Need help selecting a Mercedes model

[MS Fowler]

Hi! I am new here.
I may be purchasing a vehicle in the not too distant future so I'm beginning some research here. Below are listed some preconceptions I have and what I THINK I want. Please feel free to not only define the MB models that meet my list, but to criticise my preconceptions themselves.
Preconceptions:
no computer--( at least not one that runs the engine or transmission)
diesel--
auto
air bags ( at least driver side but both front bags would be nice)

I think thats about it. What else should I look for, or look to avoid?

By the way, I was referred here by friends on "The DieselStop" formerly know as "Ford-diesel.com"--a really great group!

[The Warden]

Mike Fowler? Welcome aboard!!

I think some '85 300SD's were equipped with driver's side airbags, and I think all the W-124 cars have 'em, along with the '87 300SDL's. I'm not sure on that, though, and I'm not sure when M-B started incorporating passenger's side airbags.

As to computer-free engines, the 617 cast-iron 5 cyl is completely mechanical; even the fuel stop's vacuum-operated (I know, I think I've already told you this, but still... ). I don't know about the 603 6 cylinder engines; they may be computer-free or may have some minor controls. I don't think M-B got crazy on diesel electronics until the newer ('96 or '97 and up) E300's.

Auto's no problem; in fact, it's difficult to find a diesel (or any other, for that matter) Benz with a manual transmission. Manual trannies were only available on the 240D's (and the older 220D's from the early to mid '70's) in the United States.

So, in essence, it's hard to come by a Benz diesel with an airbag, except on later models (BTW, any Benz diesel built after '85 has an aluminum cylinder head, and all 190D's are aluminum-headed as well), but the other prerequisites are pretty easy to come by. I'm sure someone who knows more about the '87 and later diesels will respond shortly. One other thing to keep in mind, regarding the air bags, is that, while they're a good safety feature, the older Benzes without 'em are still very safe cars. There's been a few people on this site who have had their cars get extensively damaged in accidents but didn't suffer a scratch.

Just my $.02...good luck! And, again, welcome aboard

[dieseldude]

The size of car would be a good indicator of where we could further point you MS, but I can offer the following on the Midsize 'E-class' sizeof cars.

W123 chassis 240D, 300D, 300CD (coupe), 300TD (wagon) - ('77-'85 - the 300D models were also available with Turbo from I believe '81 and on) - arguably the most durable diesel MB every built. Many, many cars with 300Kmi+ and going strong. No computers - or very few, simple and inexpensive to work on (except for the ACC systems - which can be a caveat on any other Benz's recommended here). No airbags.

W124 chassis ('86-'95 - Turbo models in the early 90's) - much more modern and civilized - although sigifigantly more complex in terms of computers/electricals. Much higher performance although the new generation of diesel engines could be problematic due the the aluminum heads mated to cast-iron blocks. owners experiences from what I've read are "just as good as the old all-iron motors' to 'an expensive headache". Hard to know if warpage/head problems were from design or lax maintenance.
Driver's side airbag from '86 to I believe about '91-'92 when the passenger-side was an option (driver and passenger airbags standard on 93+ models).

Kinda comes down to budget and what you're willing to live with in terms of cost and refinement. I have an example of each (though my W124's gas V8 is no comparison). The chassis dynamics of the W124 are superior, but I find the W123 to still be very comfortable and pleasing to drive. The quality of materials in both is very high, thought the W123 has a heavier 'old-world' feel (like it will go a million miles).

Hope that helps get you started - other will provide myriad other choices/considerations, so good luck - and search the archives to for hours of reading of owner's experiences.

Regards,
- Ryan

[MS Fowler]

Thanks guys, thats a good start.
Are there any "normal" mileages at which certain high$ items typically fail?
For instance I have heard that Taurus' transmissions typically fail at 80,000 miles ( although I mine has 125k), and the injection pump on a Ford IDI diesel typically need replacing at 90k miles or so.
What about typical rebuild costs for the auto trans? A friend has one approaching 500k miles; its been making a noise for the last 200k miles. Pretty durable!

You won't find a diesel with airbags but no engine computer. The engine computers and airbag came in 1987. Dual airbags started as an option in 1989 and was standard in 1991. There are really no sensors relating to the engine computer that fail on models before 1995. Even though the 87-94 diesels had engine computers, you wouldn't know as nothing related to it failed, and if it did it was VERY rare. I would really not worry about this. These are not like gasoline powered cars with thier sensors and computers.

The engine and transmission will fail in relation to thier service history. I've seen engines fail at 100k miles and i've seen original engines with 850k miles, same goes for the transmissions. Just find one with a great service history.

[rwthomas1]

Airbags? Who gives a damn about airbags? Its a BENZ!! Buckle up and you will be fine. They are built like tanks. If ya want an airbag buy a KIA. Your body will get mangled but your face will look great for the open casket..... RT

[kerry]

I read a number of years ago that an extra 250 pounds of vehicle was equal to an airbag in safety. I'll take my 74 Olds Custom Cruiser over most any car with airbags if the criteria is safety, although GM cars of that vintage may have airbags. They were options at least as early as 1969.
I agree with RT. Buckle the seat belt and go for a 123.

[rdanz]

The first question is how much are you willing to spend?

Get a W123 or a W116

That is true Bill, but finding an 84 or 85 300SD with an airbag is like a needle in a haystack.

I actually don't like the fact my car has an airbag, I'm not too fond of the idea of a 16 year old airbag deploying at my head.

as far as a taurus (POS) IS CONCERNED>IF you have gottten more than 100k from the xmission, then you are WAY ahead of the game ......do NOT let the 3.8 motor overheat! the 3.0 can take a TERRIBLE beating as long as the oiul is changed HOT and FREQUENTLY.............the xmissions SUCK,,,,,EVEN w/ the factory mods..........won't last 100k!.....do you want old style auto or newer style? BIG DIFFERENCE! if anyone disagrees please speak up! 123=older style=EXTREME relialibility (w/alittle bit of luck AND SERVICE RECORDS etc.), however the newer (while still old!) 124 series HANDLE like you would have (and maybe even did) wished 70's autos (and even MERCEDES BENZ) cars would drive..........these are a little delicate concerning head gasket issues...........transmissions = SIMILAR RELIABILITY, however airbags and abs come into play! DRIVE ONE, then another and another etc.>>>>>>>compare and see what YOU ENJOY THE MOST! safety features DO count, however, any MERCEDES BENZ will hold up in a CRASH. .........USUALLY the passangers and or the driver will survive (unscathed even if luck comes into play)............good luck and keep posted with questions>>>>>>>>>>we all appreciate the newbie posts....see 'ya>>best wishes always,spo

[engatwork]

MFowler - Being in the engineering profession you will appreciate the W123 cars the most. Find a good, well maintained '82-'85 300D and you will not go wrong. Go ahead and spend the $3-4k that it will take to get a good one and you will have a car that you can drive for the rest of your life.

[240 Ed]

I can only say that the W123 is a remarkable car, for its wonderful suspension, and great packaging. Find a good one and you will enjoy it.

[turnne1]

Dual airbags started as an option in 1989 and was standard in 1991

Passenger airbags were an option on both 124 and 126 diesels in the early 90's..my 92 300D 2.5 didn't have one..but I have seen several that did

as for the car my pick would be a well cared for 90-93 300 2.5..fast, very reliable,updated interiors with most of the necessary amenities

and you should be able to get one for well under 10K

Warren
1992 300SD 157K
Columbus Ohio

[richunters]

Can't believe there isn't more support here for a 126. Early 80s 300 SD like my 84 is also reliable and durable, plus it has an edge in safety (with the weight) and luxury. If you live in any kind of hilly terrain, the turbodiesel is a must. OTOH, with a 240 I would have fewer traffic tickets.