Piano purchasing advice - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

suginami · #1 03-05-2011, 03:17 PM

I am looking at upgrading our piano at home.

My wife and the twins play the piano, and we have an old and tired console piano circa 1970 that was given to us as a gift about 15 years ago.

We are shopping for a baby grand, and have settled on either Boston or Kawai.

Boston pianos are designed by Steinway and built by Kawai in Japan.

The Kawai is the model GE20. It's 5'1", and is a leftover model from 2010. The price last year was $22,195, and they are selling it for $12,098.

I don't have the Boston piano number handy, but it is a used model from 1999, and it is on sale for about $13,000.

My wife has tried the Yamaha pianos, and finds the sound is too bright.

The Kawai, and in particular, the Boston models we have tried before, have a very warm and rich tone.

Any advice?

Matt L · #2 03-05-2011, 03:21 PM

Just a question or two.

Do those new prices include tuning the piano after delivery? And what does it cost to tune a piano these days?

suginami · #3 03-05-2011, 03:55 PM

The prices include delivery, set-up, and tuning.

Kuan · #4 03-05-2011, 04:15 PM

Couple things. Sonically I think at 5'1" you're better off getting an upright. The brightness is due to the voicing. That can be tweaked by a piano technician. Also go get a copy of Larry Fine'sThe Piano Book and read the first three chapters.

The Swede · #5 03-05-2011, 04:16 PM

My parents have a K. Kawai grand. They bought it in 1980 and it was played a regular basis for many years. Kawai's have a great rep and are considered a good value. I think it gets tuned every year, even when it's not played often.

mgburg · #6 03-05-2011, 05:49 PM

Best place to go to get a tuner...try the local University's Music Department, and make sure it's the Instructor himself...not a "newbie" tuner.

At least, when I was studying Music, we had a whole semester on Piano Tuning - the instructor had everyone go out a buy the beginners' set of tuning wrenches, felts and related gear...then we set about "destroying" and re-furbishing the pianos in all the practice rooms in the building (about 20 or so)...it's not that hard once you're working on it...but you need the ear for it.

But, be sure you have the Instructor, not a student do your piano...as students, we took a long time to get it right...and the Instructor always came along and "re-tweaked" what we did...unless you're doing this as part of your living...weekend "piano tuners" are about on par with shade-tree mechanics...we get it "running" (or in the ball-partk) but I wouldn't race it at the Daytona 500.

And, I'd leave the piano in the room a few days before going anywhere near it with a tuning bar/wrench. Just let the strings and sounding board get acclimated to its new location first...but since you already own a piano, you already know the reason for that!

Good luck with your upgrade....

suginami · #7 03-05-2011, 06:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kuan

Couple things. Sonically I think at 5'1" you're better off getting an upright. The brightness is due to the voicing. That can be tweaked by a piano technician. Also go get a copy of Larry Fine'sThe Piano Book and read the first three chapters.

You can't convince my wife to get an upright. She's always wanted a grand piano.

And what's more, she says it'll look good in the family room.

I've done a google search, and it confirms that Yamaha's have a reputation for brightness.

The twins use a Kawai RX-7 at their piano teacher's house, and it is a very high-end piano that sounds incredible.

We were hot and heavy for a Kawai, until we stumbled on the Boston brand. Since it is made at Kawai's best piano factory by their most highly trained craftsmen, it gets her seal of approval. And due to it's design and engineering by Steinway, it has an incredibly rich and warm sound, especially on the lower octaves.

Kuan · #8 03-05-2011, 06:25 PM

Can I convince you to go at least with a 5' 6" or larger grand then?

suginami · #9 03-05-2011, 06:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kuan

Can I convince you to go at least with a 5' 6" or larger grand then?

Why is 5'6" the magic size?

We are also looking at a completely refurbished 5'7" 1962 Steinway model "M" in mahogany that is stunningly beautiful....but they are asking $27,000 for it.

sfloriII · #10 03-05-2011, 06:44 PM

My mom had a Kawai grand piano that she played and loved for years. It was the smallest of the grands. Now it's in my sister's house being ignored.

Kuan · #11 03-05-2011, 07:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by suginami

Why is 5'6" the magic size?

We are also looking at a completely refurbished 5'7" 1962 Steinway model "M" in mahogany that is stunningly beautiful....but they are asking $27,000 for it.

Essentially it's the length of the bass strings.

Larry Fine places the level of performance of a medium above the full size upright. By his definition, medium grand starts at 5'6". Of course this is Larry Fine's opinion. I haven't compared every full upright to every medium grand but I trust he's in the ballpark.

Also, re: Steinway, there are many pianos which are just as good and if not better for half the money. A midsize Mason Hamlin comes to mind. Great American craftsmanship (if you're into that) and they are voiced a certain way so they have a warm "Mason Hamlin" sound.

Pooka · #12 03-05-2011, 07:47 PM

Look for a used Sohmer. There is a Wikipedia page about them that you should look at before you buy anything.

Sohmer invented the Baby Grand and their key boarad actions were made by Steinway.

The older ones are the best, but a bit of research will lead you to the one that is right for you.

This is a little known brand and god examples are out there for less than $5,000.

my83300cd · #13 03-05-2011, 10:46 PM

We have a Chickering, from the 50's. My wife and son play, and she uses it to teach voice. We've moved it three times in 10 years, tuned it a few weeks after being moved each time, and it holds tune very well.

Go play the piano you are looking at several times- the action can be different from the showroom piece to the one delivered.

Grands take up a lot of room- you can't really shove them against a wall.

If you dont play, the lid when down makes for a great stand up desk.

layback40 · #14 03-06-2011, 05:13 AM

This may sound a little simple but the weight of it is critical. The stronger & heavier the frame, the better the sound & the ability to hold tune. A cast iron frame is best. If the casting is only light, it may disappoint you down the track a few years.

Kuan · #15 03-06-2011, 09:30 AM

From http://www.pianobuyer.com/fall10/16.html

Quote:

Grand Piano pianos are measured with the lid closed from the very front of the piano (keyboard end) to the very back (the tail). Lengths start at 4' 6" and go to over 10' (even longer in some experimental models). Widths are usually around 5' and heights around 3', but only the length has a bearing on musical quality.

Grands less than 5' long are the musical equivalent of spinets and consoles; that is, they are musically compromised and are mainly sold as pieces of furniture. Grands between about 5' and 5 1/2' are very popular. Although slightly compromised, they can reasonably serve both musical and furniture functions and are available in many furniture styles. (By the way, piano professionals prefer the term small grand to baby grand. Although there is no exact definition, a small grand is generally one less than about 5 1/2' long.) Above 5 1/2', pianos rapidly improve, becoming professional quality at about 6'. Pianos intended for the home or serious professional top out at about 7' or 7 1/2'. These sizes may also satisfy the needs of smaller concert venues. Larger venues require concert grands, usually about 9' long.