, and borate free. This coolant uses a special chemistry and technology that extends the life of the corrosion inhibitor package so that it lasts for five years or 150,000 miles (whichever comes first), and is safe for all cars and light trucks (old or new). Prestone® Extended Life 5/150 Antifreeze/Coolant has been approved by General Motors under their DEX-COOL® specifications and is compatible with other DEX-COOL® approved coolants.

NOTE. Notice this says that this product is COMPATABLE with DEX-COOL. It does not say it IS Dex-Cool.


.

Yes
 

YES, in most cases it is "Hype"... :(

it could very well be hype.... but I like to over-maintain my fluids. so G-05 every two years is a go. I use just one gallon in my 300e. So 5 bucks a year isn't too much to ask for to keep the internals clean.

I used to use Red-line water wetter as an additive. I think that's more hype.
they got me for two bottles a couple of years ago, however.

I surrender, it is giving me brain cramps.
 

Hello Lee
:) If we ever get the chance to meet, you must teach me how to say your last name.:)
I was setting here trying to pronounce it, and my wife thought I was cursing. Doh :o :o

Polo zuk, Polu wic zuk, Polo wic zuk, Polowik zook, I surrender, it is giving me brain cramps.:o ;)

polo-chuck

however when it comes out of my mouth it sounds more like pole-la-chuck.

cz is like a ch.

sorry for taking up the board space on this one. But since I plan on being around for awhile i hope you don't mind.

Thank you
 

Thank you Lee:D :D

I will be flushing and filling with G-05 this weekend. I have 2 gallons of G05.

Does anyone know offhand if I HAVE ENOUGH, or what is needed. And in South Florida where I am, what % of distilled H2O I should blend???

Thanks, Austin

50/50 mix
 

50/50 mix.

With 2 gallons I'd say you have more than enough, like twice the amount you'll need.

50/50 is what the book calls for. I, however, chose to run 45/55 as it gave me great cooling in the CA desert. Funny thing, that same ratio works great in sub-zero weather too. Saw -25F my first full winter in Michigan and had no problems at all.

50/50 just ran a little too warm in the heat for me and my 4.5, so I kept the same mix with the 560.

I, for one, don't think it is hype. I tend to use the recommended anti-freeze, mixed with distilled water, and I add a bottle of Water-Wetter. None of these are expensive, especially so compared to the cost of a new radiator or aluminum head. Although M-B is the only one to recommend replacing coolant every two years, I do it on all my cars. When I first tried Water-Wetter, it was in the Austin-Healey. They are notorious for running hot. One bottle in a roughly two-gallon system dropped the running temp about 10 degrees (f).

Having said that, though. It's your car and you can run any damn thing you want in it.

just my $.02,
Wes

when you flush the car out well you pour in what will be 50% of the cooling systems capacity per the manual....then top off with water....because how will you know how much water is trapped in the system before you add......this way you get it dead on without issues.

And yes...it DOES matter that its the right type or not.......due to the aluminum and plastic components in the system......(mostly the aluminum)

I like Evans waterless coolant.

http://www.evanscooling.com/main25.htm

So, it sounds like the likelyhood of long-term corrosion due to incorrect coolant chemistry far outweighs any slight potential 'gains' in the actual cooling ability of one brand over the other.

If I understand, it 'boils down' :rolleyes: to these simple steps:

1. Use an antifreeze to improve the freezing point and boiling point over water.

2. Use corrosion inhibitors to protect the metals in your cooling system.

3. Select an antifreeze with corrosion inhibitors compatible with the metallurgy of your particular radiator and engine block.

4. You won't go far wrong by following the manufacturer's recommendations. (See #3.)

5. Be wary of annecdotal information that sounds too good to be true.