Greetings,
A while ago I posted a message talking about a clunking sound when hitting the brakes after changing directions. My mechanic wrote it off as loose brake pads so I figured it was no big deal. An hour ago or so when I was installing the Kleen Wheels, I noticed that the front driver's side hub was rotating against the brake rotor. It's just a slight movement, but enough to cause that clunking.

So, I have two questions. Apparently this has been like this for a while because this clunking sound has been with the car for several months. Can I just keep driving the car for another week or so until I get a chance to fix it? If you can mentally picture the hub/rotor assembly, you'll see that you can see the bolts that secure the rotor to the hub (they face outward and you can see then in the hub). THey are in pretty securely and none of them seem to be coming undone. Also, the hub is only slightly loose rotationally, that is, two dimensionally (ie. it isn't loose when I pull on it). As such, it has been giving me a pretty smooth ride, no wobbling, no vibration.

Second, how do I hold the unit still enough to tighten the rotor to hub bolts correctly. It's tough to keep that large thing still enough to be able to turn the wrench with enough torque. What are you experiences with this?

I should probably address this pretty soon so if you have any clarifications questions, please please ask. Thanks for taking the time to read this.

Alex

__________________
1983 300D (parked for four years)
2012 VW Sportwagen TDI Manual
2001 Miata SE
1962 Chevrolet Corvair Rampside

Since you have driven the car a lot with this condition, another week or so is not going to hurt. You need to remove the rotor/hub assembly from the car to fix. I would check to see if you may need new rotors..rotors are not really expensive and this would be the time to do it.

If you are going to leave the old rotor in and just tighten it, you should remove the rotor entirely to ensure mating surfaces are clean. If you just tighten as is, chances are there will be some debris in there, resulting in distortion of the rotor, and a rotor that will not be perfectly perpendicular to the spindle.

Use high temp. lock tite on bolts.

When I replaced my rotors, I held the hub in a carpenters vice...the type with two wooden surfaces, thus preventing any damage to the rotor.

Good Luck,

Mark

__________________
1984 300TD Wagon, 407,800 mi (current daily driver)
1985 300DT Sedan, 330,000 mi (gone to that great autobahn in the sky)

Mark,
Thanks for the words of reassurement. I guess it won't hurt it too much to just wait two or three days. I'll baby it in the mean time. I know the problem has been the same for quite some time, but it feels so much more urgent now that I know what it is. The rotors are new virtually (well, as of 8000 miles ago) new and I think that when I went to reinstall everything, I didn't get those bolts on tight enough. Oh well, live and learn. What is this carpenter's vise you're talking about? Is it just a vise with wood contact surfaces? I'll have to check that out and home depot tomorrow. Also, what did you use to clean the mating surfaces with? Just a wire brush? THanks a lot

TXBill,
Yes, you are correct, I am talking about the bolts that go in from the inside. They come through on the outside though so you can see the ends of them on the hub when you take the wheel off. I don't have an impact wrench or an air compressor. Should I suck it up and go get myself an electric one? They're pretty expensive at over $200. Is there another way I could loosen and tighten these bolts without the impact wrench?

Thanks for replying so soon.

Alex

__________________
1983 300D (parked for four years)
2012 VW Sportwagen TDI Manual
2001 Miata SE
1962 Chevrolet Corvair Rampside

I don't have any advice about the bolts that hold the rotor to the hub, but another thought (possibility) came to my mind. The guide or track rod that attaches to the lower control arm (LCA)and runs to the firewall could be creating this noise also during braking.

You might especially feel the clunk at your feet on the floor during braking. The tapered bushings where the guide rod attaches to the LCA could be worn as well as the guide rod mount assembly at the firewall. I believe these items if worn would also transmit that same sound and feel.

My .02 cents worth.

I used the wood faces carpenters vise to protect from marring the hub, but the hub is so thick, I dont think you can really damage it by using a regular bench vise.

To clean mating surfaces, use sharp wood chisels or a razor blade scraper or something similar to get all rust and debris off.

__________________
1984 300TD Wagon, 407,800 mi (current daily driver)
1985 300DT Sedan, 330,000 mi (gone to that great autobahn in the sky)

Mark,
Thanks for the info on the vise. I'll run to Sears tomorrow and get something that'll work.

TXBill,
I'm impressed that you remember!

r90,
Back when I first posted this, everyone was pointing me to the track rod and lower control arm bushing. I double checked those again but was pretty sure they were ok because they are all only a year old. Thanks for the thought though.

Alex

__________________
1983 300D (parked for four years)
2012 VW Sportwagen TDI Manual
2001 Miata SE
1962 Chevrolet Corvair Rampside

Turbodiesel,

I recently bought a set of breaker bars. I have 1/2" drives in 18" and 25" lengths. They have been able to loosen any bolt I've found. I used to hammer the ratchet, and it would take forever. The breaker bar takes rusted on bolts off like they were loose. This tool is a must have for anyone who does a lot of automotive work.

Hopefully you don't twist the allen sockets trying to get those bolts off.

Is a breaker bar just a long bar? or is it a device that has two bars that you leverage against each other? If it's just the one long bar with a fixed head (ie. no rachet), I have one of those. Thanks

Alex

__________________
1983 300D (parked for four years)
2012 VW Sportwagen TDI Manual
2001 Miata SE
1962 Chevrolet Corvair Rampside

Yes, a breaker bar is just a longer handle and without the rachet... then a Cheater bar is a pipe which fits over the breaker bar to give you extra power... but usually it is safer to get the next size breaker bar... Always buy these types of tools from sources with no questions asked replacement policies.... Some bolts and nuts have been practicing their grip for a long time.

Dieselhead,

Here's a picture.

Attached Thumbnails

 

Look's like Harbor Freight Tool Catalog. Good deals on cheaper tools, and a tool like these bars will never be used at anything near their breaking point for this kind of work so you will probably never need the quality of Armstrong, SK, Snap-On or the like. Use your money to buy high quality sockets and hex key sockets where fit , finish and quality make a difference when in contact with the fasteners. Use your hard earned money to buy the quality torque wrench you'll need to have.

Thanks for the breaker bar clarification. I have one of those and will use it on my hub after I get a good vise. Kind of off the topic, do you think it's worth it to get one of those electric impact wrenches? Should I save up to buy an aircompressor and air powered tools? Thanks

ALex

__________________
1983 300D (parked for four years)
2012 VW Sportwagen TDI Manual
2001 Miata SE
1962 Chevrolet Corvair Rampside