Considering purchase of a 1987 300D, what to look for? - Page 2 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

a2t · #16 07-24-2009, 10:09 PM

yeah i'd say 3.5-4k price range, unless body and int are really good.

mines got 290k on 14 head.

couple things based on what you mentioned :

was that rad replaced with a Behr unit, or Nissen? You would only want Behr and those things are pricey. Not bad to RR, but $350 last i checked. Behr has the metal outlet sleeves, very important. Nissen is all plastic.

as for what ive seen "common failures" on mine -

igntion lock mechanism froze up, needed a tow and about 5 hrs of my time to RR. Happens to all of them eventually.

rear suspension 5 link had some arms wear, caused the "standing in a canoe" handling. not expensive to RR (mine was the upper front arms needing replacement, the rest are more difficult). accel hard and if it does the sine wave on shifts, take a closer look.

ACC can be flaky, mine stays on all the time and runs AC all the time but Im in Atlanta so thats a good thing.

Cruise - you can get the amp for $150 rebuilt, not a deal breaker.

engine - water pump, alt, aux pump, oil level sender, oil press sender, rad hoses, serp belt tensioner/spring - all of this is easy and cheap. starter went up at 270k, a real chore to RR but not too expensive. diesel heater t-stat - not hard but over $100 for that silly plastic part. glows twice in 60k, not that easy and be sure the metal fuel lines arent butchered because if bent will break. The metal injector lines are very hard to find, last I check MB was on an 8 month back order.

otherwise engine/trans are good but drip a little.

its a VERY VERY well built car, needs a bit more mtc than 123 but IMO well worth it. I think you will be satisfied, make sure to run carfax and get the title, ect... ect...

You most likely WONT find engine parts in the bone yard like a 617 but will find lots of interior goodies.

617 is still most reliable, cheap diesel they made and you will spend more on 603. But the refinements are well worth the hassles if you arent afraid to get your hands dirty.

Crazy_Nate · #17 08-18-2009, 10:59 AM

There do seem to be some quirks. When I got the car, there were two sets of keys. I got it started with the well worn one after picking up the car from the pre-purchase inspection. It needed fuel, so I stopped at a gas station, added a couple of gallons, and tried to leave. The key would turn, but there wasn't any response. No lights, nothing. I don't think it would even glow.

I popped the hood, checked the battery leads (brand new, beefy battery). Looks fine. Still couldn't get it to respond. So I push it out of the way and a friendly passer-by offers to lend a hand with a jump. I figure it couldn't hurt. We get it hooked up, and then I decide to try the other set of keys I got (that the shop had - a set of brand new master and valet keys). Glowed, fired right up.

I've only used the new keys since, and I haven't had a problem firing it right up. Is this something I should be worried about? It doesn't look like I need to replace the ignition cylinder yet...but, if it might go out slightly down the road, I can replace it. From what I've looked at, it looks to be about the same difficulty as when I did my 240D (cake).

Other quirks include the drivers door not being able to unlock the car. It just doesn't turn. It locks the car just fine. I don't see this as an immediate problem, as the central locking system works well, and I can use either the passenger door, or trunk. Would this just need a new lock cylinder as well? I'd imagine that the door would need some pretty heavy disassembly, however, that's probably not bad, either.

The shop that did the PPI said there was a slight (very) fuel leak, and I believe the service adviser said it was probably at the injectors. They said it was nothing to be worried about, and it didn't need any attention. All of the other fluid levels were fine, if it burns any oil, it's probably not noticeable.

The car seems to run at about 95C here, in 90-95F weather, after the turbo has kicked in for an extended period (I've never driven a car with a turbo charger before, so the throttle response is still new to me). I'm going out to check on the aux fan right now.

The ACC seems to work as designed. All of the buttons re-direct the air, recirculate, turn air off seem to operate the pods as they should. The AC works, maybe not as well as I'd like, but the ambient temperatures are a little high (95F, and humid). I might think about using minor tint to keep the temperatures down a little more. The maroon interior has a way of making things warm.

It's got a #14 head, doesn't use coolant, and no 'cold pressure' symptoms whatsoever. I'm going to be really cautious with keeping the cooling system well maintained. I don't want to be paranoid, just careful.

When I finish grad school (very soon), and find a job, I'll have plenty of weekend time to R&R parts, and the money will be more plentiful

Are there any red-flags stopping me from driving 200 (highway) miles? I need to go back to Maryland and fly to defend my Masters in less than a week. I can always take the train, if needed. The previous owner had been using the vehicle as a commuter car (probably 30-40 miles a day) for a long time without any trouble.

Thanks for any input

I think I'm going to have to come up with a name for her soon.

Crazy_Nate · #18 08-18-2009, 12:35 PM

Ok, I think I answered my own question.

I got stuck in a parking lot. Same starting issues as before. It is really odd, I'm not sure if it is an electrical gremlin or what.

The first try, it glowed, and then clicked (sounded like a relay, single click) when I went to start it. Subsequent tries (after making sure it was in park, and taking the key out and putting it back in), led to less results. It would light up in key position 1, but when I got to the glow position, the lights all disappear...more or less unresponsive. The weird thing is the response of the cd player. It wasn't on when I turned off the car, nor is it on when I try to start it, but it acts like it tries to do something (read a cd maybe) when / after my attempts of starting (but, it's fully off).

That's what's leading me to suspect some sort of electrical problem. I'm definitely taking the train to MD, and when I do get back, I'll have a multimeter and a battery charger on hand, as well as some free time. I'll start a new thread when I get to that point just related to this problem.

Oh, today, the car didn't hit 90C (probably 87-88 when it warmed up, without AC), I guess I was a little rough on the accelerator before (and I had the AC on).

Thanks for reading.

babymog · #19 08-18-2009, 01:25 PM

Sounds like a classic weak-connection to the battery symptom. If the dome-light stays bright while the ignition is dead however, more likely ignition switch or neutral-safety switch (try starting in neutral or hold the key in start position and shift around).

A great car for your trip if you sort out the starting issue. Also, you can bypass the starter switch circuit with the connector on the inner-firewall just ahead of the brake booster.

Fuel leak might be the rubber/cloth fuel return lines, typical. Replace with good fuel line from Mercedes (there is a kit, click the parts button above).

The door locks are a cinch to remove. There is a plug in the doorjamb, behind which is a set-screw that holds the door lock portion of the handle in place. The larger plug in the doorjamb is to un-plug the electrical portion of that same lock.

a2t · #20 08-19-2009, 06:17 PM

well if it lites off on a jumper then the battery is either flat out dead or just isnt getting charged. the alt's on those things are really weak 65 amp units (but oddly, the cores are in high demand for some reason). once you get it running check battery voltage, make sure its over 14v idle, then turn on all the acces, it shouldnt really go lower than 13.5 or so. if it does, suspect alt. You can replace it w/120 amp unit from a later 124 (or even 140, 150 amp units from 98-99 E300) they all fit (but you need to swap over your pulley on the 140/150 amp units). I just used the 120 amp bosch, cheaper than 65 amp! You need to grab the wire harness from alt to battery though unless you feel like making your own. Call the Benz Store in Atlanta, Ken will send you everything needed. He hooked me up!

Crazy_Nate · #21 08-19-2009, 07:11 PM

I had it not start twice while being jumped, and the battery ($143 interstate) and alternator are brand new. I'm leaning toward it being an electrical issue. I'll probably change out the battery wires and make sure that they're making very good connections. The odd thing is, the problems usually happen when the car is warmed up. If it has been sitting, fires right up. I think the previous owner had the same problem, and just didn't mention it. The maintenance documents seem to point that way (hard starting -> got new glow plugs, alternator, battery, etc).

I'm waist deep in thesis work, so, I'll post back late next week.

babymog · #22 08-19-2009, 09:49 PM

New doesn't mean good in alternators, and I'd still suspect the wiring.

Paul: Who wants these 65a alternators? I have two or three I pulled from my cars when upgrading, ... you mean someone will PAY me for them?

Wodnek · #23 08-19-2009, 09:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crazy_Nate

I had it not start twice while being jumped, and the battery ($143 interstate) and alternator are brand new. I'm leaning toward it being an electrical issue. I'll probably change out the battery wires and make sure that they're making very good connections. The odd thing is, the problems usually happen when the car is warmed up. If it has been sitting, fires right up. I think the previous owner had the same problem, and just didn't mention it. The maintenance documents seem to point that way (hard starting -> got new glow plugs, alternator, battery, etc).

I'm waist deep in thesis work, so, I'll post back late next week.

Also check the wires on the starter to make sure they are tight.

a2t · #24 08-19-2009, 10:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by babymog

New doesn't mean good in alternators, and I'd still suspect the wiring.

Paul: Who wants these 65a alternators? I have two or three I pulled from my cars when upgrading, ... you mean someone will PAY me for them?

I have no idea, but thats what Ken at benz store told me when I bought the 120 amp from him. he said the 120's were dime/dozen and he didnt even care about cores for that 1 but the 65 amp core was worth something...go figure...

hey connect a jumper from + lead to starter motor when it wont crank, to see if it is faulty 4 ga wire from bat to starter. careful, connect starter end 1st!!

aersloat · #25 08-20-2009, 01:25 AM

Hmm. I have a 65 A just sitting around as well.

One thing sort of mentioned is the neutral safety switch. Did you try starting it up in neutral? One thing that fails in these is a little rubber bushing on the shifter connection. When I got my wagon I had intermittent starts and the guy I bought it from told me I would need a neutral safety switch. All I really needed was the shift bushing, which is about a buck and not very hard to replace. If the bushing gets really worn you can have trouble starting in neutral as well.

You have presumably read gsxr's buying guide. There are some important things like the vacuum pump to check right away. If you had the compression tested during the inspection and cylinder 1 was off you probably have a blown head gasket at the famous oil passage -- it may not manifest in typical ways. Mine didn't. Probably a good idea to replace the coolant and thermostat unless you know the coolant is mercedes approved. Doesn't cost much and is probably a good idea.

Like a2t I had to replace the d*mn ignition tumbler a few months ago. It is really easy to do if it isn't broken. It is a huge PITA if you have a key stuck in there. You don't always get much warning as I found out.

There are plenty of easy little upgrades to do, some of which, like changing the fan/fan clutch and adding afterglow can improve how the car runs.

Have fun.

Crazy_Nate · #26 09-21-2009, 10:37 AM

Hey guys,

Just a little update and some pictures. Everything has been pretty smooth running since the temperature drop. I think there might be a glow plug out, I'll have to check it whenever my multimeter gets here (c'mon fluke, I bought it a while ago!). Haven't had any issues with starting, but I'll still look over the cables and connections (and keep track of resistances when doing so), just to see if anything makes a difference.

Hmm...vacuum pump...how would I go about checking that? I've seen a few horror stories about that.

I'd love to get some of these moderate repairs done in the future, however, I'm still hunting for a job at the moment, so, only the critical ones are getting attention. Hmm, afterglow does sound nice.

Now, some pictures for your viewing pleasure. I just washed, ran a clay bar over all the paint, and waxed (Meguiars Gold Class). Enjoy!

The rest are on the cardomain page here. I even put my list of future repairs (page 4).

PS. Anyone got any tips for cleaning the original wheels? I can keep scrubbing them with a brush, but I don't want to damage them (I'm not sure what kind of finish they've got)

babymog · #27 09-21-2009, 11:12 AM

The wheels are painted silver. Clean is difficult in the holes, best of luck. Most likely by now the brake dust has made a permanant home there and the only way to clean it up is to paint.

The 15-hole wheels look brilliant when freshly painted, when the holes show silver inside, well worth it but they're difficult to keep that way.

Jeremy5848 · #28 09-21-2009, 11:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crazy_Nate

. . . PS. Anyone got any tips for cleaning the original wheels? I can keep scrubbing them with a brush, but I don't want to damage them (I'm not sure what kind of finish they've got)

The wheels are painted. They will never look beautiful; they didn't look beautiful when new. Best for now to leave them as-is. Don't get "dust shields" as they are said to block air from properly cooling the brakes. In the future, consider the chrome version of the same wheel, which you can find for sale here and there (some think chrome looks tacky, YMMV). There are also later-model wheels that are similar but have fewer holes (less to clean). They should fit your car -- I don't know the details.

Inspect the vacuum pump by looking at it. If it has four screws on the front surface, it's a new one with the sealed bearing, you're OK. If it has a smooth sheet-metal front with no screws, it's the original, think about getting a new one. About $300, you can do the job yourself, lots of threads on that subject here, make sure the new pump comes with the correct gasket or it won't fit, search this forum for pictures and instructions.

Euro headlights are nice (I think the wipers look silly) but expensive, about $600 the pair, maybe more. You have to get (and paint -- they come in primer only) new trim panels for below the headlights, ones without the wiper hole. There are also wipers for the Euro headlights, even more $$$. Here is my '87 w/Euro headlights. I put X-pel protective plastic film on both the headlights and the lower trim panel, it does a good job of preventing rock chips.

Jeremy

sixto · #29 09-21-2009, 01:11 PM

There's an occassional old bearing vacuum pump with a new style cover. There should be a plate over each end of the bearing completely blocking view of the balls in the races.

Euro style headlight wipers are available used from 94-95 124s.

Sixto
87 300D

Crazy_Nate · #30 09-22-2009, 04:44 PM

Well, my suspicion has been confirmed. I'll probably replace the vacuum pump soon. It looks like it might be original. It's a little hard to see in the picture, right under the s-belt is a star. What is the consensus about quality of vacuum pumps? I'm probably going to want to replace it and never have to worry about it again. Any difference between OE or OEM (or does Pierburg make them all and I should just go with whichever is cheaper)? Are the differences in gaskets something you can discern while purchasing, or will I notice it when I have the pumps side by side and have to make a decision then?

I managed to give the wheels a good scrubbing with a small nylon brush, but some of the brake dust is pretty well stuck on. Guess that'll have to do for now

So many questions! Thanks for your patience, guys. It's really appreciated.