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  #1  
Old 07-02-2010, 09:54 PM
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Lower Ball Joint -1; POS Harbor Freight Vice - 0

Oh man, this front suspension rebuild on the 240D is giving me a run for my money. I have everything apart. I managed to seperate the LCA from the ball joint. And now the challenge for the day is getting the stinking ball joint out of the steering knuckle. I started out using a large socket and a sledge to try and pound it out. Nothing - couldn't even get it to budge. So then I wised up - or so I thought. I don't have a press, but I realized I could lay the knuckle on its side in my vice, place the socket to the bottom of the ball joint, and try to press it out that way. When I saw that I could actually get it all lined up pretty well, I really thought I was going to press that sucker out. I tightened it up good by hand, then I put a piece of long pipe on the vice arm to get extra leverage. Twist, twist, twist - ever so slowly - twist, twist, twist - put on safety glasses just in case - twsit, twist, twist, - getting excited because I know this is going to work - twist, twist . . . BANG!!! Piece of crap Harbor Freight vice busts in half!!! Actually, I guess I am not all that surprised. I should not have expected much from the crappy Chinese cast iron. Regardless, I'll be hauling it back to HF tomorrow to get my $65 refunded, I do not want another one.

I think after stopping by HF tomorrow I will drive down to the shop and see how much it will cost to have these pressed out and new ones pressed in - sometimes you just have to know when to say when.

Oh, and BTW, the vice in question is Item # 32115. "Industrial Quality" 5 inch - 360 degree swivel vise. My wife has the camera or I would definately post a pic of this piece of garbage.

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'95 E300D ("Tank") - 231,000 miles
'79 240D ("Biscuit") - 197,250 miles (Sold)
'83 240D ("Ding-Ding") - 217,000 miles (Death by deer)
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  #2  
Old 07-02-2010, 11:58 PM
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The missing ingredient may be Heating the Knuckle around where the Joint.

One of the members used a Cutting Torch and actually cut a hole in the center of the Joint; yet left enough metal for something to drive it out.

If you are replacing them with something like th UREO made Joints they are going to go in harder too; as the UREO joints have more metal to metal area than the Lemforders I compared them to.
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  #3  
Old 07-03-2010, 09:48 AM
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the harbor freight 20 ton press or whatever the rating is works pretty well
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  #4  
Old 07-03-2010, 10:13 AM
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So let me make sure I've got this straight.

You use a $65 dollar chinese vise to attempt to do a job that calls for a 20-30 ton hydraulic press and you're mad because the vise breaks when you stick a long pipe on it and "twist-twist-twist-twist"? Really? You're serious?

Just curious, but when the guys at HF ask what you were doing when the vise broke what are you going to tell them?
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  #5  
Old 07-03-2010, 10:18 AM
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For my LBJ (har!) I just set the knuckle on its side, the top part against the base of my sand filled basketball hoop, taped a big socket on to the bottom of the joint and hit it with an 8 (?) Lb sledge. Came out with only a few hits and I'm pretty deep in the rust belt.
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  #6  
Old 07-03-2010, 10:28 AM
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It is clear from reading the other threads on the subject of removing the Lower Ball Joints that ounce in a while some Ball Joints are nearly un-removable.

The FSM has putting the Knuckle in the Vice and beating it out as the only method. I does not say what to do after that.

Using a Vice as a Press is a recommended technique for some things. So it is not far fetched to try that; depending on the size of your Vice.

The rest is an act of desperation; I think we have all been there a one time or another.

When I put my Steering Knuckle in the Vice and beat the Lower Ball Joint out I could see the possiblilty that that could also have damaged my Vice but did it anyway.
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  #7  
Old 07-03-2010, 12:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TimFreeh View Post
So let me make sure I've got this straight.

You use a $65 dollar chinese vise to attempt to do a job that calls for a 20-30 ton hydraulic press and you're mad because the vise breaks when you stick a long pipe on it and "twist-twist-twist-twist"? Really? You're serious?

Just curious, but when the guys at HF ask what you were doing when the vise broke what are you going to tell them?

Yes, I think you did manage to read my post correctly, Tim. So let me ask you - are you serious? Find me the service manual that says this job "calls for" (what is this a cook book you're using?) a 20-30 ton hydraulic press. Maybe some guys on here have a press and have used one, but others have pounded the joint out with a 5lb hammer. Regardless, my apologies if my $65 refund from HF has ruined your day. BTW, the HF guys didn't ask, because they know they sell throw away tools. Anyway, thanks for your post.
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'95 E300D ("Tank") - 231,000 miles
'79 240D ("Biscuit") - 197,250 miles (Sold)
'83 240D ("Ding-Ding") - 217,000 miles (Death by deer)
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  #8  
Old 07-03-2010, 01:33 PM
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Mine broke like that too. Poorly manufactured. I had extremely low expectations and this undershot them by a mile. All Harbor Freight tools do -- you just can't have low enough expectations with them.

Took me some time with my grinder and a new bolt/nut to fix mine. Turns out the mount for the screw rod wasn't well attached and the bolt ripped out. I'd have just returned mine too, but I'd already dented the metal too much by pounding on some red-hot pliers I was modifying -- yeah, they'd made it with that soft of steel.
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  #9  
Old 07-03-2010, 02:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tankowner View Post
Find me the service manual that says this job "calls for" (what is this a cook book you're using?) a 20-30 ton hydraulic press.
The service manual calls for using a hammer. But you decided to press the joint out instead. At that point, saying that the job calls for a 20-30 ton press is not at all unreasonable.

In all fairness, can you furnish a service manual that recommends using a bench vise?
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  #10  
Old 07-03-2010, 04:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tangofox007 View Post
The service manual calls for using a hammer. But you decided to press the joint out instead. At that point, saying that the job calls for a 20-30 ton press is not at all unreasonable.

In all fairness, can you furnish a service manual that recommends using a bench vise?

Gents. I appreciate all the comments. Well, most of them anyway.

To answer the question: no, I cannot furnish a manual that recommends using a bench vise as a press, or one recommending a 20-30 press, or one recommending two opposing teams of mules trying to pull the two components apart. For the record, I only decided to use the apparently ridiculous idea of "vice as press" after the FSM method would not work. I used what I had at my disposal, a big freaking vice that should not have failed at the point that it did as far as I am concerned. Now, if anyone wants to debate about when a cast iron HF vice should fail, then have at it. That the vice would split in two prior to the ball joint popping out was not a thought that crossed my mind. We seem to always want to take the FSM as Gospel around here, but sometimes what's in the FSM doesn't always work. Trust me, I beat on that thing with an 8lb sledge and never got it to budge. So I improvised. Unfortunately, it didn't work out. I am not mad about the vice failing, as some would suggest. I really don't care - it just did and I thought I would post about it. Among the many things I have learned FROM this site, the one thing that I have learned ABOUT this site is that, if you post, you better be ready for someone to come along and call you an idiot for doing whatever you did. Oh well.
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'95 E300D ("Tank") - 231,000 miles
'79 240D ("Biscuit") - 197,250 miles (Sold)
'83 240D ("Ding-Ding") - 217,000 miles (Death by deer)
______________________________________

"Back off, man. I’m a scientist” ~ Peter Venkman
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  #11  
Old 07-03-2010, 04:29 PM
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Rule# 1-Don't buy HF tools
Rule# 2-Obey all rules
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  #12  
Old 07-03-2010, 04:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JEBalles View Post
For my LBJ (har!) I just set the knuckle on its side, the top part against the base of my sand filled basketball hoop, taped a big socket on to the bottom of the joint and hit it with an 8 (?) Lb sledge. Came out with only a few hits and I'm pretty deep in the rust belt.
Oh man, it's comment like this that make me want to cry. I'm glad it was that easy for you. Somehow I knew even before I tried that this wasn't going to be easy - probably all the posts I had read aobut things going poorly.
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'95 E300D ("Tank") - 231,000 miles
'79 240D ("Biscuit") - 197,250 miles (Sold)
'83 240D ("Ding-Ding") - 217,000 miles (Death by deer)
______________________________________

"Back off, man. I’m a scientist” ~ Peter Venkman
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  #13  
Old 07-03-2010, 05:17 PM
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Yep. Lotta know-it-all's 'round here that love to pounce, huh? That's why I mostly lurk anymore.

Anyway, last Monday I couldn't get the old balljoints to budge with a 20-ton press -- I had to move up to the 100-ton unit at my friend's propeller shop.

If you wanna ship 'em to me, I'll get 'em out for you.

Might be cheaper to take them to a machine shop and have them pressed out, though.

I read here a number of years ago that one may simply whack both sides of the knuckle a few times with sledge hammers and the joint will fall right out. Haven't tried that, so I don't know. The physics made sense to me at the time, but I've always had a honkin' press at my disposal.

You might want to do a search for that and give it a try.

Good luck!
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  #14  
Old 07-03-2010, 05:20 PM
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Umm, what's your plan for installing the replacements?
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  #15  
Old 07-03-2010, 06:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Lux View Post
Umm, what's your plan for installing the replacements?
HA!! Are you kidding me!?! You don't think I have actually thought that far in advance do you? At this point I think I am just going to take them to a local shop and see if they can press the old ones out and the new ones in. Sometimes a little cash is worth the amount of time taken off my life trying to figure out how to achieve something I may not even be able to achieve.

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'95 E300D ("Tank") - 231,000 miles
'79 240D ("Biscuit") - 197,250 miles (Sold)
'83 240D ("Ding-Ding") - 217,000 miles (Death by deer)
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"Back off, man. I’m a scientist” ~ Peter Venkman
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