Living a Clutch Nightmare...any Bleeding ideas? - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

JohnMcConnell · #1 02-07-2006, 10:30 PM

Just installed a new master & slave for my 240d 1982. Thought doing the reserve bleeding would be a breeze. WRONG! My wife pumps the brake and what happens is fluid goes all over the ground from the slave bleeder. It would seem like it's too open, but it either doesn't flow all because the bleeder is closed, or opening it fluid flows on the ground.

How loose should the bleeder be??

This is what I'm doing:
--put hose on brake bleeder & open
--push brake until no bubbles, close bleeder
--hook hose to slave bleeder & open both bleeders
--push down & hold brake
--close brake bleeder & lift brake
--repeat the whole thing

Thanks for any help.
John

t walgamuth · #2 02-07-2006, 10:58 PM

but i can't see what you are doing wrong. where is the fluid coming out that goes on the ground?

i have bled the clutch on a saab by sucking fluid up a clear plastic tube like a huge 4' long straw and attaching it to the slave cyl and just blowing it into the clutch circuit til it came out the top bleeder.

i do know that the benz clutches can be a ***** to bleed.

good luck

tom w

JohnMcConnell · #3 02-07-2006, 11:35 PM

One thing I'm wondering about is the hose connection from the master to the reserve. I put the hose way far in -- I actually took out the rubber and stuck the connector on, and then put it the rubber back in the master. So, maybe that made it so fluid couldn't get through. I was thinking maybe that was the problem, so I took the whole thing apart and just put the hose as far as I could push it. The thing is, it's pretty easy to pull out now. But, after I made that change is when I ran out of brake fluid....who knows, maybe that was the problem...I obviously don't know what to think.

John

Stevo · #4 02-07-2006, 11:44 PM

The bleeders on the brake slave are 9mm and 7 on the clutch slave thats why I use tiny hose clamps. Open both (1/2 +-turn) , pump brakes like crazy, close bleeders. If you dont have a working clutch, more pumping. You dont need to close the bleeders while holding the brake pedal down, just pump and close them.

I put a box end wrench on the bleeder then the hose

I was gona ask you if you have bleed on of these before

JohnMcConnell · #5 02-07-2006, 11:50 PM

ohhh...so maybe the key is to buy a couple little hose clamps and just open the bleeders a little. I have been opening them a full turn or more, and have been lying under the car holding the hose clamps in place so they don't blow off.

The hose clamps are a great idea. Thanks. Also, I'll just turn the bleeders a little...

Do you think that's been the problem, I've turned the bleeders to far open??

Thanks. I really want to get this going and get on with my vacation!

Stevo · #6 02-07-2006, 11:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnMcConnell

One thing I'm wondering about is the hose connection from the master to the reserve. I put the hose way far in -- I actually took out the rubber and stuck the connector on, and then put it the rubber back in the master. So, maybe that made it so fluid couldn't get through. I was thinking maybe that was the problem, so I took the whole thing apart and just put the hose as far as I could push it. The thing is, it's pretty easy to pull out now. But, after I made that change is when I ran out of brake fluid....who knows, maybe that was the problem...I obviously don't know what to think.

John

the hose should just stick right in the rubber fitting on the clutch master cyl. So the fluid leaked outa that conection when you pumped??

Stevo · #7 02-08-2006, 12:15 AM

[QUOTE=JohnMcConnell]ohhh...so maybe the key is to buy a couple little hose clamps and just open the bleeders a little. I have been opening them a full turn or more, and have been lying under the car holding the hose clamps in place so they don't blow off.

The hose clamps are a great idea. Thanks. Also, I'll just turn the bleeders a little...

Do you think that's been the problem, I've turned the bleeders to far open??

Thanks. I really want to get this going and get on with my vacation![/QUOTE

I use that clear hose from the lumber store. Take the time to use small hose clamps, believe me its worth it. Yes, you could have opened the bleeders too much.

JohnMcConnell · #8 02-08-2006, 12:21 AM

OK! I'm catching the bus tomorrow morning from the campground we are stranded at. Going to buy a bunch more brake fluid and 3 hose clamps (an extra just in case!) Tomorrow I'll also just turn the bleeders a little bit and try it. I do think I shoved the hose way to far into the master, and that was the problem. You've given me hope. I'm thinking by tomorrow at 10am we'll have it done! I'll let you know.

John

JimmyL · #9 02-08-2006, 12:36 AM

You might grab some tie wraps also, just in case the hose clamps give you trouble. Sorry to hear you are having troubles while on a trip. Good luck and keep us posted.
How are you online?

Stevo · #10 02-08-2006, 12:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnMcConnell

OK! I'm catching the bus tomorrow morning from the campground we are stranded at. Going to buy a bunch more brake fluid and 3 hose clamps (an extra just in case!) Tomorrow I'll also just turn the bleeders a little bit and try it. I do think I shoved the hose way to far into the master, and that was the problem. You've given me hope. I'm thinking by tomorrow at 10am we'll have it done! I'll let you know.

John

On the hose clamps to make life eaiser I use a 1/4 socket
of the appropate size and a long extension. If you have those tools with you its eaiser than trying to get a screw driver up there to tighten the clamp on the slave, and put your box ends on first

Stevo · #11 02-08-2006, 12:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnMcConnell

OK! I'm catching the bus tomorrow morning from the campground we are stranded at. Going to buy a bunch more brake fluid and 3 hose clamps (an extra just in case!) Tomorrow I'll also just turn the bleeders a little bit and try it. I do think I shoved the hose way to far into the master, and that was the problem. You've given me hope. I'm thinking by tomorrow at 10am we'll have it done! I'll let you know.

John

On the hose clamps to make life eaiser I use a 1/4 socket
of the appropate size (small) and a long extension. If you have those tools with you its eaiser than trying to get a screw driver up there to tighten the clamp on the slave, and put your box ends on first

#12 02-08-2006, 09:55 AM

I have had some real challenges bleeding clutch systems over the years but the 123 has been one of the easiest for me. Right now I am having all sorts of trouble bleeding the clutch in my 88 Vette. With a GM POS that is to be expected, however. You don't have to drive too many GM products very far to understand why they're going out of business.

I have had really good luck in the past with a 123 clutch by simply doing a quick two man bleed of the system, make sure the reservoir is filled and then let it set overnight. The rest of the bubbles will come out plenty well enough to use with no trouble. Maybe I've just been lucky, but it has always worked for me.

Good luck,

kerry · #13 02-08-2006, 10:17 AM

I can sympathize with your situation, although I don't completely understand the problem. I bought my 307d on the Internet. It was just outside of London in a campground. When I got there to pick it up, the previous owner had driven it around a campground a bit to make sure everything was operational. The master reservoir was low and the clutch system took a gulp of air, so the clutch didn't work at all. But, perhaps I was lucky because the bleeding seemed simple. My friend pumped the clutch a few times, held down the pedal and I opened the bleeder. A couple of times and it was fixed.
If you find yourself in a real bind, it is possible to drive without a clutch. You have to start in gear, but by matching rpm's of engine with the rpm's of the gears in the tranny, you should be able to shift up and down without the clutch. If you can get most of the air out of the clutch, or pump it enough to get the car moving, you could travel without it for a long time, particularly on the interstate.

Stevo · #14 02-08-2006, 11:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LarryBible

I have had really good luck in the past with a 123 clutch by simply doing a quick two man bleed of the system, make sure the reservoir is filled and then let it set overnight. The rest of the bubbles will come out plenty well enough to use with no trouble. Maybe I've just been lucky, but it has always worked for me.

Good luck,

Last year for some reason I did allot of clutch work (the year of the clutch) I found that letting it set over night worked fine. Most of the time i just wanted to get it done and outa my shop however. I now have a zip lock containing the hose, two small hose clamps and the right size 1/4, socket for the clamps. I've heard of folks using the pressure bleeder, or maybe the mity vac but the brake slave to clutch slave is a one man, fast and easy job if you have those simple tools at hand.

nazrat · #15 02-08-2006, 12:30 PM

One trick that we used on my old 240D was to power bleed it with the brakes. First you normally bleed the front brake closest to the clutch cyl until clear (new) fluid comes out. Then you connect a hose from that brake bleeder to the clutch bleeder. Hose clamps are a must. Then open both bleeders and use the brake pedal to force fluid up through the clutch slave. It was quick and easy compared to the endless bleeding that we tried before attempting this method.

-Tad