Defeated by a brake hose - Page 2 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

MBDFahrer · #16 04-12-2009, 06:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pop & blow

take a hack saw ans hut the line into at below the spring clip and it should all fall out the take the line to the parts house and get a new line short one to put back insave the spring clip you will need it to back with the line size is 4.75 you can buy lines with the fittings already on the lines so all you have to do is bend the new line back in the shape of the old line be careful it will bend double if not careful it does not have to be exact just tightened the line until it does not leak also pick up a new rubber line to the caliper...good luck... that fitting is ugly cut it out and replace....

So in other words, you're suggesting I get a new brake line with it? I'm planning to replace all the brake hoses, and the other 2 doesn't have stripped nuts yet. How should I free those?

mobetta · #17 04-12-2009, 07:37 PM

if that is a rear line(as it seems to be) the hard line is only a couple feet at the most. it will end in a T in-between the wheels somewhere, and would be easy enough to replace entirely. that is teh route I would take at this point., cut w/ a hacksaw, remove rubber line and hard line, take to FLAPS, and get new line.
they should have euro bubble flare lines in stock.

also if you have a flare tool, you can do your own- but these are bubble flares, not like the USA which uses a double flare. but the size is close enough to 3/16 that you can use 3/16 line and metric ends. or cut it and double flare it w/ an SAE end and use an adapter to your rubber line.

confused yet??

I like this - vise grips locking wrench- for brake lines.

MBDFahrer · #18 04-12-2009, 08:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mobetta

if that is a rear line(as it seems to be) the hard line is only a couple feet at the most. it will end in a T in-between the wheels somewhere, and would be easy enough to replace entirely. that is teh route I would take at this point., cut w/ a hacksaw, remove rubber line and hard line, take to FLAPS, and get new line.
they should have euro bubble flare lines in stock.

also if you have a flare tool, you can do your own- but these are bubble flares, not like the USA which uses a double flare. but the size is close enough to 3/16 that you can use 3/16 line and metric ends. or cut it and double flare it w/ an SAE end and use an adapter to your rubber line.

confused yet??

I like this - vise grips locking wrench- for brake lines.

Not at all! I rented a double flare tool but couldn't find the ends needed so I returned that. And my local auto parts stores (Kragen and Autozone) does not carry the metric flare nuts, and neither of them even have them listed in the catalog

I'm pretty sure it'll come down to me replacing the flare nuts if not the rear line completely. If it comes to replacing the whole line, I'm not looking forward to breaking it free from the T-Junction.

On a slightly related subject, is it safe to use anti-seize on these threads?

Billybob · #19 04-12-2009, 08:48 PM

This is a perfect example of when having the right tool allows you to get the job done and and not having it will only make the job longer and more difficult!

Now your only real fix is; as has been mentioned, replacing the damaged line, NAPA has them in assorted lengths with Euro bubble flares and fittings at both ends. But you still need the right tool, having done more than a couple hundred brake line/hose R&R, you will never regret the $10-15 for this one! Since using this one I've never had a nut strip, and that's up here in New England!

MAC Tools CHBM11 - 3/8" drive, six point, Crows Foot, Flare Wrench, 11mm, this tool is 10 mm high/thick! These lines are often a one shot deal and because of this you need the best fitting strongest tool the first time. Anything less will often slip and strip the nut. This tool is 10 mm thick/high and therefore very strong and its' dimensions will not change under force, and because its thick you can't get the tool where its not square to the nut like you can with a thin wrench. And now that you've got to the point where you've got to replace one of the rear lines its really the only tool that you can use to get a turn on the brake line at the T fitting that is up underneath the car! With this tool and about 16" of extentions, from the side you can break the line free way up under there! I'm sure a Snap-On equivalent would work as well. I use this usually with a 3/8" breaker bar and maybe a 3" extention to allow some offset for clearance of the bracket at the hose/line junction. Its' only purpose is to break the flair nut free, you can turn it out with any wrench then!

There are sometimes when paying the extra money for a high quality tool will even save the hobby wrench some money in the long run! Good Luck!

MBDFahrer · #20 04-12-2009, 09:15 PM

If only I knew there was a "proper" flare nut wrench *facepalm* I guess that's another tool I need.

funola · #21 04-12-2009, 09:41 PM

That looks llike the right tool! I thought I had the right tool and it still rounded the flare nut!

http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_00942013000P?keyword=942013&sLevel=0

I just measured my 11 mm Craftsman flarenut wrench and it is only 1/4" (6.35 mm) thick. I guess being 10 mm thick makes a difference?

The CHMB11 is $23 at Mactools online. Is it cheaper on the trucks? I doubt it.

http://www.mactools.com/product/tabid/120/p-323524-chbm11.aspx

Still worth it if it saves you from all the aggravations and time wasted.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Billybob

This is a perfect example of when having the right tool allows you to get the job done and and not having it will only make the job longer and more difficult!

Now your only real fix is; as has been mentioned, replacing the damaged line, NAPA has them in assorted lengths with Euro bubble flares and fittings at both ends. But you still need the right tool, having done more than a couple hundred brake line/hose R&R, you will never regret the $10-15 for this one! Since using this one I've never had a nut strip, and that's up here in New England!

MAC Tools CHBM11 - 3/8" drive, six point, Crows Foot, Flare Wrench, 11mm, this tool is 10 mm high/thick! These lines are often a one shot deal and because of this you need the best fitting strongest tool the first time. Anything less will often slip and strip the nut. This tool is 10 mm thick/high and therefore very strong and its' dimensions will not change under force, and because its thick you can't get the tool where its not square to the nut like you can with a thin wrench. And now that you've got to the point where you've got to replace one of the rear lines its really the only tool that you can use to get a turn on the brake line at the T fitting that is up underneath the car! With this tool and about 16" of extentions, from the side you can break the line free way up under there! I'm sure a Snap-On equivalent would work as well. I use this usually with a 3/8" breaker bar and maybe a 3" extention to allow some offset for clearance of the bracket at the hose/line junction. Its' only purpose is to break the flair nut free, you can turn it out with any wrench then!

There are sometimes when paying the extra money for a high quality tool will even save the hobby wrench some money in the long run! Good Luck!

MBDFahrer · #22 04-12-2009, 11:03 PM

funola, I bought the same set and thought it was adequate. It got 1 line off and I was jumping like a little girl. So much for part deux. Looks like I'll need a tool box pretty soon for all the tools I got.

Billybob · #23 04-12-2009, 11:22 PM

$23 !!!! yikes, the next time I go to the local used tool store I better kiss that old guy who owns it! I bought a 9, 10, 11, 13, 17, and 19mm, never been used for $5 each! I stop by at least once a month and spend a hour or two pawing through boxes of wrenches and sockets for anything metric and quality, Hazet/Stahlwille/Snap-On/MAC/Cornwell/Armstrong.

With this particular tool I think there are a couple factors, the 11mm hex is a very tight fit first of all, and my experience is that the better tools have tighter tolerances to start with. The second thing is that with this particular tool being so thick/high there is just more beef to it and therefore less chance of "give", I think this factor comes into play and is more important with the open design. The design of this tool is also important in that it has a quite small "open" area. These flare nuts are problematic by both design and nature, they have a long threaded section that engages in use and they are exposed to the worst of road conditions when it comes to corrosion. Its also important to use a good tool on the opposing hose fitting, you don't want things wiggling around when you're putting force to things.

As far as being "proper" I define that as the tool that gets the job done without collateral damage. In some circumstances the house brand or a Craftsman tool will get it done and that's plenty proper for me. I have a couple sets of flare nut wrenches, and have done a fair number of these jobs most successfully but some ended with failure like this original poster. In the past when a wrench fails I prefer a large pair of Channel Locks where you can really put some pressure to the jaw tips to grip the nut enough to break it free. Of course you’re stuck with replacing the entire line and all the potential problems when that occurs, getting to the T and successfully breaking the connection there can be even worse! So the day I found this tool and saw how well made it were you can bet I was going to spend a few dollars to avoid these kinds of hassles in the future. Truth is if I lost this one I'd buy a replacement for $23 in a minute. But for the past couple years I've been making part of my living turning a wrench on these older MB cars so it’s important to get it done right the first time, I have to pay for the time, energy, and parts when things don't go as planned. As such I use about 8 oz of KROIL a week and I look at every fastener as a potential disaster! I try to give myself every advantage from the first pull, use the best tool that will fit and try to keep things straight and square. After the first pull goes bad it’s usually down hill from there! But always keep a 3lb hammer and chisel or the trusty torch ready!

I’m not a tool snob by any means and I’ve got lots of Craftsman and other stuff that I use regularly, but if you appreciate the engineering sensibility that these cars inspire there’s nothing like using a well made tool and getting the job done. It’s as much of “getting it done right” as it is “Man, I’m glad nothing bad happened doing that!”

Good Luck!

MBDFahrer · #24 04-12-2009, 11:32 PM

Interesting, I should visit pawn shops more often. But that's a different subject altogether.

And as if all this downtime isn't enough "fun" apparently a neighbor had reported me to the city and now the car needs to be "repaired or removed" to prevent a fine.

MBDFahrer · #25 04-17-2009, 09:58 PM

Little update to my scenario, I got the snap-on equivalent of the crow foot flare wrench and... I really wished it was a girl instead of a nut because I'd have one nice show right now

. It still managed to round one corner and not break free yet. I bent the hell out of the metal clip to try and give myself more room to grab the nut, cause it seems the wrench still "hops" as I twist, hence rounding.