Parts Catalog Accessories Catalog How To Articles Tech Forums
Call Pelican Parts at 888-280-7799
Shopping Cart Cart | Project List | Order Status | Help



Go Back   PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum > Mercedes-Benz Tech Information and Support > Diesel Discussion

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 10-12-2008, 04:23 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Vancouver, BC
Posts: 21
Severe OM617 Overheat - Typical Result?

Hi,

Through my own stupidity I managed to severely overheat my OM617 that I swapped into my G-Wagen.

There was no heat coming from the heater, suggesting low coolant, and I thought I could get about 5km into town, but she blew up before I made it. The engine stopped running while I was cruising at highway speeds, its good I was in a remote area and there was plenty of space to stop as well as limited traffic.

I am relatively new to diesels so I'm wondering what approach to take; my options are find another engine to swap in and rebuild this one in parallel, or do a mini-overhaul and get this one running. A wrecker 617 can be had locally for $1500.

The engine turns over freely when I try to start it, but it doesn't seem to have any compression. While the engine doesn't seem to be seized, the throttle linkages are - I can't move them at all.

So my question is, what are the normal failure modes of this engine when overheated? I am guessing the head gasket blew, oil was everywhere. But what other items can I expect to go? Is it typical that I would crack the head or block due to an overheat? The engine got hot enough that there is now flash rust on the outside of the block...

Thanks in advance for your help!

Cheers,

Michael

Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 10-12-2008, 04:28 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 18,350
617's don't typically 'blow up' when overheated. But, the fact that it quit running is an indication of something serious going on. I'd try to determine the source of the oil. An overheated engine does not typically spew oil. Did an oil cooler hose break?
__________________
1977 300d 70k--sold 08
1985 300TD 185k+
1984 307d 126k--sold 8/03
1985 409d 65k--sold 06
1984 300SD 315k--daughter's car
1979 300SD 122k--sold 2/11
1999 Fuso FG Expedition Camper
1993 GMC Sierra 6.5 TD 4x4
1982 Bluebird Wanderlodge CAT 3208--Sold 2/13
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 10-12-2008, 04:49 PM
Cervan's Avatar
Crazy mechanic.
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: olympia washington
Posts: 1,809
if you overheated it to the point that it scored the cylinder walls then you are either overhauling the engine or swapping it out for a new one. mostly if you didnt extremely overheat it the cylinder walls will be fine, and you just need to install a new headgasket / mill the head if its warped. Other than that, there isnt much else that can go wrong.
__________________
Have you ever noticed that anybody driving slower than you is an idiot, and anyone going faster than you is a maniac?

As long as they would add one additional commandment for you to keep thy religion to thyself.
George Carlin (Wonder where he is now..)

1981 240d (engine donor 1983 240d) recently rebuilt engine hurray! - No more.. fought a tree and the tree won.

pearl black 1983 240d 4speed (Converted!@$$%) atleast the tranny was rebuilt.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 10-12-2008, 09:54 PM
Gurkha's Avatar
Satyameva Jayate Ad vitam
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Boondocks
Posts: 1,026
OM616/617 with their cast iron head are among the most resilitent engines when it comes to overheating however in this case, it looks like you have totally ruined it.
__________________
99 Gurkha with OM616 IDI turbo

2015 Gurkha with OM616 DI turbo

2014 Rexton W with OM612 VGT
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 10-13-2008, 02:52 AM
ForcedInduction
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Find a used engine. If you overheated it to the point that it blew an oil line and died from oil starvation, it will take waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay more than a "mini-overhaul" and $1500 to get it going. Expect pistons, cylinder sleeves, bearings, probably some valves and an injection pump rebuild too by the sound of it (PLUS core charge if the pump is not rebuildable). Parts cost of the pistons, rings and sleeves alone will easily pass $1500, not counting shipping and installation labor.

I love that you've gotten a 617 into a G (please post some pictures of it!) but you screwed the pooch not stopping at the first sign of problems.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 10-13-2008, 03:31 AM
Cervan's Avatar
Crazy mechanic.
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: olympia washington
Posts: 1,809
removing the head may be the only true answer other than a compression test.
__________________
Have you ever noticed that anybody driving slower than you is an idiot, and anyone going faster than you is a maniac?

As long as they would add one additional commandment for you to keep thy religion to thyself.
George Carlin (Wonder where he is now..)

1981 240d (engine donor 1983 240d) recently rebuilt engine hurray! - No more.. fought a tree and the tree won.

pearl black 1983 240d 4speed (Converted!@$$%) atleast the tranny was rebuilt.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 10-13-2008, 06:00 AM
t walgamuth's Avatar
dieselarchitect
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Lafayette Indiana
Posts: 38,609
A compression test is essential to know what happened. If it has no compression though you will be albe to tell it by the engine spinning freely without any lumpiness caused by the compression of the individual compression events.

Not to keep beating you but running on after an engine is overheated is one of the surest ways to really ruin it.
__________________
[SIGPIC] Diesel loving autocrossing grandpa Architect. 08 Dodge 3/4 ton with Cummins & six speed; I have had about 35 benzes. I have a 39 Studebaker Coupe Express pickup in which I have had installed a 617 turbo and a five speed manual.[SIGPIC]

..I also have a 427 Cobra replica with an aluminum chassis.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 10-13-2008, 10:32 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Middle TN
Posts: 4,154
I'd diagnose before trashing the motor. Overheating is bad AND every problem that I've had has turned out to be minor. I like leak down tests in conjunction with compression tests for gassers but haven't had to run one on a diesel. IF you determine that the engine needs to be rebuilt, buy a parts car with a running engine. They show up on craigs list for less than the $1500 you quoted. Salvage yards think they're gold. I try to buy non-running junk that people want to get rid of. Eye of beholder comes to mind.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 10-13-2008, 11:10 AM
ForcedInduction
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Quote:
Originally Posted by Junkman View Post
Overheating is bad AND every problem that I've had has turned out to be minor.
He didn't just overheat his engine, he ran it out of oil.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 10-15-2008, 12:20 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Vancouver, BC
Posts: 21
Thanks for the help guys. My plan of attack right now is to buy a wrecker motor and then rebuild this one over a one year period... that way I'll have a 100% reliable motor for next winter.

The strange thing is that while there was oil everywhere, it didn't look like I blew an oil line. To me, it looked like oil was spewing from the head... mind you that was in the dark and few weeks ago, the only thing that will tell me for sure what happened is pulling the motor apart.

I did have one additional question; the motor turned over but there was no feeling of compression whatsoever. On another forum that point was brought up as a symptom, but the potential reasons for it weren't discussed. Does anyone know what that lack of compression would suggest?

Cheers,

Michael
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 10-15-2008, 01:02 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Redmond, WA
Posts: 622
Overheat and run out of oil? Probably seized....doesn't sound fun.
__________________
1983 Mercedes-Benz 240D
Automatic, A/C, Power Sunroof, Power Right Side Mirror
231K Miles FOR SALE MAKE OFFER
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 10-15-2008, 05:25 AM
t walgamuth's Avatar
dieselarchitect
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Lafayette Indiana
Posts: 38,609
Lack of compression could be from lack of seal of the rings or the valves. A leakdown test will reveal where the leak is located. You put air in the cylinder and listen in the intake and pan for hissing. If its in the intake or exhaust manifolds you have valves leaking, if its in the pan you have ring seal failure.

__________________
[SIGPIC] Diesel loving autocrossing grandpa Architect. 08 Dodge 3/4 ton with Cummins & six speed; I have had about 35 benzes. I have a 39 Studebaker Coupe Express pickup in which I have had installed a 617 turbo and a five speed manual.[SIGPIC]

..I also have a 427 Cobra replica with an aluminum chassis.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On




All times are GMT -4. The time now is 06:03 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2024 Pelican Parts, LLC - Posts may be archived for display on the Peach Parts or Pelican Parts Website -    DMCA Registered Agent Contact Page