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#1
12-07-2008, 03:28 PM
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What is an American car?
We hear a lot about bailing out the US car mfg's. However, I think it is a little confusing. Which is an American car, a Chevy made in Mexico?, a Dodge made in Canada?, a Honda made in Ohio?, a Toyota made in California? I don't hear Honda and Toyota asking for a bailout. They are all American workers. Who are we bailing out?
http://ohio.honda.com/manufacturing/suppliers.cfm
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1998 C230 330,000 miles (currently dead of second failed EIS, yours will fail too, turning you into the dealer's personal human cash machine) 1988 F150 144,000 miles (leaks all the colors of the rainbow) Previous stars: 1981 Brava 210,000 miles, 1978 128 150,000 miles, 1977 B200 Van 175,000 miles, 1972 Vega (great, if rusty, car), 1972 Celica, 1986.5 Supra Last edited by mpolli; 12-07-2008 at 03:36 PM. 
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#2
12-07-2008, 03:42 PM
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Quote:
Last edited by PaulC; 12-07-2008 at 10:18 PM.
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#3
12-07-2008, 04:12 PM
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#4
12-07-2008, 04:18 PM
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Quote:
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1998 C230 330,000 miles (currently dead of second failed EIS, yours will fail too, turning you into the dealer's personal human cash machine) 1988 F150 144,000 miles (leaks all the colors of the rainbow) Previous stars: 1981 Brava 210,000 miles, 1978 128 150,000 miles, 1977 B200 Van 175,000 miles, 1972 Vega (great, if rusty, car), 1972 Celica, 1986.5 Supra
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#5
12-07-2008, 05:35 PM
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When they build good cars.
We are going on year three with my mom's 2007 Rav4. Only oil changes, its been to FL once and all over New England, boring as can be but flawless. It's also been returning high 20's in the mileage department, not bad for a little SUV around town. My dads 2007 F150 had a bad plug wire from the factory. Some moron at Ford didn't push the wire on all the way and caused it to run rough, but not rough enough to trigger the CE light. Took 3 trips to the dealer for them to fix that. Now it has a very loud annoying rattle under the dash. Toyota knows how to do quality control and catch stupid stuff like that, Ford still does not. Not much has changed, and they wonder why they are losing money. 
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2006 CL500 1969 280SE 2023 Ram 1500 2026 Genesis GV70 2007 Tiara 3200
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#6
12-07-2008, 05:50 PM
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My Brazilian-made Ford Ranger (200k miles) didn't do too bad(After I put in new brakes/blower/filters/brake lines/rear axle/rear axle bearings/brake cylinder/cab-to-body mounts/leaf spring mounts/alternator/serpentine&idler pulley/spark plugs).......
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$60 OM617 Blank Exhaust Flanges $110 OM606 Blank Exhaust Flanges No merc at the moment
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#7
12-07-2008, 05:57 PM
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Hey, did you know that was what it was when you went out and bought it? If yes, then WHY did you buy it?  
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 1991 560 SEC AMG, 199k <---- 300 hp 10:1 ECE euro HV ... 1995 E 420, 170k "The Red Plum" (sold) 2015 BMW 535i xdrive awd Stage 1 DINAN, 6k, <----364 hp 1967 Mercury Cougar, 49k 2013 Jaguar XF, 20k <----340 hp Supercharged, All Wheel Drive  (sold)
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#8
12-07-2008, 06:31 PM
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I think the premier was kinda neat. It had all sorts of computers in it. The HVAC controls, cruise, and the other buttons were right on the steering column.
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#10
12-07-2008, 09:41 PM
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Well this thread has gone off the track. My point was not to say that foreign cars are good and American ones are bad. I actually am not a fan of Honda and I do own a Ford truck. My point is that there are tens of thousands of Americans in American factories making foreign branded cars and making and sourcing their parts here. And the American brands are making many of their cars in foreign countries. The American companies say if they go bankrupt then the economy will collapse. My question is, is there any basis for this claim? Wouldn't their factories get bought by the remaining companies who would hire the same workers to make different cars? Will people want to buy less cars if 1 or 2 of the "big 3" go under? I doubt it. I will not mention that in 2000 Toyota announced the Prius and GM announced the Hummer... too late...
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1998 C230 330,000 miles (currently dead of second failed EIS, yours will fail too, turning you into the dealer's personal human cash machine) 1988 F150 144,000 miles (leaks all the colors of the rainbow) Previous stars: 1981 Brava 210,000 miles, 1978 128 150,000 miles, 1977 B200 Van 175,000 miles, 1972 Vega (great, if rusty, car), 1972 Celica, 1986.5 Supra
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#11
12-07-2008, 09:46 PM
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i remember thinking when GM bought the hummer brand and announced two more models and built fancy separate dealerships.....I was thinking WTF?
Who is buying these impractical things?
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[SIGPIC] Diesel loving autocrossing grandpa Architect. 08 Dodge 3/4 ton with Cummins & six speed; I have had about 35 benzes. I have a 39 Studebaker Coupe Express pickup in which I have had installed a 617 turbo and a five speed manual.  [SIGPIC]..I also have a 427 Cobra replica with an aluminum chassis.
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#12
12-07-2008, 09:52 PM
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Well it gets murkey these days as to what is an "American" company and what isn't. Chrysler for example is owned by Cerberus. A shady investment fund that can **** billion dollar bricks, but yet they want some cheap government money. Chrysler should be excluded from these talks, heck they were a German company for the past 10 years. Cerberus is just looking for some cheap money so they are pimping Chrysler around to the government. They own the freaken company, if it's such a good investment why don't they pump in a few billion of their own money? 40% of GM's sales are outside the US. If they go into chapter 11 some will lose their jobs, but in the end better companies will probably emerge. The market is still their for X number of cars per year and since our population is growing it is a growth area. Someone will provide cars to these customers, be it GM, Toyota, or something that will emerge from the wreckage of GM and Ford.
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2006 CL500 1969 280SE 2023 Ram 1500 2026 Genesis GV70 2007 Tiara 3200
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#15
12-07-2008, 10:29 PM
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Still off topic - I kinda wonder, how many car companies **should** the US have - that will be answered if we skip the bailout and let them fail.
On topic - I look at it 3 ways. a car has 3 parts from up to 3 different nations: 1) the nation of the manufactured product - what country it is actually built in. This nation benefits from manufacturing jobs created, and hurts from real estate/emissions/trash produced. 2) the nation of the design/engineering team - they do a large portion of the car (and dictate some of the quality control measures/DFM/machineing tolerances etc...) and are thusly (imho) 1/3rd of the value of the car This nation pretty much only benefits from the engineering/design jobs. This step generates little detrimental effect on a country I probably included this as 1/3'rd the value of a car because I am an Engineer =) 3) the nation of the management - they approve the production of the car, support (or not) dealer networks, and handle finances (or not =) The profit (if any) from the sale of the car gets managed by people from this country. This nation gets to tax or subsidize the company that orders the building of the cars. For instance - ML class- 1/3rd american (built in AL) , 2/3rds german (designed and funded from .de) example 2 - Ford F-150 - 3/3rd's american. This is a simplified view of things (...both fords and ML's have non-american parts in them, Alabama engineers can influence the production process/cost to produce....) but I think that it is a good tool for evaluating the true "country of origin" or a car -John
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2009 Kia Sedona 2009 Honda Odyssey EX-L 12006 Jetta Pumpe Duse (insert Mercedes here) Husband, Father, sometimes friend =)
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