Why I prefer MB diesels - Page 2 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

JackG · #16 02-09-2008, 07:58 PM

I have a daily driver that has over 330k
starts and drives reliably and I would not
hesitate to drive anywhere.

Show me an american car of the same vintage
that you would do this in.

I really don't care what the car cost new, I didn't buy it new.
I paid $1500 over a year and a half ago, it don't owe me nothing,
yet it still goes, and goes, and goes.

I though I might drive this thing till the wheels fall
off.......but I might be dead till then

Show me an american car that will do this.

The thread title may be a little misleading as I was really
refering to the W123's and w126's

Show me an american car of ANY vintage
that is built to last like these.

lutzTD · #17 02-09-2008, 08:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MTUpower

Yes MB's are expensive. A subject I did not raise nor is it relevant. Yes american cars/trucks can be nice and have little maint. Again not relevant. Read what I asked and then re-answer. Don't mean to be flippant.

I would consider a car with a known defect like bending rods to be crap. In most cases the quoted US cars with defects are crap too, but they were cheap crap not expensive crap, which do you think is worse......Cost is absolutely relevant in engineering. in addition I saw a little econo box MB that is available in Canada that was also not well recieved here on the forum.

lutzTD · #18 02-09-2008, 08:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JackG

I have a daily driver that has over 330k
starts and drives reliably and I would not
hesitate to drive anywhere.

Show me an american car of the same vintage
that you would do this in.

I really don't care what the car cost new, I didn't buy it new.
I paid $1500 over a year and a half ago, it don't owe me nothing,
yet it still goes, and goes, and goes.

I though I might drive this thing till the wheels fall
off.......but I might be dead till then

Show me an american car that will do this.

The thread title may be a little misleading as I was really
refering to the W123's and w126's

Show me an american car of ANY vintage
that is built to last like these.

come on Jack, drive to work one morning a defy you to go the whole way without seeing an old chevy or ford pickup. and they were a heck of a lot cheaper to buy and they are one heck of a lot cheaper to fix

AdvisorGuy · #19 02-09-2008, 08:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MTUpower

Yes MB's are expensive. A subject I did not raise nor is it relevant. Yes american cars/trucks can be nice and have little maint. Again not relevant. Read what I asked and then re-answer. Don't mean to be flippant.
I think of crap cars as
Pinto
Gremlin
Corvair
Yugo
many Fiat's. Early Korean cars. Many French cars. Many English cars.

Nor did I, raise anything about the price of a Mercedes. I simply stated that any built after 1998 are crap. I don't expect to see a 2008 S550 on the road in 2033. They'll be leased, then some poor suckers will buy them off lease and eventually the electronics/air suspension,etc will be so cost prohibitive to repair, that they'll be dismantled. $7000+ for a Command Center at my last glance and $6000+ for air suspension.
By the by, my first car was a handed down 1977 Vega.. It was in the family for a total of 8 years and 95,000 miles before I sold it and bought my 85 GTI. In those 8 years, it let us down 3 times: Once due to a tune up that was paid for and not done. One was the only belt on it breaking and third was yours-truly doing neutral drops, snapping the ring gear on the third rocket launch. Even after all that, at 95K when I sold it, it burned LESS oil than Mercedes finds "acceptable" consumption of 1ltr/1000km today... Pice of crap ? Certainly. But it was a reliable piece of crap.

Point being, yes there are plenty of ****ty cars out there and Benz is not immune to building them. The new C-class commercials make me laugh. "We built it with door hinges that can support a 200lb man....." Meaning they built it like they built my 126 25 years ago ?!?!?!? Let's hope the new C,Cl,S,etc is a return to engineers building cars and not accountants.

Bio300TDTdriver · #20 02-09-2008, 08:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JackG

I cannot believe you duys are actually comparing a
fine car, such as a w123.........with a FORD P/U

OH THE PAIN

They both get you to the same place.

Hatterasguy · #21 02-09-2008, 08:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AdvisorGuy

Would you like the former MB Service Advisor to elaborate on that ???

Anything from 1998 on up had issues.. Pick a model and I'll get back to you with a list..

Really? I know a lot of people with newer MB's and they love them. How many have you owned and what were the problems?

MB never built a bad car, at least that they sold in this country. The S280 was kind of lame, and that little C230K coupe they killed a few years ago was pretty lame. But even a bad MB is better then a normal car.

AdvisorGuy · #22 02-09-2008, 09:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hatterasguy

Really? I know a lot of people with newer MB's and they love them. How many have you owned and what were the problems?

MB never built a bad car, at least that they sold in this country. The S280 was kind of lame, and that little C230K coupe they killed a few years ago was pretty lame. But even a bad MB is better then a normal car.

Didn't own any of them. I worked for a Benz dealer in Jersey from 2000 to 2004. People always say: "You work at a dealer so you only see the problem cars." Well we had 50 techs and an average of 350 appointments a week and we could not keep up.
00-05 S430/500/600 - recalls for blower motor resistors & washer heaters catching fire, batteries exploding in the trunk, MAF sensors,O2 sensors,ECMs, Brake light switches, air suspension, Command Centers..
01-01 C230/240/320 - tilt wheel motor strips out, HVAC flap motors, brake light switches, O2 sensors, MAF, bulbs blow every other day, ground harness updates for front signal sockets melting
97-02 E320/430-CLK 320-430 - brake light switches, A/c leaks from the same spots, dash will split on the passenger side air bag perforation, vanity mirror doors snap the first time used, door sill covers break/crack all too easily, Trans Control Modules in all the models mentioned.
03- E320/350/500/550 - Keyless GO doesn't GO, Sound system issues, some of the same issues as the ones above.

To be fair, there were at least 2 dozen of those weekly appointments were only for routine maintenance.

Skippy · #23 02-09-2008, 09:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by t walgamuth

Mercedes built an excellent car. I believe they still do from a mechanical and safety standpoint. Unfortunately they are nothing special when it comes to electronic gizmos and modern cars have more than their share of that CRAP.

Tom W

I believe this is a generally true statement.

Now just to play devil's advocate, I would like to point out a few examples of excellent American vehicles:

1. My mom's '63 Dodge Dart had 280,000 miles on the original engine when my dad drove it to the junkyard. It was junked partly because it was burning oil at a prodigious rate (could have been fixed with a relatively inexpensive rebuild) but mostly because it had spent its entire life in PA and NJ and had the associated corrosion issues, to which Mercedes of the era were by no means immune. This sort of longevity was fairly common for the 225 Slant Six.

2. The Ford Panther platform (Crown Vic, Mercury Grand Marquis, Lincoln Town Car). I only drove mine to 156,00 miles before I let it go. The guy I sold it to is still driving it. I didn't really have problems with it until I started using it to commute at 50-70 mph on a dirt/rock/mud road to work every day. I could have dealt with some repairs and kept it going much longer, but gas was getting over $2/gal, and I really wanted a diesel. I've heard of many less-abused examples in livery service making it to 300,000 miles or more, and one beyond 500,000.

3. Full-size diesel pickups, of which I'd say the 12v and early 24v Dodge Cummins were the best examples, though even weak-suck 6.2 and 6.5 GM's have been known to last over 300k. Cummins and Powerstrokes with over 500,000 are not unheard of. The Duramax may have as much longevity potential, but they haven't been around long enough for us to know yet.

4. Ford F150 with the 300 straight six aka 4.9L in later years. These have similar longevity to a 225 Slant Six (or an OM617 for that matter). Not much power, but plenty of torque and good on gas. I'd still consider a 2wd F150 5 spd with the 300.

TylerH860 · #24 02-10-2008, 01:11 AM

Even though both of my Benzes are 20+ years old, it makes me proud to read about their quality improving. Car and driver ranked them 5th in initial quality, a HUGE improvement. Let's hope this reflects long term quality as well.

I also find it amazing that Porsche is firmly at #1. Its probably because so few are driven daily, but still quite impressive.

An S550 in 2038? They'll still be around; if they led a low mileage, pampered life. They will only be Trailer Queens. Same goes for Escalades, Corvettes, and just about any other new car... The auto restoration business's future is questionable.

My w123 in 2038: if I continue to pamper her and drive an average of 7,500 miles a year, she'll be approaching 393k. That's a normal occurrence with us.

What will Mercedesshop be like in 2038???

Cervan · #25 02-10-2008, 05:12 AM

i think the 65-70 mustang
and the chevy 2 (chevy nova) are both very worthy cars that are atleast comperable to a mercedes 123 of the same era or newer.

vstech · #26 02-10-2008, 07:43 AM

... how much is your 30 year old MB worth...
my 67 chevy camaro cost about 3K in 67, it's now worth over 30K... my 68 camaro cost around 4K in 68... now worth around 50K... my 82 SD cost about 40K in 82... I got it for free in 2001... of course, I DRIVE the 126, the camaros sit nice and comfortable in the garage only taken out for drag races and car shows...
the 67 is all original... same low ball 327 v8 same carb... transmission has been changed from the original 3 man to a number of different ones from a powerglide, to a th350... I may put in a 4L60 soon... or a 700R4 to avoid computer issues... I have a 94 suburban with 240K on it, that I may swap the computer and drivetrain in her... giveing me time to rebuild the original motor with some modern components... or drop in a full 4Bolt 350 or something... I may take the original 3speed and put a overdrive kit on her... or put in a tremec... or a zf6 from my dad's old vette... how many choices do you have in your MB?
the 68 has been a drag car since the 70's so it's choices are much more limited... that narrowed Dana 60 with spool and 4link kinda limit drivability... but they are building a new drag strip this year, so she is going to get some MUCH NEEDED use soon...
I have never had any difficulty working on or purchasing any parts for my CHEVY's (I have hated starting in cold weather with that stupid stove pipe choke...)
MB's are awesome no doubt... but I would not say that NO american iron has equal or excess value.

asnowsquall · #27 02-10-2008, 08:13 AM

One of my favorite American bangs for the buck, 1973-1979 Chevy C10 or K10. C10 being the cheapest. Very easy to find parts, and they are cheap. Trucks just keep going and going.

Dee8go · #28 02-10-2008, 10:28 AM

I don't really know what makes something "classic," but Mercedes are classics. I used to think that this was somewhat due to the scarcity of an object, but there are plenty of MBs around now, so I doubt that explains it. Even the models I don't particularly want to have, I still admire their good looks. I guess it's one of those intangible things that is just hard to nail down.

94mgm · #29 02-11-2008, 07:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MTUpower

Care to elaborate on which "crap cars" MB produced?

Mecedes: A-klasse, Vito, early 220cdi's, 350sd,gd, sprinter (Polish built crap, good engine though),

Lots of 2000-2003 stuff wasn't too impressive either.

My point was not to mock mercedes. It is my favorite brand after all. But There are durable american made cars too. Did you know that mercedes costumer satisfaction is near rock bottom in Europe??

Hatterasguy · #30 02-11-2008, 08:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AdvisorGuy

Didn't own any of them. I worked for a Benz dealer in Jersey from 2000 to 2004. People always say: "You work at a dealer so you only see the problem cars." Well we had 50 techs and an average of 350 appointments a week and we could not keep up.
00-05 S430/500/600 - recalls for blower motor resistors & washer heaters catching fire, batteries exploding in the trunk, MAF sensors,O2 sensors,ECMs, Brake light switches, air suspension, Command Centers..
01-01 C230/240/320 - tilt wheel motor strips out, HVAC flap motors, brake light switches, O2 sensors, MAF, bulbs blow every other day, ground harness updates for front signal sockets melting
97-02 E320/430-CLK 320-430 - brake light switches, A/c leaks from the same spots, dash will split on the passenger side air bag perforation, vanity mirror doors snap the first time used, door sill covers break/crack all too easily, Trans Control Modules in all the models mentioned.
03- E320/350/500/550 - Keyless GO doesn't GO, Sound system issues, some of the same issues as the ones above.

To be fair, there were at least 2 dozen of those weekly appointments were only for routine maintenance.

Hmm I know a lot of people with models that fall into those ranges and they are all happy with them. My uncles new E350 has been flawless so far, another agent has an 07 CLK550 that has also been totaly flawless.