Ellison to use Koran for swearing in - Page 4 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

Honus · #46 01-04-2007, 05:09 PM

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Originally Posted by John Doe

It seems to be insinuated by people who live in his district, that he is just drawing attention to himself, rather than being sincere. I don't know why you are so impressed with his borrowing TJs Koran--every VIP is offered this same type of option and he did it to very obviously insulate himself from criticism. Far from an original thought on his part.

I hope he's sincere. As to the PR move of getting Mr. Jefferson's Koran - who even knew that TJ had a Koran and that the Library of Congress had it available? Maybe it fell in Ellison's lap, but I'll bet ol' Virgil didn't see it coming. You can't do anything in his district without running into a picture, statue, or some other reference to TJ. You're probably right, but I still think it's funny that he pulled it off.

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I don't know if he is sincere or not (nor do I care). I think he is a douchebag for other reasons, primarily his association with the Nation of Islam.
IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE KORAN THING.

I don't know enough to comment on any of that. I was just talking about the Koran thing and what a knucklehead Virgil showed himself to be. And he has generally been portrayed as a moderate Republican, at least by Virginia standards.

mplafleur · #47 01-04-2007, 05:12 PM

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Originally Posted by John Doe

See the title to the article in post #1.

Oh yeah. I see...

Honus · #48 01-04-2007, 05:15 PM

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Originally Posted by John Doe

Ridiculous--even for you. Like it or not, Christianity IS more American than Islam. How did it get that way? I guess the majority rules. In God We Trust, God Bless America. What do they swear on (usually) in the Court's you practice in, btw?

The practice in court rooms has changed over the last decade or so. They used to use a Bible. Now they generally just have the witness hold up his or her right hand and "swear or affirm."

Culturally, America is much more Christian than it is Muslim. The government, however, is neither. At least that's what Fairfax County Public Schools taught back in my day. In fact, I don't see how the Pledge of Allegiance can possibly be constitutional. I don't lose any sleep over the issue, but it's ridiculous - IMHO - to have our government compel Americans to pledge allegiance to a religious concept.

aklim · #49 01-04-2007, 05:25 PM

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Originally Posted by dculkin

In fact, I don't see how the Pledge of Allegiance can possibly be constitutional. I don't lose any sleep over the issue, but it's ridiculous - IMHO - to have our government compel Americans to pledge allegiance to a religious concept.

In which form? http://www.homeofheroes.com/hallofheroes/1st_floor/flag/1bfc_pledge.html

It was changed to have the religious concept in it.

Honus · #50 01-04-2007, 05:35 PM

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Originally Posted by suginami

...Keith Ellison, D-Minn., the first Muslim elected to the United States Congress, has announced that he will not take his oath of office on the Bible, but on the bible of Islam, the Koran...

That's not true. Ellison was sworn in along with the rest of the members - no Bibles, Korans, or Torahs involved. The procedure in which Ellison chose to use the Koran was a second unofficial ceremony that they do for each individual member.

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He should not be allowed to do so -- not because of any American hostility to the Koran, but because the act undermines American civilization...

That's also wrong. For one thing Article VI, Clause 3 of the Constitution says:

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The Senators and Representatives before mentioned, and the members of the several state legislatures, and all executive and judicial officers, both of the United States and of the several states, shall be bound by oath or affirmation, to support this Constitution; but no religious test shall ever be required as a qualification to any office or public trust under the United States.

Isn't Prager calling for a religious test? Secondly, I don't buy his conclusion that Islam is so inferior to Christianity that we are required to use only the Christian Bible for these ceremonies. Finally, his world view is a dead end. Does he expect Muslims to accept an inferior position? It's ridiculous.

Honus · #51 01-04-2007, 05:37 PM

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Originally Posted by aklim

In which form? http://www.homeofheroes.com/hallofheroes/1st_floor/flag/1bfc_pledge.html

It was changed to have the religious concept in it.

I'm talking about the 1954 amendment where they added "under God." I know that phrase is important to many Americans and it would not be productive to fight about it, but it can't be considered Constitutional, IMHO.

aklim · #52 01-04-2007, 05:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dculkin

I'm talking about the 1954 amendment where they added "under God." I know that phrase is important to many Americans and it would not be productive to fight about it, but it can't be considered Constitutional, IMHO.

Ditto

kerry · #53 01-04-2007, 05:39 PM

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Originally Posted by Kuan

How come there aren't any "reform Muslims," like reform Jews?

http://www.tariqramadan.com/welcome.php3

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tariq_Ramadan