How slow is an NA OM617?

[Travis_k]

I went to look at a 1980 300td today (not going to buy it though, it has too many problems, and its likely doomed to go to the crusher as a result of the government price fixing of used cars in this area). It seemed to run ok (idled smooth, and no smoke) although it was hard to start and had almost no oil pressure. The transmission was dying too, which had at least a little bit to do with it, but it was much slower than even a 240D 4 speed, and far slower than my 300sd. Are they really that slow? Or was this one just in really bad shape.

[sixto]

I know how to measure how fast or quick something is but how do you measure how slow something is?

The literature says a 300D AT is a couple of ticks quicker to 60 mph than a 240D MT. I suspect the MT 'feels' quicker. The 300D might feel less responsive than a Taurus but it shouldn't feel very different from a 240D.

Sixto
87 300D

[pawoSD]

Really bad shape. A properly running NA 617 should have about 25ish more HP than a 616 240d...so significantly more power. Sounds like it was probably heavily abused and would need a lot of work. If the engine was running ok it is probably save-able.

[Stretch]

Yeah I've got one - they are super fast cars!

Well back to reality... a non turbo W123 300D should be able to achieve about 140 - 150 kph and perhaps a bit more => that's about 90 mph with the standard rear axle.

Even with the autobox acceleration is quite acceptable in modern traffic - you can most certainly keep up with it - you shouldn't have the feeling that you are a slow Grandma and in the way even in aggressive rush hour traffic where quite honestly you're not going to be the first one to cut across from the outside lane and off to the exit you want.

So in busy traffic you need to think ahead and not rely on pushing your right foot into the carpet and squealing your way across four lines of traffic at the last moment...

[barry123400]

One running properly is not all that bad. Nowhere near a turbo model of course but seems noticeably better than the 240ds in my opinion. The one you drove sounds like it had one wheel into the crushers already.

Remember it gets a certain amount of boost with the higher rear end ratio. This tends to make it somewhat noisier on the highway than a turbo model as well.

[whunter]

Originally Posted by Army

Yeah I've got one - they are super fast cars!

Well back to reality... a non turbo W123 300D should be able to achieve about 140 - 150 kph and perhaps a bit more => that's about 90 mph with the standard rear axle.

Even with the autobox acceleration is quite acceptable in modern traffic - you can most certainly keep up with it - you shouldn't have the feeling that you are a slow Grandma and in the way even in aggressive rush hour traffic where quite honestly you're not going to be the first one to cut across from the outside lane and off to the exit you want.

So in busy traffic you need to think ahead and not rely on pushing your right foot into the carpet and squealing your way across four lines of traffic at the last moment...

One of my tests of the naturally aspirated OM617 is a flat ground full throttle maximum speed run:
* 100 -105 MPH is great, but rare due to age/wear factors.
* 85 - 99 MPH is good.
* 71 - 84 MPH acceptable.
* 65 - 70 MPH marginal.
* 64 MPH or less is IMO dangerous.

It sounds like the car has major fuel infestation + lack of maintenance.

.

[Stretch]

Originally Posted by whunter

One of my tests of the naturally aspirated OM617 is a flat ground full throttle maximum speed run:
* 100 -105 MPH is great, but rare due to age/wear factors.
* 85 - 99 MPH is good.
* 71 - 84 MPH acceptable.
* 65 - 70 MPH marginal.
* 64 MPH or less is IMO dangerous.

It sounds like the car has major fuel infestation + lack of maintenance.

.

Well before I pulled mine to bits it was well in your good category - owner's hand book indicates the possibility of 155 kph (96 mph) as max speed on graph for fuel economy.

I've also just found this - there's often a slight difference between factory spec, real life capabilities, and indicated speed though

W123-300D-Getriebe/en

[layback40]

Originally Posted by Army

Well before I pulled mine to bits it was well in your good category - owner's hand book indicates the possibility of 155 kph (96 mph) as max speed on graph for fuel economy.

I've also just found this - there's often a slight difference between factory spec, real life capabilities, and indicated speed though

W123-300D-Getriebe/en

Army,
2 factors to consider;
Just because the graph doesnt go that far doesnt mean the car wont.

Yours is either the first of the 617's ~ gutless, or the first update ~ not too bad. The last of the 617's were much better.
I have owned & driven both the first update & the last ones & there is a difference.

[Stretch]

Originally Posted by layback40

Army,
2 factors to consider;
Just because the graph doesnt go that far doesnt mean the car wont.

Yours is either the first of the 617's ~ gutless, or the first update ~ not too bad. The last of the 617's were much better.
I have owned & driven both the first update & the last ones & there is a difference.

Hey tell me about it - that's why I included the link. I also tried to convey that there is a difference between the real world and what the books say.

I've got the newer type - I didn't know that when I bought it - I'm glad I got the right one!

I was speaking to a chap at the Dutch GTG on Saturday and he was saying that his 83 non turbo was worse than his 79 euro. Just goes to show what wear can do...

[layback40]

Originally Posted by Army

Yeah I've got one - they are super fast cars!

Well back to reality... a non turbo W123 300D should be able to achieve about 140 - 150 kph and perhaps a bit more => that's about 90 mph with the standard rear axle.

Even with the autobox acceleration is quite acceptable in modern traffic - you can most certainly keep up with it - you shouldn't have the feeling that you are a slow Grandma and in the way even in aggressive rush hour traffic where quite honestly you're not going to be the first one to cut across from the outside lane and off to the exit you want.

So in busy traffic you need to think ahead and not rely on pushing your right foot into the carpet and squealing your way across four lines of traffic at the last moment...

Having driven NA 617's for nearly 30 years, I can concur that they are not that slow. the early ones were a bit gutless but the update ones have plenty of go.
In countries where you drive on the left & so are RHD, only NA 617's were imported.
If you get an update 617NA in good condition it will be fine.

[Travis_k]

Yeah, I am pretty sure this one had a major lack of maintenance. I couldn't imagine it was supposed to be that slow, but I was just surprised that it still idled well and didnt smoke. Its still the cheapest 300TD on craigslist, and the only driveable one under $3k, but by the time I replaced the transmission, either replaced the engine or whatever worn parts make it have almost no oil pressure, the leaking oil cooler lines, tires, fixed the fuel system problem, fixed the SLS, replaced 3 or the window regulators.... paying $6500 for a nice one would look like a good deal.

[panZZer]

In a TD --pretty slow,
in a CD--almost acceptable--
in a cd--with a stick shift, acceptable.

[Tanksowner]

Out of curiosity, how many miles on said beast?

[Travis_k]

Originally Posted by Tanksowner

Out of curiosity, how many miles on said beast?

351k, but the odometer was not working.

[Biodiesel300TD]

My Manual trans 240 with the 616 will do 0-60 in about 30 seconds. On flat ground acceleration isn't too bad, and almost peppy once the engine is warmed up. Any kind of hill though and the acceleration is quite a bit lower.