Possible firing of an employee.... - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

Plantman · #1 05-20-2007, 08:00 PM

I know what most of you will say but I thought I'd get some additional input.

I am wrestling with the idea of firing an employee and I really don't want to do it because, well I guess firing an employee sucks!

My biggest beef with this 36 year old father of 2 is that apparently, everything in his life is more important to him than his job.

He lives 3 miles away from my warehouse and cannot EVER get to work before his 930 start time.

If I don't call or text him almost daily, he will get in at 10 or 1015. I feel like an ahole for having to even type this.

This past week it was:
Monday 1030(had excuse)
Tuesday 1035
Wed 947. I told him it's 930 not 947, he replies it's only 945 on my watch.
Thursday 945
Friday 10 am and I sent him home.

This is the norm and not the exception.

I literally start getting aggavated at around 9.25 because you would think a person would get to work a little early.

I shouldn't have to get aggavated every friggin day.

On top of the fact that he can't get to work on time, what he does do is generally incomplete.

FWIW, I own an interior landscape company and he does a bit of everything. Deliveries, sales, replacements, customer service, etc....

So when I say incomplete, I mean he delivers 20 plants and containers to a new account and the plants are not shiny, or they are missing ground cover.

Or he will go to a build to make replacements(list in hand) and replace the wrong plants.

The problem is that he is a nice guy, personable and customers like him. I like him, he's the kind of person you don't want to get rid of.

If I show up to work after him, he'll typically be standing with his hands in his pockets, while there is stuff to be done.

He has been warned repeatedly about his tardiness and I have had it.

The kicker to all of this is that his passion(coaching basketball to a local HS) doesn't pay him crap and he gets there everyday on time to open up the gym for his kids.

During the regular season, he finishes even earlier.

He typically will work about 5 hours a day(he has a list to do, when it gets done, he's done). Sometimes 8 but rarely.

He day goes like this:

Get to work at 10.30(mind you he shows up like he's been rushing)

Do whatever I ask him to do around the shop then get what he needs to follow his list of things to do.

Gets on the road around 11.15. Stops to get a bite to eat then goes to work.

He plans his day so that he finishes around the time he has to go to coach at his school.

If he gets stuck in traffic and still has one thing to do, he'll leave it for the next day if it means going late to his coaching.

As I said, getting rid of him is the last thing I want to do, but I feel like I am letting myself down.

I am thinking of suspending him for a week with pay, telling him to consider his options for employment, and if he can find a job with liberal hours, that allows him to be done in time to indulge his passion that he should do it, or he has to do things my way.

I know this is long in coming, but it feels like dealing with a son who continues to let you down. You have to deal with a son though.

Thoughts!

Kuan · #2 05-20-2007, 08:14 PM

Start writing him up. Show him that you're serious. It's your business, you can't afford this crap. Don't be overly sensitive about this coaching thing or the fact that he's a father of two. Write him up because your business can't afford it

raymr · #3 05-20-2007, 08:15 PM

Is his great personality bringing in new business? Does he contribute more to your business than a teen or 20 year-old would? His dedication to his kids is admirable, but he needs a bigger kick in the rear than you can provide.

Tell him this job is holding him back from his true potential, wish him luck, and let him go.

PaulC · #4 05-20-2007, 08:16 PM

Well, if your business is thriving and you have no interest in seeing it grow, and you don't mind the financial loss that you are suffering each and every day due to his bad habits and erratic work product, keep him.

If not, lose him. But not before you build a file against him regarding his chronic tardiness and inferior work performance. What does your written personnel policy (the one that was distributed to your employees during their first day of work) say in regard to this situation?

WVOtoGO · #5 05-20-2007, 08:19 PM

“You are supposed to be here at 9:30am Monday through Friday. Unless you have a darned good reason for being late every day, that you haven’t told me about. I’m going to have to find someone else who can be here on time.”

As far as his incomplete work (and timing for that matter) is concerned. You need to have periodic (1 on 1 sit-down) employee reviews with him. Have them typed up. And, have him sign them after the review(s). If he knows you are getting serious about his punctuality and performance. He’s apt to change his ill ways. If not, you have all you need to let him go without (legal) retaliation.

You need to properly document why you are letting any employee go. The last thing you want to do is just walk up one day and say: "You're fired." That can bite you in the butt if they want to come back and say: "But you never said anything about my being late (or poor performance), so I thought it was ok."

kerry · #6 05-20-2007, 08:22 PM

I'd definitly put your concerns in writing before taking the step of firing him, both for legal reasons and for the fact that sometimes a written reprimand can have an effect that a verbal one doesn't.

If you really want to take a creative approach, describe his problems to his basketball team and have them tell him he needs to shape up.

Plantman · #7 05-20-2007, 08:36 PM

He's an independent contractor who gets 1099's from me.

He does not receive any benefits but does get paid decently for what he does, about 2800 a month, cash.

I can get into more stories about what he doesn't do, but I have to go watch the sopranos.

He will definitely not work this week, and he may be so pissed about that, that he may make it easy for me.

I think that suspension will wake him up.

Did I mention that he uses a company van for personal use? That's another 300 per month to consider.

I can actually get a college kid to do what he does for less money.

kerry · #8 05-20-2007, 08:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Plantman

He's an independent contractor who gets 1099's from me.

.

That does change the situation somewhat in my mind. I can see where an independent contractor might think they have more flexibility in their hours than an employee.

Botnst · #9 05-20-2007, 08:42 PM

Say goodnight, Gracie.

B

Plantman · #10 05-20-2007, 09:03 PM

"I've spent a lot of time this weekend thinking of a reason to keep you here, and I really can't come up with one other than the fact that I like you personally.

You are constanly late and joke about it, you do things incorrectly when you actually do them.

I think that if you cannot get on board with what I want you to do here, and embrace this job with the same amount of dedication you have for your "hobby", I think it's best we part ways.

Life is too short for me to continally keep getting upset about what you do or don't do when it's apparent that you don't give a crap"

Botnst · #11 05-20-2007, 09:07 PM

I work with contract employees. There are special rules governing the degree to which you direct their work. If you have stepped-over that line and this guy knows it, he can take you to court as an employee with a grievance. You might do well to consult a lawyer before you terminate his services contract.

B

GermanStar · #12 05-20-2007, 09:25 PM

He's not an employee, he's an independent. There may be rules and regs concerning control and direction, but there is no obligation whatsoever to continue using his services, unless a specific contract suggests otherwise.

I worked as a freelance writer for a few years. I enjoyed the freedom, but the price was no job security -- none.

Dump this idiot, Plantman -- slackers are a dime a dozen.

mgburg · #13 05-20-2007, 10:02 PM

Plantman:

If you're 1099'ing him, I believe the IRS may want to have a few words with you...

I'd check with my accountant and see if what you're doing is legal in the taxman's eyes...otherwise, how you handle Mr. Lateallthetime (Mr. Latt) may be the wrong, and overly expensive (think penalties - like withholding, unemployment insurance, FICA, etc...) way, especially for YOUR POCKETBOOK.

If there's any CPA/IRS-types out there, chip in anytime...

Also, I'd get the keys to your vehicle and be sure he hasn't made any "personal copies" of same. How's he rated on YOUR vehicle insurance? Is he carrying a VALID license? Does he have his own insurance? If he's un-insured, there may be a (really scarry) reason for him being uninsured. Are you willing to risk your company's, and family's, security to find out when it's too late?

Plant - it sounds like Mr. Latt my end up being a stone hanging around your neck...you just don't want to go throwing him out until you've made sure you've got a properly addressed situation to work with.

Is he an employee?

OR,

Is he a contractor?

Depending on the state you're in, there are alot of definitions that could be applied in each circumstance. Have a good, long, heart-to-heart with your business accountant BEFORE you get any more worked up over Mr. Latt.

Above all, until you've defined Mr. Latt's position with your firm, do not either "lay him off" or "suspend him" until you actually know what you have him classified as. One path of action you can follow if he's "such and such," the other path you don't want to go down if he isn't that "such and such." Figure out which he is, then move in that direction only.

Otherwise, ...

Keep him in the shop, doing non-contact type of things (sweeping up, inventory, real easy, brain-food, type of labor) so that if there's a "problem" - hopefully it can be fixed up with nothing more than some hydrogen-peroxide and a bandage...even there, I'd still be sure he saw a doctor so you don't get sued if he should loose an appendage...

After the dust settles on this, then get your Employee Handbook in order - FAST.

Then take a more active roll in being the boss and not the friend.

More businesses, and family relationships, end up busted based on friendships.

Dubyagee · #14 05-20-2007, 10:31 PM

I just fired an employee for some of the same issues. His latest was a forged doctors excuse.

Signed and dated write ups are the only thing unemployment agencies will notice. Good luck.

Plantman · #15 05-20-2007, 10:36 PM

He has no contract and basically cannot prove otherwise.

As far as the IRS goes, they care about what I pay him, which he gets a form for so he can do his taxes. I doubt thye care if I fire his ass.

I do not believe I have any issues with them but will consult with my friend who is an IRS agent.

I love the name slacker btw......

I'm sure he won't be too happy tomorrow having to explain to his wife why he's home all week and has no van.