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-   -   Frontline on For-Profit Universities (http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/off-topic-discussion/276882-frontline-profit-universities.html)

kerry 08-18-2010 07:16 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by aklim (Post 2528139)
There are 2 other people at fault.

I assume that the student is of legal age and therefore has to assume responsibility for his/her actions. After all, she/he does reap the benefits of a right decision so why not the bad? She he/she not be responsible for the lack of research into what the college is about?

Then there is the loan agency. When I loan you money, do I simply give it without any safeguards? I should be checking out what you want the money for. IOW, just because you say it is a restaurant doesn't mean I must give it to you. I should be checking out what your business plan is. If your restaurant plans to have a squid only menu, I probably won't want to lend the money. OTOH, if it is a McDonnalds, sure. It is the lender's responsibility to see what they are lending the student for so that they know what their odds of repayment are.

Sure, it is convenient to blame the bad institute. Nobody put a gun to your head and make you sign there. Even if you do, you might need to quite before screwing up your life further if it is a bad mistake you suddenly had an epiphany and realized what happened.
I'll be that close examination will discover that students at for-profit schools are far more likely to be the first child in their family ever to go to college. Their parents typically have no idea at all how to make a wise choice of a college. Add to this the fact that the for-profits will be repeatedly calling the family and public schools will almost never call the house, and the system is set up for serious exploitation of the uneducated family.

aklim 08-18-2010 07:17 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by cmac2012 (Post 2528145)
True enough all in all. But the main point of trouble in this story, IMO, is the linkage that allowed U of Ph. etc. to get the feds to back up student loans. If UofPh is do damn certain of the value of their "education," let the loans be on their backs. Let the quality of their product stand on its own feet.

Ought to be some serious hearings on this and a seizing of some of those large fortune$ amassed by the con artists pushing these scams.
But what of the other component? Just because I educate you well doesn't mean you will succeed. Could be you are an azzhole and nobody wants to hire you. Could be bad luck to buy into an industry that collapses.

How about some serious punishments for the students for sticking their necks out into stupid areas? Or are you saying that they are not culpable or responsible for their own actions.

aklim 08-18-2010 07:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by kerry (Post 2528169)
I'll be that close examination will discover that students at for-profit schools are far more likely to be the first child in their family ever to go to college. Their parents typically have no idea at all how to make a wise choice of a college. Add to this the fact that the for-profits will be repeatedly calling the family and public schools will almost never call the house, and the system is set up for serious exploitation of the uneducated family.
Maybe but nobody put a gun to their head so who is responsible for your kid going to a proper school if not you and him? Assuming both are adults?

kerry 08-18-2010 07:32 PM
It's easy to call someone an adult. Quite a different thing for a person to have the wherewithal to act as an adult.
This inability is exactly what the salespeople from the for-profits count on.

The Clk Man 08-18-2010 07:40 PM
Here's my take on colleges. The government should provide a college education to every American who want's it and is willing to work hard. Other countries do this and American wonders why that our young adults are the dumbest young people on earth. It's now wonder that our Country is being taken over. Complacency will destroy AMERICA, trust me. :mad:

davidmash 08-18-2010 07:55 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Clk Man (Post 2528190)
Here's my take on colleges. The government should provide a college education to every American who want's it and is willing to work hard. Other countries do this and American wonders why that our young adults are the dumbest young people on earth. It's now wonder that our Country is being taken over. Complacency will destroy AMERICA, trust me. :mad:
Agreed. The kids are our future and we are not giving them the tools to succeed.

The Clk Man 08-18-2010 07:58 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by davidmash (Post 2528196)
Agreed. The kids are our future and we are not giving them the tools to succeed.
Agreed Sir. :)

Hatterasguy 08-18-2010 08:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Clk Man (Post 2528190)
Here's my take on colleges. The government should provide a college education to every American who want's it and is willing to work hard. Other countries do this and American wonders why that our young adults are the dumbest young people on earth. It's now wonder that our Country is being taken over. Complacency will destroy AMERICA, trust me. :mad:
Yep, although state schools are just about doing that. My education was pretty reasonable.

davidmash 08-18-2010 08:20 PM
I find it humorous that people will argue about killing the future when referring to abortion but once the little rats are out of the womb no one seems to care all that much. These kids are going to be the future of our nation like it or not. I say we give the kids every opportunity we can to become the best they can be. One of them might come up with some answers to questions we have. The wider net we cast the better chance we have of catching a live one.

davidmash 08-18-2010 08:27 PM
These are the fees that UT charges for one semester. I think it puts the education out of reach for most. I would like to see a community service option for repaying the debt to society. This country needs a lot of help and work. There is not reason that we cannot use the labor from our graduates to help out.

Hatterasguy 08-18-2010 10:36 PM
I think a forced 2 years in the military or if they object peace corps would do a lot of young people a lot of good.

tonkovich 08-18-2010 10:45 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hatterasguy (Post 2528282)
I think a forced 2 years in the military or if they object peace corps would do a lot of young people a lot of good.
yes, it would teach them.... about america's freedoms? uh, make it easier for us to keep invading countries and then getting stuck in a quagmire?

i think a seizure of half the wealth of the richest , say, 5%, to pay for education (and health care and infrastructure) would work out well for everyone, even the rich i.e. bill gates, 30 billion instead of 60 billion, no tears for him. sadly, no one seems to go for this idea, because...? we're a nation which values money (and the pursuit thereof) over all other things? even children and the future?

cmac2012 08-18-2010 10:48 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Clk Man (Post 2528190)
Here's my take on colleges. The government should provide a college education to every American who wants it and is willing to work hard. Other countries do this and American wonders why that our young adults are the dumbest young people on earth. It's now wonder that our Country is being taken over. Complacency will destroy AMERICA, trust me. :mad:
If it was carefully monitored so that deadbeats were given the boot and people weren't studying Boo-$h!t on the public dime it would probably be a solid investment in the future. Some say that the WW2 GI bill had a huge affect on our post war prosperity as many of those people would never have gone to college w/o it.

As it is now, people pile up huge debts and many of them have only the barest clue about what would be good to study. You read too many horror stories of people paying $500 to $1000 a month for student loans and their education is not worth that kind of money on the market. Vocational ed shouldn't be the ONLY reason for higher ed. but huge debts one cannot pay can't be good for anyone.

aklim 08-18-2010 11:25 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by kerry (Post 2528184)
It's easy to call someone an adult. Quite a different thing for a person to have the wherewithal to act as an adult.
This inability is exactly what the salespeople from the for-profits count on.
Those people DEMAND to be treated as adults. It would be like you want to be an adult when it comes to getting goodies but when it comes to responsibilities, you are a kid. So at what point are they an adult and responsible for their actions? When they are 65?

Hatterasguy 08-18-2010 11:26 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tonkovich (Post 2528290)
yes, it would teach them.... about america's freedoms? uh, make it easier for us to keep invading countries and then getting stuck in a quagmire?
Insted of fighting amoungst themselves people need to be taught to serve their country regardless of their social standing. Who said anything about war?


BTW the richest already pay for everything. Try keeping up with things, Bill Gates along with many other very wealthy people are donating just about all their money to charity. Warren Buffet is donating every penny. Your communist ideas wouldn't fix anything, except give the government more money to waste.


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