looks like 85 300d starter motor is 1 year only?

[300D85]

whereas 75-84 are interchangeable



details pls?

[Diesel911]

Originally Posted by 300D85

whereas 75-84 are interchangeable



details pls?

The parts sellers have pics of the starters at their sites. Are they stock pictures or pictures of the actual starters? I have no way of knowing.

If you have the time you could fix the one you have. I found the issue on mine was the Brushes were worn down to nubs. And that mimicked a bad solenoid (something one of our members mentioned).

I replaced the brushes and reused the Solenoid and that was years back.

You could do a google image search or look on ebay and see if there is a pic of a used one.

[300D85]

Went fishing for a cheap starter to enable compression testing on 2 pre 85 om617 engines i have.

That's when i first became aware of a few places that didn't include 85 with the rest.

Finally checked with rock auto, who also show a 1 year starter common only to the 85 126sd

Ebay is all over & often contradictory (some include 85, others don't) i find.

I googled this deal & came up empty so posted, dunno what the bottom line is.

[shadetreemechan]

My 85 is currently sporting a starter off of my 82 parts car. Seems to be working fine.

[300D85]

did a fresh year specific search & some examples with something new to me coming up

this ad shows
https://partsavatar.ca/1975-1984-mercedes-benz-300-series-remanufactured-starter-remy-16445?gclid=Cj0KCQjw--GFBhDeARIsACH_kdYkKvCQrSozVgOk2sugXRCFYgUJMu6mWio2WLcYqxAXfkGgr0AIiYsaAsQrEALw_wcB

This part will fit these makes and models with these options
MERCEDES 300D 85 123 Type; 300D
MERCEDES 300D 85 123 Type; 300TD
MERCEDES 300D 85 123 Type; 300CD
MERCEDES 300D 85 126 Type; (300SD)

this one sez
https://www.ebay.com/itm/274289513219?epid=1422946579&hash=item3fdcedd303%3Ag%3AYtcAAOSwr69bNnaJ&
fits=Year%3A1985%7CModel%3A300D%7CMake%3AMercedes-Benz

1981, 1982, 1983, 1984, 1985 - will not fit CA models
W126: 300SD

then
https://www.ebay.com/itm/274289513219?epid=1422946579&hash=item3fdcedd303%3Ag%3AYtcAAOSwr69bNnaJ&fits=Year%3A1985%7CModel%3A300D%7CMake%3AMercedes-Benz

Quantity Needed To Buy: 1; Fits Bosch System; Federal Cars; Direct Drive; 9 Tooth Gear; 617.952; 2.3kW; Compatibility information is copyright Good Better Best Auto Parts Inc

includes 85
https://www.ebay.com/itm/372717334158?epid=76152145&hash=item56c7af2e8e%3Ag%3Ajc0AAOSwig9dMlDt&fits=Year%3A1985%7CModel%3A300D%7CMake%3AMercedes-Benz#vi-ilComp

this one shows 75-84
https://www.ebay.com/itm/184457631176?_trkparms=aid%3D111001%26algo%3DREC.SEED%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20160811114145%26meid%3D70c3d c6148ef467f96d9a20ada4a0de4%26pid%3D100667%26rk%3D1%26rkt%3D8%26sd%3D184457631176%26itm%3D1844576311 76%26pmt%3D1%26noa%3D1%26pg%3D2334524&_trksid=p2334524.c100667.m2042

[300D85]

Originally Posted by 5cylinder

My understanding of the subject is:
1. There *is* a different starter specified for *California* 1985 model year 123s due to the inclusion of the trap oxidizer the presence of which impedes installation of the starter specified for previous model years.
a. I recall that the problem is due to the solenoid being positioned on the top of the starter which becomes the problem vis-a-vis fitment.

Hence and in re: "looks like 85 300d starter motor is 1 year only?"
That is correct so long as the California caveat is included.

That part is not mentioned in many ads that basically say does not fit any 85 model, or 85 model only (which may actually be correct)

Bottom line i think is the starter that is common, in abundance, way easier to source & cheaper, is usable for 85 models other than the cali deal.

I suppose or could be the cali vrs is backwards compatible or works (?) & may only be a necessity for the 85 cali model

Good to know when dealing with an 85 starter & the misinfo out there.

[Volvo Diesel]

It has always been my understanding that the different starter is only for the 1985 models that were sold for the California market. The 1985 California version starter is different because the solenoid is located at the bottom of the starter so that there is room for both the starter and the trap oxidizer (later replaced with the trap catalyst).

There's a thread that discusses the differences between the 1985 California versions and other (Federal) versions that I've consulted several times in dealing with issues on my cars. For whatever reason, all the Mercedes diesels I've owned and own currently were California models. The thread is here: W123 - Differences between the 1985 300D models and others

[Frank Reiner]

Originally Posted by 300D85

Went fishing for a cheap starter to enable compression testing on 2 pre-85 om617 engines i have.

Therefor any discussion of 1985 California-specific starters is irrelevant!

[300D85]

key point from the other thread
W123 - Differences between the 1985 300D models and others

Originally Posted by pwjeep

Some differences between an 85 and earlier W123 are: Different differential being numerically lower, Different ring gear: the difference is 11 vs 9 teeth and thus the double reduction starter won't work on it. Actually we ordered it and tried it on W Hunters 85 W126 which has the same situation as the W123 ring gear. Sure it installed ok but it just wouldn't mesh with the ring gear. We pulled it out and compared the starter gears and it looked a little funny... They didn't have the same number of teeth on the starter gears... between the starter we pulled off and the starter we tried to put on. However, we were able to mate up the double reduction starter to a 617 on a stand... but it was an earlier engine. So if you change engines... make sure you keep the starter with the engine if you are crossing into the 85 era.

[BillGrissom]

My understanding is the same as Volvo Diesel. I read Frank Reiner's comment and 300D85 link. I don't want to spin everyone up, but facts help people here, so I relate a small data point. When the engine in my 1985 CA 300D failed, I installed a used 1982? engine (block marked 1981). It had the earlier (Federal) intake and exhaust and no rack position sensor on IP (thus couldn't be a 1985 CA engine). It came with a starter, but not installed. I recall using the starter from my 1985 CA engine, but to verify I ran out to take photos (you're welcome). You'll have to rotate the photos in your mind to get them vertical. They show oriented correct in my Windows folder, but not after attaching here.

You can see that the starter in my 1985 CA differs. The solenoid is at the bottom and it has a heat shield. That was required to avoid the trap oxidizer. I did install the heat shield separately, but it may not fit my 1984 starter. I also installed the early exhaust manifold heat shield (to not misplace it). It seems this proves that a 1985 CA starter works in an earlier engine (or 1985 federal engine). BTW, my 1985 CA car has the 1986+ 722.4xx transmission, but apparently the post #9 link fuss about the #teeth on the starter not meshing with the torque converter ring gear is incorrect, or applies only to 300SD cars.

I have read that one can re-clock the starter so the solenoid is at the top or bottom, as needed, but no experience. One would need to do so if fitting a 1982-84 starter to a 1985 CA engine with OE trap oxidizer (or replacement part), though it might fit if Rollguy's bypass tube is used.

As part of this engine swap, I also installed a shorter (federal) exhaust down-tube and cut 1.5" off the (frame-mounted) air cleaner outlet tube to match the lower turbocharger inlet.

[300D85]

Originally Posted by BillGrissom

BTW, my 1985 CA car has the 1986+ 722.4xx transmission, but apparently the post #9 link fuss about the #teeth on the starter not meshing with the torque converter ring gear is incorrect, or applies only to 300SD cars.

Dunno the bottom line but have run across many starter ads that show both 300d & 300sd compatibility & only for 85

dunno if this part has been confirmed in any way? ..could just be a (wrong) parts mixup scenario

the difference is 11 vs 9 teeth and thus the double reduction starter won't work on it. Actually we ordered it and tried it on W Hunters 85 W126 which has the same situation as the W123 ring gear. Sure it installed ok but it just wouldn't mesh with the ring gear. We pulled it out and compared the starter gears and it looked a little funny... They didn't have the same number of teeth on the starter gears... between the starter we pulled off and the starter we tried to put on. However, we were able to mate up the double reduction starter to a 617 on a stand... but it was an earlier engine.

then? - "the double reduction starter"

I don't have access to part #s or changes that might help sort it out

[BillGrissom]

Originally Posted by 300D85

... then? - "the double reduction starter" ...

I don't know what they are talking about, I've never opened one. The 1984 and 1985 CA starters I have look identical, other than the clocking of the contactor.

Older 1960-80 Chrysler starters have a reduction gear, which fans like since the sound denotes "Chrysler". But many people install a smaller lighter starter for a later Magnum V-6/V-8 engine which fits in older engines back to 1960. It sounds different but has more torque.

[dude99]

1985 starter is the same as the rest except California 85 that had the different turbo/emissions setup on it. I believe the solenoid on that was rotated to clear the different exhaust/turbo setup.

[CDTurbo001]

Originally Posted by dude99

1985 starter is the same as the rest except California 85 that had the different turbo/emissions setup on it. I believe the solenoid on that was rotated to clear the different exhaust/turbo setup.

Correct. Solenoid points pretty much straight down on the trap-ox cars. I'm aware of no other lack of compatibility between 61x starters in the 123 chassis. (Pretty sure the original starters were stronger on turbo models, but this difference has been eliminated and the replacements are all turbo-spec now.)

[hanseich]

Thanks dude99 and CDTurbo001 for speaking the final word on this. I was super concerned about finding a new starter for my car. I had initially seen them (and no shortage), but now I couldn't find them anymore. I just realized I made the mistake of looking for 1985 300TD, which appear to all be sold out. My car is a 1985 model, but built in August 1984 (in the beginning I thought it was an 84, but some parts looked 85, ended up confirming with VIN that its a "85 model". One tell tale: my SLS fluid container is on the drivers side of the engine bay, just like any other 1985).

Long story short, I started looking for 1984 starters again, et voila, lots to chose from. I'll buy a reman ACDelco (Bosch core so it says), compare it to my original one and if it checks out, I'll use it. (I can report back if helpful to anyone).

(BTW: problem with my starter is that it needs some "love taps" to start. I could probably do a basic refurb myself and keep using it, but I'm not sure how reliable it will be, or get it rebuilt and put it on my spares shelf for latter years)