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#2
12-30-2005, 12:02 PM
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I don't think it would be a good idea for their remains to be placed in the troop compartment of a miltary transport, or in passenger compartment of a commercial aircraft.
Cargo holds in passenger aircraft are pressurized, lighted, and suitable for safe transport of dogs, cats, pets, and other living creatures. The remains, from what I see, are returned with dignity. 
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#3
12-30-2005, 12:08 PM
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Here's how it really works...
The following is reprinted from the VFW website:
---------------------------------------------- A great nation deserves the (whole) truth 12/11/2005 American military men and women are shipped home as “freight” via commercial airlines. So says the 10News team on San Diego TV station KGTV and carried on by John Aravoisis & Friends, blog master for Americablog. To the 10News team I would repeat the cave mans response as his companion orders his duck lunch in a TV commercial – “Next time do a little research.” To Mr. Aravosis I would say that perhaps you should add the word “whole” to your blog motto A great nation deserves the (whole) truth. During the first Gulf War I was recalled to active duty, after twelve years of retirement from the Army. My “hip-pocket orders” had me assigned to Ft. Bragg, North Carolina in the event of a national emergency. I assumed that I would be sent to Ft. Bragg as a garrison sergeant major to let the young puppies of the 82nd Airborne go fight the war. Well, that didn’t happen. Instead, I was assigned to the Escort Detachment at Ft. Meade, Maryland along with 199 other Army retirees. Our mission was to escort deceased military from the mortuary at Dover Air Force Base to their home for interment. After extensive training which included a tour of the Dover Mortuary, I felt well prepared to return our dead to their grieving families with the dignity, honor, empathy, respect and compassion they deserve. Allow me to detail for you my first-hand experience returning just one soldier who was killed by one of Saddam’s scud missiles. In order to protect the privacy of the family of the deceased soldier I will not mention his name or the state in which they live. As soon as the Air Force plane carrying the remains of the dead soldiers arrived at Dover Air Base, they were met by a uniformed honor guard. I personally observed one of the off-loading ceremonies at 2:00 o’clock in the morning on a very dark, very windy, and very cold winter day. The casket was draped with the National Colors and carried by six uniformed airmen, marching in lock step, at a slow cadence, to a vehicle that immediately dove the short distance to the mortuary. The mortuary itself was set up in several stations which included bathing the remains, positive identification, cosmetology and uniform issue where the deceased was dressed in uniform complete with ribbons, badges, name tag and other official insignia. This process could take several days depending on the condition of the remains and the confirming of a positive identification. In the meantime I, as the assigned escort, was being briefed by a mortuary officer, issued written orders and the remains documentation, name and telephone number of the funeral director and a commercial airplane ticket to the heartland of the United States. A formal inspection of my uniform and appearance was also conducted. Outside the door was a contracted civilian funeral home vehicle with the remains of the deceased already having been loaded. Inside the large cardboard shipping container, reinforced with 2 X 4’s on all sides, was a military casket. It is true that the shipping container was not draped with the flag of our country. In fact, neither was the casket inside draped with the flag. Rather, the flag was neatly folded in the traditional tri corner fold, put into a triangular shaped clear plastic bag and placed inside the shipping container beside the coffin. The sun was not up yet as we departed Dover Air Force Base for Philadelphia. Arriving at the airport we drove directly to the cargo area where we were met by airline personnel who specialize in the transporting of human remains. They were professional and empathic men who do this sort of thing seven days a week for civilian or military deceased being transported to some location other than that from which they died. After confirming the identity number on the shipping container, we drove the remains, in an airline vehicle, directly to the aircraft which was waiting at the gate to be loaded with passengers. My orders instructed me to insure, by direct observation, to confirm the identity number on the shipping container as those remains that had been placed in my charge. Even though the shipping container had no flag draped over it, my orders instructed me to render appropriate salute honors as the shipping container moved up the conveyor belt and was carefully placed in the cargo area. Only after the shipping container was secured inside the aircraft were passengers allowed to board. Prior to my being escorted by the senior flight attendant up the outside stairs of the boarding gate, my orders required me to telephone the receiving funeral director to confirm our time of arrival. With this done I was seated in the first seat directly behind the door. This was airline policy to allow the escort to be the first person to disembark from the aircraft in order to again render salute honors as the remains are off loaded. The only time the remains were out of my personal sight was while I was physically on the aircraft. During the flight the flight attendants were extremely empathic of my somber duties and afforded me every consideration of privacy they possibly could. Upon arrival I was again escorted by the senior flight attendant, directly off the aircraft and down the outside stairs of the gateway. Again, by airline policy, my shipping container was the first thing off loaded, carefully placed on the conveyor belt and slowly lowered to its bottom. Dropping my salute, I once again confirmed the identity number as being correct and allowed the remains to be loaded in the airline vehicle for the short drive from the tarmac to the waiting funeral director hearse. Before loading into the hearse, the shipping container was removed; the flag was unfolded and placed over the now fully exposed casket for all to see as we made the drive to a small farming community in the country’s heartland. Although the remains were in a sealed casket, my final orders were to inspect the actual remains of our fallen comrade. Together, and in private, the funeral director unsealed the casket. This was to be the first time I would actually see this brave soldier who died so young. He had shifted slightly and a smudge of mortuary make up was on the collar of his uniform. Even though his casket would remain closed, because of the severity of his wounds, my orders were explicit. I had to insure the remains were in proper position and that nothing was wrong with his uniform. The funeral director and I shifted him into position and carefully blotted the makeup from his collar. It was then that I noticed that the mortuary uniform staff had placed his army collar brass backwards on his uniform. I exchanged the brass, left to right and visa versa then watched as the funeral director resealed the casket. The soldier had done his duty but so did the Dover Air Force Base Honor Guard, the Dover Mortuary staff and the airline. And, thank God I was able to do my duty. My assignment was now ended. The funeral director has signed for the remains. The Army Survivor Assistance Officer was now in charge of preparing for the final honors of a firing party, bugler and flag presenter. Now I could return to Dover Air Force Base to await my next assignment. Epilogue: This is as it is now and that is how it was through Republican and Democratic Presidents, through many wars and even during years of peace. The only differences that I know of are that, in years passed, the shipping containers went in the cargo compartment of a train and that was only if the dead soldier was returned to the United States rather than being buried in the country where he died. So you TV newscasters in San Diego and you internet Americabloggers, get your facts straight and tell the whole story not just what will get you ratings or flaming comments to increase the counter on a blog. David F. Butters Sergeant Major, Infantry U.S. Army Retired -------------------------------------------
__________________
Bill Wood - Retired Webmaster My Personal Website 1998 Mercedes E430 2010 Toyota Sequoia My Photo Albums
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#4
12-30-2005, 12:38 PM
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Flame that one Charlie(Shane) ^ I double dog dare ya.
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#6
12-30-2005, 01:31 PM
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I don't consider this appropiate
In May, the parents of an Army private first class were stunned when their son's casket was delivered to them on a forklift in a cargo area of a St. Louis airport where employees on break smoked nearby. They also thought it insensitive that, when informing them of their son's death, the casualty assistance officer literally read from a script.
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#7
12-30-2005, 01:37 PM
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How do you get a large object off the airplane in St Louis? How would you suggest the notifier present the information, singing telegram? Gee whiz, Shane. You're seeking something weird here but I can't quite figure it out. Whazzup?
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#8
12-30-2005, 01:42 PM
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According to protocol - an extension of their sacred "never leave a Marine behind" mandate - a fallen Marine's body must be guarded by another Marine whenever it is accessible by a member of the public.
At the visitation, Marines hear the families talk to the body. At the memorial services, they hear the eulogies. During the burials, they see the flag presented to the grieving mother or widow. Through it all, they try to hold the stare. "They can stand there for hours," Beck said. "Their feet fall asleep up to their knees. The pain we're feeling drives us. It drives us for the family because the pride is bigger than the pain. But the pain - you gotta eat it, you gotta live with it, you gotta take it home and cry in the dark. What else are you going to do?" From the Rocky Mtn Post. Who is Shane?
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#9
12-30-2005, 01:58 PM
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Last watch
Beck motioned to the pallbearers and began the instructions that would hold for the next three days.
Although the Marines are required to stand watch over a comrade's body, once the casket is safely inside a locked mortuary or church, they usually leave at night and return when the mortuary reopens. This time, however, the watch would not end. "Katherine and Caroline have both expressed concerns about Jim being left alone," Beck told the Marines. "So we won't leave him alone." He then explained how to guard the casket. They all had posted watch before. They had stood at attention for hours as part of basic training, but nothing like this. They were to take shifts of about an hour at a time, Beck instructed, standing watch 24 hours a day. When changing the guard, they were to salute Cathey's casket first, then relieve the other Marine the same way. He showed them the slow salute - the one they aren't taught in basic training - three seconds up, hold for three seconds and three seconds down. "A salute to your fallen comrade should take time," he said. For Beck, that salute embodies more than the movement itself. Earlier in the day, someone had asked him about the arrival of "the body." He held up his hand with a firm correction. "'The body' has a name." he said. "His name is Jim." In the room, he walked up to the casket and paused. "Now, this is important, too," he said. "If a family member wants you to break, you can break. They may want to hug you or kiss you. That's OK. Hug them. If someone wants to shake your hand, shake their hand. I'll take my glove off when I shake their hand - you don't have to, it's up to you. But then go back to position. "Everyone understand?" "Yes, sir," they responded. "Roger that." "This is a serious business," he said. "Jim is watching you." As the other Marines filed into the hallway, closing the door behind them, Beck walked back to the casket. For the first time, he and Jim Cathey were alone.
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#10
12-30-2005, 02:10 PM
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Quote:
In other words there are very few aircraft in the military that are anything other than "cargo".
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#11
12-30-2005, 02:17 PM
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The uh, facilities were primitive. I'd like to know who spent $300 for the seat on that thing. B PS Charlie7, the "Shane" ref was to the similarity between the style of your post and the style of an entity formerly known as Shane.
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#12
12-30-2005, 02:22 PM
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Quote:
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#14
12-30-2005, 03:06 PM
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The movie Titanic was also moving and like your post it's something real and surrounded by BS.
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