Would you buy a vehicle without service records?

[al76slc]

I guess the 2nd question "Is would you own a vehicle and not bother to keep records?"

Just called on a 99 CLK320. Nice looking. 71K miles with some expensive appearance mods but not real valuable to me. Asking $15K. 3rd owner no records.

I know this is a slanted survey in that most of us are "car guys". But I don't get why you can't ask for records from the PO, and then keep your own.

So back to the question. Under what circumstances, if any, would you buy an expensive car without service records? (Besides if it was dirt cheap or from a relative.)

[Shawn D.]

That particular car is new enough that service records are relevant, but after a certain number of years, they become somewhat irrelevant, IMO. For example, I got no service records when I bought my '86 BMW 535i in '92 at 75K miles, and while I did take the lack of records into consideration then, I'd find it laughable if I were to sell it and had someone pressing me for said records now that fifteen more years and 250K more are on the car. I don't keep every little receipt for everything -- for example, if anyone wants proof of regular oil changes, they can do a compression check and/or look under the valve cover. Also, would it matter if it was on its third set of shocks as long as the current ones are good?

[SwampYankee]

If I were going to drop $30-40K+ on an older car I would probably like to see some service records. Then again CarFax's can be fudged right along with service records. I'm not good at all at keeping my service receipts in any order or even knowing where they are. If anyone is looking for them from me they'll be disappointed. That said, I do to my cars whatever they need to have done when they need it done. I would venture to guess that I'm easier on my vehicles than the average.

If a guy keeps meticulous service records, changes the synthetic oil every 2500 miles, keeps the vehicle pristine looking but drives (read beats) the hell out of it are those service records going to reflect the fact that the car may not be anywhere near the condition it appears to be?

While service records can be helpful they can also be over-rated. If it's a big money car, nothing beats a thorough inspection.

[softconsult]

I would not buy without records. This is not because of a few missing oil change receipts.
If you start with the assumption that there are predictable failures along the mileage curve, then doesn' it make sense to buy a car that has already had those items replaced?

Now if you are buying a farely low mileage car then those items most likely will not have failed. My approach on the last three MB has been to find a car at about 100K that fits the already replaced pattern.

For instance, my most recent purchase, '97 S320 Dealer serviced with 109K and all records. So it's had head gasket at 67K, MAS, Blower Motor Regulator, window regulators, seat belt assembly, battery, charcoal filter, windshield at 102K, rear rotors, new outside mirror. It's thousands of dollars.

'92 300E bought at 113K had something like $ 9,000 of receipts within the previous 12 months. It was serviced to death throughout it's life. Currently has 245K and it's consumed a fair amount of maintenance dollars out of my pocket.

So for me it's records, records, records. There are a lot of cars out there, why not buy one with records? Forgot to mention paint. That is the item that is pretty much not fixable, unless you want to fork over 5 to 6K.

Steve

[Pete Geither]

Bought the TE with no records, just my personal inspection. Looked and drove good and since I have owned it the repairs have been about what I figure they should be. It had 84K on it at the time.

[The Swede]

I bought my BMW 740i a few yrs. ago w/o records. No problems so far and I don't expect any except normal wear and tear.

So I guess it depends. Some cars just give you that gut feeling to stay away- like multiple owners in a short time period.

Better to have recs of course, but if not, try to have it looked over by a mechanic.

[John Doe]

Originally Posted by The Swede

I bought my BMW 740i a few yrs. ago w/o records. No problems so far and I don't expect any except normal wear and tear.

So I guess it depends. Some cars just give you that gut feeling to stay away- like multiple owners in a short time period.

Better to have recs of course, but if not, try to have it looked over by a mechanic.

Kinda roger that. I keep the print outs on my MB but mainly because it is a diesel and I don't want to lose track of what has been done. I bought the car without any records (but it was only a year old).

I have never kept meticulous records on any other car I have owned, except for a '79 911 which had very, very low miles and I knew I wouldn't have it long and wanted top dollar for it when it went.

As to the original question--yes I would and have bought cars w/o records and yes I have bought cars and not kept records

[suginami]

I have bought cars without records, but all things considered, I always prefer that they have records.

It comes down to a gut feeling. If the car is clean and appears well maintained it usually is. It has to drive nice and everything should work.

[The Swede]

Yep, gut feeling.

After one becomes familiar with a particular marque/model, you can spot serious issues in a matter of minutes.

If you have a good eye and ear, that can go a long way. At the least, it's a staring point in the used car purchase process that can eliminate trouble almost immediately.

[Hatterasguy]

The only car I ever bought with records was my Camry from my uncle. He is a car guy so he wrote everything down in the service book. They are nice to have it lets you know when things were last done.

The 300SD was bought from a family friend and had no records, but I know him and he took care of it within reason. So far it has been dead nuts reliable.

The SDL was bought as a project car with no records and thats what I got.

I keep very complete records, both of my cars have a binder. Its the only way I can remember what was done when, I think its the German in me. Everything is written down!

Anyway know the car and know what to look for. I'm pretty comfortable with MB's and have helped friends buy them. I helped my friend buy an S320 a couple years ago and while it had no records it was taken care off pretty well. You can tell by looking at them. As said above you need to get that feeling, its hard to explain but some cars and sellers just give it off.

[Jim B.]

Just try buying any used car from any auto dealer with "records" included.

They throw them out before selling the car, even if they are there, at best you'll get the stamped service books.

They won't even let you look at the previous title on the car. That service is part of the DMV "processing fee" you get to pay when you buy from a dealer. All the above to supposedly protect the "privacy" of the prior owners.

All things being equal I would rather have the full records, as full knowledge of the car's history is important to me. I have mostly bought used cars without them but not because I wanted to.

[softconsult]

Just try buying any used car from any auto dealer with "records" included.

I have purchased 4 used Mercedes Benz cars in the last 10 years. All from independent dealer lots. All had extensive records, receipts. So I guess your statement isn't always true. All were happy to use them as a selling point. 3 were located in NE Tennessee, but one was located in Manchester, NH. The NH car was an e-bay whim. The car was a '93 300E Sportline with 250K on the clock. When I picked it up and then stopped to eat that night, I went through two folders full of Dealer receipts. The total was $36,000 of receipts. I still have trouble believing it.

Steve

[BENZ-LGB]

Complete (or nearly complete) records is just one factor in the equation.

Complete records tell me how fastidious the PO has been about the car. Records also tell me when certain items, that need replacement at certain intervals, have been attended to.

I'd also try to get a VMI. A VMI can tell you whether certain items were troublesome during the car's warranty period. It also gives you a complete list of options and the engine/tranny numbers.

You can only get a VMI from the dealer, so try to cultivate a good relaitonship with a local SA. I regularly send my local SA tins of cookies, boxes of bagels (with cream cheese of course) and other goodies.

So, my advice when buying a used Benz is to get the following items (in order of importance):

1. PPI

2. VMI

3. Service records

4. CarFax (although as mnay of you have suggested, a CarFax can often be pretty useless).

Also, read up as much as you can in the model that you are interested in. That way you know what to look for.

And, finally, pray to the car gods that after all of your work you have not missed something.

Case in point:

When I bought my 300CE I thought I had checked everything.

Well, I missed something.

Seems like the previous-0PO had ALL the locks replaced in the car when it was (apparently) broken into a while back ago.

Theree was nothing on the extensive records that I reviewed, or in the PPI, to indicate that this kind of work had been done.

I found out about it when I had Enrique order me a new ignition tumbler ($90 plus a new key). The original tumbler was a little "loose" and "giggly." Having seen this problem in previous W126s and W124s I knew that it was best to change it, before it broke off and I'd have to incur major repairs costs.

Well, when the new tumbler came it turned out that the new key did not work on any of th elocks. Since the tumbler is matched to the VIN, we knew that we had the right new key, and it was the other locks that were wrong.

Fortunatley, it did not cost much to have all the locks re-keyed to match the original VIN and key.

Still, it was something that all my due diligence could catch!

[BENZ-LGB]

Originally Posted by Hatterasguy

I keep very complete records, both of my cars have a binder. Its the only way I can remember what was done when, I think its the German in me. Everything is written down!

No, it is the anal in you.

I am not German, but I keep complete records in all our cars.

We have six cars and all have complete files/binders.

Hell, maybe I am German!

[Hatterasguy]

Originally Posted by BENZ-LGB

No, it is the anal in you.

I am not German, but I keep complete records in all our cars.

We have six cars and all have complete files/binders.

Hell, maybe I am German!

If I buy a $.50 bushing for my car, its noted and the receipt is saved.