Speaking in tongues--stolen idea

[kerry]

I'm pissed. Andrew Newberg has been doing research for a number of years on religious experience and brain scans. After he published an article on the brains of Buddhist monks meditating a number of years ago, I contacted him and wrote that he need to study Pentecostals speaking in tongues to see what was happening in their brains. I volunteered to be a test subject so a comparison could be made between believers who speak in tongues and non-believers who speak in tongues. He replied stating that he was not interested in investigating the subject. I was surprised to find the following info today:

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2006/10/061030183100.htm

I haven't been able to access the complete article yet to see whether he credits me. He certainly hasn't thanked me for giving him the idea.

[R Leo]

I really want to know is what's going on in the brains of those serpent handlers.

[John Doe]

Originally Posted by kerry edwards

I'm pissed. Andrew Newberg has been doing research for a number of years on religious experience and brain scans. After he published an article on the brains of Buddhist monks meditating a number of years ago, I contacted him and wrote that he need to study Pentecostals speaking in tongues to see what was happening in their brains. I volunteered to be a test subject so a comparison could be made between believers who speak in tongues and non-believers who speak in tongues. He replied stating that he was not interested in investigating the subject. I was surprised to find the following info today:

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2006/10/061030183100.htm

I haven't been able to access the complete article yet to see whether he credits me. He certainly hasn't thanked me for giving him the idea.

First of all--good idea kerry--I have always thought the speaking in tongues stuff was peer pressure instead of any type of spiritual manifestation. Kind of like flopping around on the ground and stating 'I am healed' after being shoved down by a faith healer.

Out him--you know that happens all the time in those sort of journals. Should be easy to do if you 'wrote' instead of called him and saved a copy. Short of that, get yourself a good 'non-disclosure' agreement in place before you share your ideas next time.

[John Doe]

Originally Posted by R Leo

I really want to know is what's going on in the brains of those serpent handlers.

Usually a neurotoxin that makes your eyes cross and your cars all mysteriously appear on cinder blocks in the front yard.

[Unleashed]

Typical. Never trust people - life is horrendously unfair.
My mother's brother wrote a thesis in university - his lecturer stole it and handed it in as his own work to the committee and got an award. Never was my uncle recognised for any of it.
It sounds harsh of me, but I mean it with the utmost respect - you're going to have to deal with it. Or sue him!

[Mistress]

reminds me of that scene in the new "Borat" movie where he is at a Pentecostal revival....most amusing..

[Mistress]

Originally Posted by R Leo

I really want to know is what's going on in the brains of those serpent handlers.

a conversation that would go something like this:

Snake handler:" Listen snake we gotta do this little dance for the people and I need your help."

Snake:"Ugh so your point would be and what's in it for me?" I mean last time I bellyed up (pun intended) for a show like this some son-of-a-***** tried to de-fang me without novacaine."

Snake handler:" Yeah, sorry about that, but I can offer you a comfortable condo on the beach and extra rodents for dinner, oh yeah and I'll keep that lady in the front row who's been eyeing you for a future handbag at bay, how's that sound so far?"

Snake:" So far so good, look I need to check in with my other handler Gary Larson, then my manager."

[crash9]

From FuturePundit

Since I am one of the 4 authors of the the glossolalia paper, and the coauthor with Newberg of "Why We Believe What We Believe," let me add some notes to this intriguing discussion. First, speaking in tongues is essentially an altered state of consciousness in which the person deliberately changes the overall neural functioning of his or her brain. Chanting, drumming, and shamanic trance states probably would show similar brain states, with decreases in frontal lobes and unusual changes in other areas. Interestingly, in Newberg's other brainscan studies, nuns praying and Buddhists meditating had similar altered brain patterns to each other, but were almost the opposite of the Pentecostals, who never lost sense of themselves and thus do not feel "at one" with the universe or God. Instead they stay present, in dialogue with the Holy Spirit. Is God just an imaginative construct in the brain? Obviously yes (even if God does exist, the brain has to conceive of God to experience it). But what is most interesting about intense meditations is that they can permanently change the neural structure of the brain. All of Newberg's subjects, including the nuns, Buddhists, and one atheist who attempted to pray to God (see the book, "Why We Believe What We Believe" for a full description of all of these studies) had assymetric activity in the thalamus when they weren't even meditating. The longer you focus on any concept, other parts of the brain will respond as if that idea was objectively real. Focus on peace, you become more peaceful; focus on your anger, and your anger will feel justified and real. If you believe in God, God eventually becomes real. So be careful about what you believe!

PS: ADD is a permanent neural dysfunction where frontal lobe activity is disrupted
Posted by Mark Robert Waldman at November 7, 2006 12:28 PM

FuturePundit

[kerry]

Originally Posted by John Doe

First of all--good idea kerry--I have always thought the speaking in tongues stuff was peer pressure instead of any type of spiritual manifestation. Kind of like flopping around on the ground and stating 'I am healed' after being shoved down by a faith healer.

Out him--you know that happens all the time in those sort of journals. Should be easy to do if you 'wrote' instead of called him and saved a copy. Short of that, get yourself a good 'non-disclosure' agreement in place before you share your ideas next time.

I must have deleted the message and response from Newburg as the only thing I can still find in my stored e-mails is this exchange between myself and a friend about the topic:

Kerry,

Funny, I just "scanned" or did I "skim" Newburg and Aquili's book on
Saturday night at Borders. I wanted to see what our philosophy guy here,
William Hasker, thought of it. His recent book is _The Emergent Self_, which sort-of examines the issue of the soul from a non-dualistic approach (thus, emergent, as in emergent from and always with a body).

Blessings,

Joe Ricke

-----Original Message-----
From: Edwards, Kerry [mailto:Kerry.Edwards@rrcc.cccoes.edu]
Sent: Monday, April 23, 2001 1:55 PM
To: 'Joe Ricke'
Subject: FW: God or the limbic system?


Joe:
Thought you might be interested given our previous exchange? I sent an e-mail to Newburg asking if he'd ever done brain scans of people speaking in tongues.

Kerry

Associate Professor of Philosophy
Co-Chair Humanities and Social Science
Red Rocks Community College

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Edwards, Kerry
> Sent: Monday, April 23, 2001 11:31 AM
> To: 'Candy'
> Subject: God or the limbic system?
>
>
> Candy:
> What do you think??
> http://www.newscientist.com/features/features.jsp?id=ns22871
>
> Kerry
>
> Associate Professor of Philosophy
> Co-Chair Humanities and Social Science Red Rocks Community College
>

[A264172]

Ahh religion. It's a cut-throat buisness these days.

[kerry]

Originally Posted by A264172

Ahh religion. It's a cut-throat buisness these days.

It's a scan-brain business nowadays.

[A264172]

What are the ethical considerations associated with scanning suicide bombers?

Oh and mum's the word btw.

[aklim]

Originally Posted by Unleashed

Typical. Never trust people - life is horrendously unfair.

My mother's brother wrote a thesis in university - his lecturer stole it and handed it in as his own work to the committee and got an award. Never was my uncle recognised for any of it.

That's what I say. Wifey had the same issue before with some other entity.

Isn't that your uncle? Actually, that is kinda crude. UW Madison has their students do the research. As a result, my wife noticed that RN students from UW would be more hesitant to do anything during clinical classes since they spend much of their time writing papers for the instructors. I'll give you an example. In Advanced Medical Surgery class that my wife took, she was made to write an article on lycopenes. Even the instructor could not answer the question when asked why and how it related to the class. I'll bet it is so that the instructor can get new ideas. That is why they asked the students to write a paper on the latest research of lycopenes.

[Kuan]

Call him out at the next conference. Bring it up casually during the after dinner wine session so you have plenty of witnesses.

[kip Foss]

Randy,

I think if you look inside the brains of most of the cult religious nuts you will see that the wee hamster has fallen off the wheel.