Brake Pedal Lacks Firmness. Not sure what next to do... - Page 2 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

oldsinner111 · #16 10-30-2012, 01:37 PM

the only way I can get a firm pedal.Is take a 2X4,and wedge the brake pedal down,and the other end to the seat.Leave it this way overnight.Repeat until pedal is firm.Mercedes are hard to bleed than any car I've had.

MBeige · #17 10-30-2012, 03:54 PM

I drove my mechanic's 300TE one day and noticed the brakes felt different. Similar feeling I got from my mother's 300TE. So I asked him about it and he confirmed he used Akebono brake pads (ceramic). My mother's 300TE has the same. So does my 300D. They all feel similar.

In contrast, the 190E has standard Textars.

whunter · #18 10-30-2012, 04:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JamesDean

Can you elaborate on this likely damage? I did make sure my buddy had a foot behind the pedal so that it did not fully go to the floor.

this is what can happen.
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JamesDean · #19 10-30-2012, 06:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MBeige

I drove my mechanic's 300TE one day and noticed the brakes felt different. Similar feeling I got from my mother's 300TE. So I asked him about it and he confirmed he used Akebono brake pads (ceramic). My mother's 300TE has the same. So does my 300D. They all feel similar.

In contrast, the 190E has standard Textars.

Different how exactly? I've got the same Akebono ceramics. I'm not sure whats on the 300D but I like them.

JamesDean · #20 10-30-2012, 06:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by whunter

this is what can happen.
Ford Truck Enthusiasts Forums - View Single Post - 1995 E350 7.3 DI turbo turbo, no power, stalls at normal operating temp

.

Thanks for that. I was curious. The master is brand new so there should be no corroded/unused parts to damage seals as that poster indicated. I did have my friend place his foot behind the pedal to ensure that the pedal did not travel excessively.

The combined reverse bleed and 2-man procedure has had good results. I will, this weekend, perform a full bleed. Yesterday I had only done the fronts.

Adler · #21 10-30-2012, 11:36 PM

[QUOTE]the only way I can get a firm pedal.Is take a 2X4,and wedge the brake pedal down,and the other end to the seat.Leave it this way overnight..

I would suggest this very method ,works every time for a difficult clutch bleed too; Most likely compresses air bubbles together to a bleedable level .
I had used a pressure bleed but still required the above mentioned 2x4" assist to get a firm pedal!

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MBeige · #22 10-31-2012, 12:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JamesDean

Different how exactly? I've got the same Akebono ceramics. I'm not sure whats on the 300D but I like them.

Not exactly sure how to describe it, but I can seem to tell if it's using them based on the brake pedal feedback upon braking, especially if I am wearing thin-soled shoes.

It feels like the Akebono ceramics have more "give" to them and require a little bit more effort to get the same braking effect desired when doing the same on stock OEM brakes. They will still stop the car great, however, but the feedback is different. This is why I suggested using stock pads and see if it makes a difference.

Have you tried applying maximum braking force on the Akebonos?

JamesDean · #23 10-31-2012, 08:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MBeige

Not exactly sure how to describe it, but I can seem to tell if it's using them based on the brake pedal feedback upon braking, especially if I am wearing thin-soled shoes.

It feels like the Akebono ceramics have more "give" to them and require a little bit more effort to get the same braking effect desired when doing the same on stock OEM brakes. They will still stop the car great, however, but the feedback is different. This is why I suggested using stock pads and see if it makes a difference.

Have you tried applying maximum braking force on the Akebonos?

I would agree with your assessment of the Akebono's. Compared to my other cars they do seem to have more "give". Applying maximum braking force does indeed stop the car quickly. It just doesnt have the pedal response that I prefer. I have not tried the stock pads yet.

Air&Road · #24 11-02-2012, 03:19 PM

James, I did not read the rest of the thread, but I would find a helper that is attentive and reliable and bleed the brakes with the two man method while engine is running.

This has solved the issue you describe many times for me, when doing lots of work on the brake system and having bleeding problems.

Best of luck with it.

JamesDean · #25 11-02-2012, 03:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Air&Road

James, I did not read the rest of the thread, but I would find a helper that is attentive and reliable and bleed the brakes with the two man method while engine is running.

This has solved the issue you describe many times for me, when doing lots of work on the brake system and having bleeding problems.

Best of luck with it.

Interesting, I've never considering doing it with the engine running. Can you explain more of the procedure for that? I would imagine its similar to the normal method.

MBeige · #26 11-02-2012, 11:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JamesDean

I would agree with your assessment of the Akebono's. Compared to my other cars they do seem to have more "give". Applying maximum braking force does indeed stop the car quickly. It just doesnt have the pedal response that I prefer. I have not tried the stock pads yet.

I had to apply stronger than normal braking force today when my fatigue caught up with me and I took an exit ramp a bit too fast. Luckily nothing happened, but my instincts told me to apply more force than usual. So upon realizing this, I stopped a few feet shorter than I expected, even with the Akebonos that have more "give".

So during hard braking, they bite well, but the do not give you a sense that they are biting well, unlike the stock OEM pads. This is probably what makes them feel unique, especially when cold.

It's been nearly 3 years since I drove with the Akebonos in front (Textars at the rear) and the rear pads are wearing down already, but the fronts are still pretty thick. The difference in price definitely makes it worthwhile to get.

JamesDean · #27 11-03-2012, 12:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MBeige

I had to apply stronger than normal braking force today when my fatigue caught up with me and I took an exit ramp a bit too fast. Luckily nothing happened, but my instincts told me to apply more force than usual. So upon realizing this, I stopped a few feet shorter than I expected, even with the Akebonos that have more "give".

So during hard braking, they bite well, but the do not give you a sense that they are biting well, unlike the stock OEM pads. This is probably what makes them feel unique, especially when cold.

It's been nearly 3 years since I drove with the Akebonos in front (Textars at the rear) and the rear pads are wearing down already, but the fronts are still pretty thick. The difference in price definitely makes it worthwhile to get.

I gave the 190E to the shop today so the could install my new steering gearbox. So I drove my 300D upt to work today.

Let me tell you, that brake pedal feels awesome. It might not be as effective as the 190's brakes in terms of stopping power but it feels significantly better. I much prefer that feeling over these Akebono's. Next time around I'll stick with Textar. But I think my first thing is to firm up the brake pedal. It feels like there is air in the system still.

MBeige · #28 11-03-2012, 12:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JamesDean

I gave the 190E to the shop today so the could install my new steering gearbox. So I drove my 300D upt to work today.

Let me tell you, that brake pedal feels awesome. It might not be as effective as the 190's brakes in terms of stopping power but it feels significantly better. I much prefer that feeling over these Akebono's. Next time around I'll stick with Textar. But I think my first thing is to firm up the brake pedal. It feels like there is air in the system still.

I've been thinking of doing the same with my 300D (your 300D is a w123 or w124?), but the pads are still pretty thick as I described, and I don't drive it that much, so I'll keep it this way for now.

Ferdman · #29 11-03-2012, 06:34 AM

Textar brake pads are softer and perform more efficiently than the harder, ceramic Akebono brake pads. Softer brake pads produce more friction, therefore the car stops faster with the same brake pedal force. MB automobile braking systems are designed with soft brake pads so the braking system functions even if the power assist is unavailable ... for instance, if the engine stalls.

Many owners install Akebono ceramic brake pads to reduce brake pad dust, but reduced braking efficiency occurs also. If there was a suitable alternative to the soft OEM brake pads surely the MB design engineers would specify those instead.

JamesDean · #30 11-03-2012, 01:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MBeige

I've been thinking of doing the same with my 300D (your 300D is a w123 or w124?), but the pads are still pretty thick as I described, and I don't drive it that much, so I'll keep it this way for now.

Mine is a 124. The stopping power difference is only because the 190E has E420/SL600 brake calipers.

Actually, I was driving home from work and pulled into the freeway right behind a 190E 2.3. I looked at the car and was like holy **** thats a small car. Then I remembered oh I have one of those LOL.