Quote:
Originally Posted by rwthomas1
Well, lets look at it this way:
You are in a classroom, if its like many of the classrooms when I went to college then there are two entrances/exits, usually on one wall of the room. A lunatic enters, draws weapons and starts shooting. There will be a stampede to the doors if the shooter is not blocking them and/or people piling up in the back of the room trying to cover themselves, etc.
So the question you are asking is do I want to be in this situation with a lunatic shooter and no other person armed? Or do I want at least the CHANCE of a CCW present that MAY be able to return fire? I will take the CHANCE with CCW every time. Sure, there is a chance that I may be killed by the CCW, or even the police, if they make it on time and shoot the anybody in the room with a gun. I'll take that CHANCE.
Without that CHANCE I and everyone else in the room is a victim just waiting for execution and praying that someone "saves" us.
Lets take a look at the VT shooting. The lunatic went room to room, shooting and reloading, returning to some rooms to shoot people again. The holocaust survivor professor was shot trying to barricade a door and keep the lunatic at bay. Do the naysayers NOT see how there might have been a CHANCE for someone to do something if CCW had been allowed? How much F#$%ing clearer can I make it?
My original comments revolved around simply allowing CCW permit holders to carry in more places, like universities, etc. The CCW holders are already there. It would be extremely unlikely that someone would run right out and obtain CCW permit simply to carry on campuses. The people that want them already have them, they just leave the weapons at home when they can't carry where they are going. This is not "arming everyone" or any of the other alarmist BS stated above.
RT
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First off – I sure hope you’re not referring to me with the “alarmist BS” line.
Anyway. Let’s look at it this way:
Kid passes every test and background check and gets a CHL, CCW, whatever….
Kid has his gun in his backpack when some nut-bag comes into the room armed to the teeth and attempts to start killing other students.
Kid pulls out his gun and drops the nut-bag before he gets a shot off.
Kid wakes up the next day a national hero.
(I’m all for that story, BTW.)
-or-
Kid wakes up the night before to the sound of gun shots. It seems that some other members of his frat house got drunk, found his gun and just “accidentally” (they just wanted to scare him) shot some kid from another frat coming over to TP their house. Other kids parents sue the sh-t out of the school for allowing this to happen…
-or-
Something related to “Thank God that wonderful man had a gun and put a stop to the madness….”
-or-
Well. Bottom line. If he didn’t have that gun….
-or-
Well…that list of stories can go on forever.
And for every -or- that anyone can add to it, either good ending or bad. Someone can always add one to the contrary. That’s all I’m saying. It’s not all cut and dry.
I agree with what you’ve said. I like your story. But you said yourself: “Let’s look at it this way:” If that’s how we look at it fine. I hope I’m in the class with you. I hope we can triangulate the MF and one of us gets a clear shot. After the CNN interview, I’ll buy the first round at the bar.
As for VT. Yep – Sure would have been nice if someone had a gun in there besides the nut-bag.
But how/who/why/etc. we get a gun in there isn’t as cut and dry as some might think. That’s all I’m saying. If it were that cut and dry. It would have been cut and dried some time ago.
“My original comments revolved around simply allowing CCW permit holders to carry in more places, like universities…”
From recent events, I can certainly see your point. And, I agree.
But how are we (PLEASE NOTE THAT I SAID: “WE”) going to deal with the irate parents who wont send their kids to a school that’s a melting pot of people, some of whom can legally walk around on, as well as live on, get drunk on, live in groups on, with a gun? (This picture gets much bigger, quite quickly btw.)
Sadly – This can go ‘round and ‘round forever.
Like has been said above. The trick is figuring out some sort of "law abiding citizens” formula. Somewhere in the formula also lies the “factors of large groups” formula and the “every scenario is different” formula. Once we get the formulas down, only then can the proper changes/laws/procedures be made that keep the masses happy.
edit:
Until then – Both extremist parties can bang their heads on the wall all they want.
I’ve got better things to do with my head (either one), so I’m not going to join either.