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okyoureabeast 05-24-2011 12:03 PM

Hey lawyers in the house
 
I'm coming up to my senior year of my undergraduate career and I want to continue my education. So a few months ago I started flirting with practice GREs and LSAT questions. However, the GRE just really reminds me of an old test I took a little over five years ago

I've always been turned off to the GREs. There's nothing more uncomfortable than a test that is similar to the SAT. I did poorly on the SAT considering how well my overall high school GPA was. However, college wasn't so kind to me and my GPA is a less than stellar 3.1. I can definitely pull that sucker up higher this fall so I'm not too worried.

However, I really have taken a liking to these LSAT questions. It reminds me a lot of my discrete mathematics class and the mental reasoning behind them makes sense. I've done quiet well on everything except the games (obviously).

I have a practice book and have been working through it, but what else can I do to practice for these games? Any type of precision reading/unwarranted assumption drills I should look at?

tbomachines 05-24-2011 12:10 PM

GREs aren't that bad! There are more people with law degrees than positions out there, even the ABA knows it and has admitted it. I know many J.D.s with no job at the moment.

kerry 05-24-2011 12:24 PM

I used to teach an undergraduate informal logic class that typically had lots of students using it to prep for the LSAT's. So any informal logic textbook or critical thinking textbook or class should be helpful on the LSAT's.

dynalow 05-24-2011 12:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tbomachines (Post 2723410)
GREs aren't that bad! There are more people with law degrees than positions out there, even the ABA knows it and has admitted it. I know many J.D.s with no job at the moment.

And I know a few who probably shouldn't even be "practicing" law. ;)

Lt. Kaffee: "I forgot. You were sick the day they taught law at Law school!":rolleyes:


How's the place across the tracks doing these days (post USNWR cheating revelations)? Applications down?

Jim B. 05-24-2011 12:50 PM

a question on the California State Bar Examination
 
This was revealed to us in the early 1970's in a law school class

Usually these questions are closely guarded by the State Bar but this one was let out.



~~~~

A terrible storm was raging in the city and around. Visibility was very poor and the roads wee extremely wet and slick. Two automobiles were speeding down 2 different streets. The driver of the first car was speeding. The second driver was not speeding but was driving in violation of a statute which stated you may not drive while intoxicated.

The storm knocked out power in some areas but where these two streets intersected, power was not knocked out but the storm had damaged the street light controls such that the traffic lights in BOTH directions now both showed GREEN.

The municipality's traffic department had been notified of this condition at this intersection 3 hours earlier but had not sent out a crew or done anything else yet to rectify this condition..

The two drivers arrived at the intersection at the same time.


BOOM !!!! There was a HUGE crash.



DISCUSS.

dynalow 05-24-2011 01:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kerry (Post 2723419)
I used to teach an undergraduate informal logic class that typically had lots of students using it to prep for the LSAT's. So any informal logic textbook or critical thinking textbook or class should be helpful on the LSAT's.

I took the law boards a looong time ago. A friend of mine whose two older brothers had gone on to law school asked me after the test how I thought I did. I said I didn't think I did too bad for taking it cold. He said you probably didn't do too well in that case. The easier you thought you did, so he said, the less successful you were likely to be. I ended up with an average score.

Back then the multiple choice questions were in sections, iirc. Fact pattern, then 4 choices. Next question, different fact pattern, 4 choices, but answer not to be inconsistent with previous answer(s). Tough sledding.:o

dynalow 05-24-2011 01:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim B. (Post 2723441)
This was revealed to us in the early 1970's in a law school class

Usually these questions are closely guarded by the State Bar but this one was let out.



~~~~

A terrible storm was raging in the city and around. Visibility was very poor and the roads wee extremely wet and slick. Two automobiles were speeding down 2 different streets. The driver of the first car was speeding. The second driver was not speeding but was driving in violation of a statute which stated you may not drive while intoxicated.

The storm knocked out power in some areas but where these two streets intersected, power was not knocked out but the storm had damaged the street light controls such that the traffic lights in BOTH directions now both showed GREEN.

The municipality's traffic department had been notified of this condition at this intersection 3 hours earlier but had not sent out a crew or done anything else yet to rectify this condition..

The two drivers arrived at the intersection at the same time.


BOOM !!!! There was a HUGE crash.



DISCUSS.

First, a question.
How liberal was the Bench in CA in the 1970's?

Well now. What's wrong with the contributory negligence theory being applied to each driver and the state not being reponsible for acts of nature? No winners. Lawyers only losers.
Judge Wapner rules.:P
Da Peoples Court.

lutzTD 05-24-2011 01:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim B. (Post 2723441)
This was revealed to us in the early 1970's in a law school class

Usually these questions are closely guarded by the State Bar but this one was let out.



~~~~

A terrible storm was raging in the city and around. Visibility was very poor and the roads wee extremely wet and slick. Two automobiles were speeding down 2 different streets. The driver of the first car was speeding. The second driver was not speeding but was driving in violation of a statute which stated you may not drive while intoxicated.

The storm knocked out power in some areas but where these two streets intersected, power was not knocked out but the storm had damaged the street light controls such that the traffic lights in BOTH directions now both showed GREEN.

The municipality's traffic department had been notified of this condition at this intersection 3 hours earlier but had not sent out a crew or done anything else yet to rectify this condition..

The two drivers arrived at the intersection at the same time.


BOOM !!!! There was a HUGE crash.



DISCUSS.

DUI trumps

tbomachines 05-24-2011 04:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dynalow (Post 2723439)
And I know a few who probably shouldn't even be "practicing" law. ;)

Lt. Kaffee: "I forgot. You were sick the day they taught law at Law school!":rolleyes:


How's the place across the tracks doing these days (post USNWR cheating revelations)? Applications down?

As far as I know they're still doing okay but have dropped in rank. After the former dean was arrested in a prostitution ring and guilty of weird condescending emails along with the USNWR fiaso its definitely a big black eye on the whole school. My friends on the program say their classes are still full so I guess its doing well enough.

dynalow 05-24-2011 05:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tbomachines (Post 2723588)
As far as I know they're still doing okay but have dropped in rank. After the former dean was arrested in a prostitution ring and guilty of weird condescending emails along with the USNWR fiaso its definitely a big black eye on the whole school. My friends on the program say their classes are still full so I guess its doing well enough.

Zackly what we need -- more lawyers.;)

Joseph_Conrad 05-24-2011 07:18 PM

I think the best thing you can do to prepare for the lsat is take a lot of practice lsats. I took a prep course before I took the test and I did just fine. The prep course basically consisted of 10 practice tests, three of which we took in a simulated testing environment. Don't listen to the people who say they didn't need to study and still did really well, they're not the norm. You can improve your scores on all of those standardized tests by studying.

I never ended up applying to law school, but I don't think you can ever go wrong with more education. I worked at a law firm for awhile and my experience there was partly to blame for dissuading me from applying to law school. It was a small firm and the lawyers there were the most unhappy people I think I've ever met.

Yak 05-24-2011 09:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim B. (Post 2723441)

~~~~

A terrible storm was raging in the city and around. Visibility was very poor and the roads wee extremely wet and slick. Two automobiles were speeding down 2 different streets. The driver of the first car was speeding. The second driver was not speeding but was driving in violation of a statute which stated you may not drive while intoxicated.

The storm knocked out power in some areas but where these two streets intersected, power was not knocked out but the storm had damaged the street light controls such that the traffic lights in BOTH directions now both showed GREEN.

The municipality's traffic department had been notified of this condition at this intersection 3 hours earlier but had not sent out a crew or done anything else yet to rectify this condition..

The two drivers arrived at the intersection at the same time.


BOOM !!!! There was a HUGE crash.


DISCUSS.

What's to discuss? Is someone alleging someone else did something? Is there a police report? Was someone charged? The facts are contradictory. Initially two cars were speeding, but then only one car was speeding. How was it verified that a driver was intoxicated? Who manufactured the faulty traffic controls since they're supposed to default to red, not green? Was a Toyota involved with unintended acceleration? Do the drivers have lawyers yet?

mgburg 05-26-2011 01:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim B. (Post 2723441)
This was revealed to us in the early 1970's in a law school class

Usually these questions are closely guarded by the State Bar but this one was let out.

~~~~

A terrible storm was raging in the city and around. Visibility was very poor and the roads were extremely wet and slick. Two automobiles were speeding down 2 different streets. The driver of the first car was speeding. The second driver was not speeding but was driving in violation of a statute which stated you may not drive while intoxicated.

The storm knocked out power in some areas but where these two streets intersected, power was not knocked out but the storm had damaged the street light controls such that the traffic lights in BOTH directions now both showed GREEN.

The municipality's traffic department had been notified of this condition at this intersection 3 hours earlier but had not sent out a crew or done anything else yet to rectify this condition..

The two drivers arrived at the intersection at the same time.

BOOM !!!! There was a HUGE crash.


DISCUSS.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Driver #1: Speeding - Determination made by which method?
Driver #2: DUI - Determination made by On-The-Scene LEOs.
Malfunctioning Street Lights - Not an issue in this circumstance.
MTD: ***** happens. Union CBA allows days to repair lights...get over it.

Short and sweet?

Driver 2 gets ticketed/arrested for DUI/Property Damage/Driving Against Court Orders/Violation of Probation-Court orders to consume no alcohol while under jurisdiction of court and/or probation control.

Driver #1: Ticket for "Driving Too Fast For Conditions."

Malf. SLs: They get fixed AFTER the storm.

MTD: See Union CBA Lawyers and enjoy the dance on the pin-head.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

:D :rolleyes: :cool:

Local2ED 05-26-2011 08:09 AM

:musicbooh:musicbooh:musicbooh:musicbooh:musicbooh:silly::silly::silly::musicbooh:musicbooh:musicboo h:musicbooh:musicbooh:musicbooh
Quote:

Originally Posted by mgburg (Post 2724495)
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~



Driver #1: Speeding - Determination made by which method?
Driver #2: DUI - Determination made by On-The-Scene LEOs.
Malfunctioning Street Lights - Not an issue in this circumstance.
MTD: ***** happens. Union CBA allows days to repair lights...get over it.

Short and sweet?

Driver 2 gets ticketed/arrested for DUI/Property Damage/Driving Against Court Orders/Violation of Probation-Court orders to consume no alcohol while under jurisdiction of court and/or probation control.

Driver #1: Ticket for "Driving Too Fast For Conditions."

Malf. SLs: They get fixed AFTER the storm.

MTD: See Union CBA Lawyers and enjoy the dance on the pin-head.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


:D :rolleyes: :cool:


Kuan 05-26-2011 08:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim B. (Post 2723441)
This was revealed to us in the early 1970's in a law school class

Usually these questions are closely guarded by the State Bar but this one was let out.



~~~~

A terrible storm was raging in the city and around. Visibility was very poor and the roads wee extremely wet and slick. Two automobiles were speeding down 2 different streets. The driver of the first car was speeding. The second driver was not speeding but was driving in violation of a statute which stated you may not drive while intoxicated.

The storm knocked out power in some areas but where these two streets intersected, power was not knocked out but the storm had damaged the street light controls such that the traffic lights in BOTH directions now both showed GREEN.

The municipality's traffic department had been notified of this condition at this intersection 3 hours earlier but had not sent out a crew or done anything else yet to rectify this condition..

The two drivers arrived at the intersection at the same time.


BOOM !!!! There was a HUGE crash.



DISCUSS.


Typical lawyer question with incomplete information and a storm thrown in just to obfuscate matters. You need the speed of both automobiles and the distance between them. After that the solution is simply a matter of summing the series.


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