VW Diesel Hybrid coming!!! 69.9 mpg - Page 4 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

75Sv1 · #46 03-03-2008, 11:40 AM

I thought I saw in one of the trade magazines that Opel, a GM subsiderary, is suppose to market a car on the Volt concept this year in Europe.
Tom

DieselAddict · #47 03-03-2008, 12:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deni

Lets say you're stuck in traffic and using only the electric engine. Then you reach the highway and need the power from the diesel/petrol engine. The ic engine has been off so it's cold. but once you need the power you need to rev the engine. Isn't it bad for a cold engine?

The computer would not allow the engine to get too cold by turning off the auto shutoff feature if the engine temp drops below a certain value. A bigger concern for me with hybrids has always been the frequent restarts of the engine in stop and go traffic. As you know there's no oil pressure in the first second or so after a start so the amount of time the engine in a hybrid system runs with zero oil pressure is much greater than what a typical engine experiences.

Deni · #48 03-03-2008, 03:27 PM

In Tirane, where I live, the exit to the main highway is a busy intersection that links the city to the north and south of the country. It's a crawling traffic off about 10 min.

Quote:

A bigger concern for me with hybrids has always been the frequent restarts of the engine in stop and go traffic. As you know there's no oil pressure in the first second or so after a start so the amount of time the engine in a hybrid system runs with zero oil pressure is much greater than what a typical engine experiences.

I guess an electrical auxiliary pump takes care of it.

DieselAddict · #49 03-03-2008, 03:49 PM

I don't think that is the case, but I'm not totally sure.

Bio300TDTdriver · #50 03-03-2008, 07:47 PM

Toyota bought one back from a Vancouver, BC cabby with 200,000 miles on it. I believe it had the original engine in it. I suspect his had a few stops and starts.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/8839690/

This one has 250,000 miles on it.

http://www.hybridexperience.ca/index.html#hybridtaxi

Maintenance records for each car.

http://www.hybridexperience.ca/Pages/images/scan.pdf

http://www.hybridexperience.ca/Pages/images/Prius%202004%20report.pdf

94mgm · #51 03-03-2008, 08:41 PM

Volkswagen already had a 78mpg car on the market. I drove one. Great, usable car and it wasn't a hybrid. The car had an automatic start/stop system. The engine would stop at a red light and come back to life when you hit the throttle.

here is one for sale they are worth more today than when they were new, http://www.dba.dk/asp/soegning/detail.asp?annonceid=53500113.

Audi made one to. http://www.dba.dk/asp/soegning/detail.asp?annonceid=53500113

The body and mechanical parts including the engine was made of magnesium.

Bio300TDTdriver · #52 03-03-2008, 09:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 94mgm

Volkswagen already had a 78mpg car on the market. I drove one. Great, usable car and it wasn't a hybrid. The car had an automatic start/stop system. The engine would stop at a red light and come back to life when you hit the throttle.

here is one for sale they are worth more today than when they were new, http://www.dba.dk/asp/soegning/detail.asp?annonceid=53500113.

Audi made one to. http://www.dba.dk/asp/soegning/detail.asp?annonceid=53500113

The body and mechanical parts including the engine was made of magnesium.

Is that a Danish site? Is the price in Krones?

#53 03-04-2008, 12:09 AM

Quote:

The OE 302 marks a new start for hybrid development

The more recent history of hybrid drives at Daimler-Benz began in 1969, when the company presented the OE 302 city bus as an experimental vehicle at the Frankfurt International Motor Show (IAA). The bus carried 66 passengers, and its powertrain was a DC motor with an output of 115 kW (156 hp), that could be temporarily increased to 150 kW (204 hp). This electric motor was powered by lead batteries, for example during zero-emission driving through city centers. For driving in the country, the electric motor fed a generator which in turn was powered by a diesel engine. The latter operated at a constant speed, at a constant load, and with good efficiency, which meant it generated less exhaust gas or noise in comparison with a vehicle diesel engine, and also required less fuel. According to the researchers, the hybrid principle employed in the OE 302 substantially reduced the downside of having a lead battery - high weight and low energy density - at reasonable cost.

“The electric drive will find its application in buses, where noise and emissions from street vehicles must be entirely eliminated from the city center,” according to a somewhat prescient 1971 press release. “Using hybrid energy systems, they can travel through inner-city areas on electric batteries, thus producing zero emissions and very little noise.” At that time, however, the company reached the following conclusion: “The additional cost in comparison with the drive systems already in use and with natural gas drives therefore means that […], for the present, practical application [of electric drive systems] should only be expected in special cases.”

The Mercedes-Benz OE 305, presented in October 1978 at “transport ’78,” the international trade fair for transport technology, was set up on the same principle as the OE 302. With identical output data, however, it was able carry up to 100 passengers. Its range using only batteries was between 50 and 75 kilometers, depending on driving style, and up to 300 kilometers in hybrid mode. In May 1970, as part of a five-year model test, the first four of a total of thirteen OE 305 buses commenced regular duties as public transport vehicles in Stuttgart. Another seven vehicles followed in September in Wesel.

-----

2002: For the legendary Unimog commercial vehicle, the corporate Research division develops a serial hybrid variant in 2002. In the Unimog E-Drive, a 130-kW (177-hp) diesel engine drives a 100-kW (136-hp) generator which, in turn, supplies power to the electric traction motor and drive systems for the various implements.

40 years MB has been researching series-hybrid diesel-electric vehicles. Yet, not a single car is being sold with it by any manufacturer.

You really should check out this article, there are lots of rare alternative fuel high resolution pictures. http://www.emercedesbenz.com/Nov07/21_Alternative_Drive_Systems_At_Daimler_AG_For_The_Mobility_Of_The_Future_1.html

424studios · #54 03-05-2008, 09:17 AM

very cool webpage, thanks forcedinduction

t walgamuth · #55 03-05-2008, 10:11 AM

I think the damage caused by start up is exaggerated. The statement is that starting up causes the most wear of ......(whatever).

The oil does not run completely off the bearings. The oil in the bearing shells cannot be gotten out of the space easily, as it is held in by capillary action.

I once started a freshly rebuilt caddy motor without any oil in the pan and ran it for several minutes (don't ask how this happened) with no ill effect. There was the white grease that my favorite machinist used on assembly only.

Of course I would never choose to run an engine with no oil in the pan even for a second, but starting and stopping them in this application does not seem to be an issue.

Tom W