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bedlinerpro 01-20-2013 08:17 PM

350sd to 300sdl swap help
I just completed a swap using a block from a 87 300sdl, new injectors, harnes, glow plugs, rebuilt head from the 95 along with ip, and all other parts from the. 95. 95 has 160k and two bent rods. Started the engine which was hard to start it is smoking black smoke and has no power , also is running hot . used AB light for timing and it is spot on . Ip is from the 95 and I made no adjustments just set the timing . Any ideas?

barry12345 01-20-2013 08:52 PM

Get the tang of the injection pump in visual sight. Look to see if the first cylinder cam lobes are pointing upward in general instead of downward. If downward you have the injection pump on the wrong stroke.

bedlinerpro 01-20-2013 09:01 PM

I did, at 15atdc first lobe points about 1 oclock. Ab lights of riv tool are both lit.

bedlinerpro 01-21-2013 02:08 PM

any other ideas ?

barry12345 01-21-2013 03:49 PM

Unusual if the cam is right. With the timing tool the cam marks should have not been too far apart. Whatever the 15 atdc degrees at the harmonic balancer allows would be it. This is about 7 1/2 degrees at the cam marks.

Very hard starting,lots of smoke and no power are typical of the 180 degree timing error at the cam. Maybe another member can think of something else that could cause this much grief. No chance a rag was left behind?

NJ300sdl 01-21-2013 04:23 PM

I would pull the valve cover and look at the cam marks to be 110% sure of timing.
Once had a Dodge cam break and then contine to rotate with some cylinders out of time.
Too much back pressure in exhaust system?

bedlinerpro 01-21-2013 07:04 PM

At tdc, the cam mark lines up and then I rotate it clockwise to the 15 where the Ab light turn on. Could lifters go bad from sitting? Intake is clear and smokes well out the exhaust. Have other swaps had to adjust ip further?

barry12345 01-21-2013 11:50 PM

Make sure the egr is closed at idle and low speeds. Just a thought as your initial description really has me at somewhat of a loss. Thats because you have really checked the timing.

The overheating may be a constricted exhaust indicator perhaps as well. Should not be hard to loosen the exhaust pipe off to test. As it was off so reciently. May be a waste of time but something is wrong.

I cannot offer an opinion on the lifters but suspect they are not the issue. Unless there is no oil feed present up there for them to pressure up from. Even if that were missing I am far from certain what the effects would be. On the otherhand perhaps that might make your symptoms possible I suppose. Valves would hardly be opening I expect as a result.

bedlinerpro 01-22-2013 07:03 PM

is it possible that the engine is timed wrong although the crankshaft reads top dead center and the number 1 cam lobe is pointing up ?

barry12345 01-22-2013 09:20 PM

Not much chance as your valves should be hitting if it were. You can check the accuracy of the balancers tdc indicator simply by removing the number one injector . Get the number one piston pretty close to tdc. Fill the combustion chamber with oil and watch for spillover to stop as you continue towards tdc. More acurate with making a transparent straw or whatever kind of tube a vertical far more accurate indicator.

When the fluid stops rising in the tube you have arrived really close to tdc and can compare it against your mark. It should be really close or less than 1/16 of an inch if you are carefull. You can find the dead mean average centre by rolling it backwards through the high point on the indicator.

I would be prone to eliminate the exhaust first of all now though unless you already have. That is very simple to do I believe in your case.

barry12345 01-22-2013 09:25 PM


Originally Posted by bedlinerpro (Post 3087980)
is it possible that the engine is timed wrong although the crankshaft reads top dead center and the number 1 cam lobe is pointing up ?

Both of the cam lobes on number one cylinder should be generally upward. Between your reporting one is and your refference to the cam marks in general. It is pretty safe to think you are not the usual 180 degrees out on the cam . For the injection pump that is.

bedlinerpro 01-22-2013 09:53 PM

I will loosen the exhaust. I am really against the wall on this one! I have no idea what else to check, ran the car with the valve cover off lifters spinning and oiling. Gonna do a compression test when the weather breaks.

bedlinerpro 01-22-2013 09:56 PM

Any good shops in nj?

gsxr 01-22-2013 10:34 PM

It's not the lifters. I too was thinking the IP was out of phase, but it sounds like your cam, IP, and crank are all in sync.

Did you check for plugged exhaust? Is the turbo impeller spinning with the engine at idle, and does it turn easily & smoothly when you turn it with you fingers (engine off)? Black smoke indicates either too much fuel or a major intake air restriction. There isn't much to go wrong on the bottom end. I wouldn't expect a compression test to tell you much unless a cylinder was dead. How hot is the engine getting, btw? Are you sure that's not just due to an air pocket? These cooling systems are a PITA to burp.


sixto 01-22-2013 11:17 PM

Remove one of the temp sensors on the upper radiator hose fitting to help burp coolant.

IIRC the .96 and .97 use the same crank damper part number so that shouldn't be an issue.

Did you move the adjustable TDC indicator during the swap? Which front cover did you use? I don't know the range of adjustment but it might be enough to throw off cam and IP timing.

Are these the cam timing marks you used?

And to be sure, the indicator edge is seen in the lower right corner of this picture. The left edge which goes north-south to the right of the water pump is the reference edge. Ignore the angled right edge -

87 300D

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