Who will win in the end?

[The Clk Man]

The users and corporations or the everyday working man and woman? I know, do you?

[tonkovich]

corporations. (but they'll kill the goose)

[MS Fowler]

False dichotomy.
It works when corporation produce products that consumers need, want, and purchase.
Its a win-win.
It is not a closed system as you assume.

[MTUpower]

Good will win for awhile, then Evil win triumph until Good returns. May the Force be with you.

[dannym]

Originally Posted by MS Fowler

False dichotomy.
It works when corporation produce products that consumers need, want, and purchase.
Its a win-win.
It is not a closed system as you assume.

True, but the consumers need to be able to afford the products being produced.

One of the reasons for the great depression was the products being made were out of reach for the average person.
When real earnings turn to speculation your in trouble.

I vote for corporations. Things really need to change or were in trouble. Wages need to be in line with cost of living.
How do you live on minimum wage?

Danny

[Mike D]

(\__/)
(='.'=) This is Bunny. Copy and paste bunny into your
(")_(") signature to help him gain world domination



Hmmm, seems to me you have already made your choice

[Kuan]

What is work anyway these days? Does sitting around in a meeting thinking up ways to overpromise and underdeliver count as work?

[MS Fowler]

Originally Posted by dannym

True, but the consumers need to be able to afford the products being produced.

One of the reasons for the great depression was the products being made were out of reach for the average person.
When real earnings turn to speculation your in trouble.

I vote for corporations. Things really need to change or were in trouble. Wages need to be in line with cost of living.
How do you live on minimum wage?

Danny

No one is supposed to live on minimum wage. Who ever told you that?
Minimum wage is a "training wage". Once an employee has demonstrated his ability, and reliability to management, they should get a raise. Its in the company's best interest to keep good, experienced employees.
If there is no advancement beyond minimum wage, find a different employer.

Some jobs will always be minimum wage jobs--jobs that require little training, and where experience does not help productivity--like sweeping the floor--how much better is a floor sweeper with 10 years' experience over a novice?

[RichC]

I think my signature line answers the question.

[strelnik]

Originally Posted by Kuan

What is work anyway these days? Does sitting around in a meeting thinking up ways to overpromise and underdeliver count as work?

YES! It's called AMERICAN MARKETING!

[Kuan]

Originally Posted by MS Fowler

-how much better is a floor sweeper with 10 years' experience over a novice?

YOu had to ask.

[Kuan]

Lemme toss this out though. I have a friend who is a progammer. He actually works just one hour a day. The rest of the day he plays video games and uses facebook. His bosses love him. He gets it all done in that hour and sometimes more. To his bean counter superiors what he does is extremely complex because they have no idea what it takes and how he does it. All this for over $100k a year. Is that work?

[MS Fowler]

One definition of pay is that the more people you make happy ( or their lives improve) the better you are paid.
That programmer makes MANY people "happy" so he is well paid.

Originally Posted by Kuan

Lemme toss this out though. I have a friend who is a progammer. He actually works just one hour a day. The rest of the day he plays video games and uses facebook. His bosses love him. He gets it all done in that hour and sometimes more. To his bean counter superiors what he does is extremely complex because they have no idea what it takes and how he does it. All this for over $100k a year. Is that work?

We all have seen people who get away with this for a while, but at some point it will end. Eventually, his situation will change and he will end up with someone who actually understands his job paying attention to his productivity (or lack of productivity); or (more likely) some outside company will offer to do that work for less than his salary and his job will be outsourced. He would be better off using some of that "free time" to figure out how to make himself indispensable to his employer and/or to look for his next job.

Originally Posted by MS Fowler

One definition of pay is that the more people you make happy ( or their lives improve) the better you are paid.
That programmer makes MANY people "happy" so he is well paid.

Very true; your pay is not usually related to how "hard" you work, it's related to your perceived value to your boss (i.e., making your boss look good on a regular basis).