how to test coil - Page 2 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

MS Fowler · #16 02-06-2010, 06:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matt L

Well, I'll have to believe you if you said that you broke open the coil module and found no sign of electronics. It baffles me as to how it could work, but ok.

Baffles me, too.
But I haven't ever done a Simplicity.

vwbuge · #17 02-06-2010, 06:26 PM

Model of snowblower is Montgomery Ward. (I know it is old)
I was told it was a Briggs engine but I cannot find serial number or nameplate on the motor. I know for sure it is a 3.5 hp.

I tried to get the flywheel off but I can't seem to get the top piece off that houses the ball bearings for the recoil pull start.

kknudson · #18 02-06-2010, 06:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MS Fowler

Baffles me, too.
But I haven't ever done a Simplicity.

It's a Briggs motor, Simplicity isn't really involved.

See the rusty thing with the wire to the spark pug on his pic 2.
Thats the part, it's Magneto not Magnetron.
Same thing they used on cars decades decades ago

There is some kind of windings inside the flywheel.

vwbuge · #19 02-06-2010, 07:22 PM

Found the serial numbers for the engine. You find the greatest things on the internet.

http://www.briggsandstratton.com/maint_repair/manual_and_more/docmanualdetails.aspx?showpdf=MS5423_LO.pdf

Part in question is listed in diagram as #333 "armature-magneto"

MS Fowler · #20 02-06-2010, 09:29 PM

And part #375 is the breaker point set.
Sorry to be such a pest, but according to my Briggs manual, all ignition systems have some other component besides the flywheel magnets and the coil.
" Four basic types of ignition systems have been used:
1)Magnetronic ignition, a self-contained transistor module, ignition armature and flywheel.
2)Magavac ignition using magnetically operated sealed points, ignition armature and flywheel.
3)Flywheel magneto ignition using either internal or external breaker points, ignition armature and flywheel.
4)Magnamatic ignition with ignition armature and rotor behind the flywheel and external points."

The common factors are the ignition armature and the flywheel. However, note that EVERY B&S system has some switching device, either a solid state device, or internal, or even external breaker points.

The one pictured in the referenced .pdf was type 3.

vwbuge · #21 02-06-2010, 09:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MS Fowler

And part #375 is the breaker point set.
Sorry to be such a pest, but according to my Briggs manual, all ignition systems have some other component besides the flywheel magnets and the coil.
" Four basic types of ignition systems have been used:
1)Magnetronic ignition, a self-contained transistor module, ignition armature and flywheel.
2)Magavac ignition using magnetically operated sealed points, ignition armature and flywheel.
3)Flywheel magneto ignition using either internal or external breaker points, ignition armature and flywheel.
4)Magnamatic ignition with ignition armature and rotor behind the flywheel and external points."

The common factors are the ignition armature and the flywheel. However, note that EVERY B&S system has some switching device, either a solid state device, or internal, or even external breaker points.

The one pictured in the referenced .pdf was type 3.

You are being very helpful, not a pest. OK, so I should replace the points set. Now I need to figure out how to get the damn flywheel off. In the pdf file assembly #66. There is no nut to take off. I am stumped. I was thinking gear puller but I was wondering about reassembly.

MS Fowler · #22 02-06-2010, 09:41 PM

The lower half of the recoil starter IS the nut that retains the flywheel, ( I think). B&S cautions against using a screwdriver across the fins to hold the flywheel, and they make a special tool to safely hold the flywheel, but you wouldn't be the first person to use the screwdriver.
They also made a special tool to fit in that starter half and allow you to spin it off.

Have you been able to identify the B&S series? I might be able to scan the appropriate parts of the manual.

Never mind, I see its on the parts list!

vwbuge · #23 02-07-2010, 05:57 AM

I tried holding the flywheel by hand and tapping the lower half of the recoil assembly with a screwdriver and hammer. I was afraid to break it so I stopped.

Model 92902 Type 0448 02 Code 79061128

vwbuge · #24 02-07-2010, 06:01 AM

I just noticed part number 363, "puller-flywheel. optional accessory"

So the lower portion of the recoil spins off and then I use a puller to remove flywheel?

MS Fowler · #25 02-07-2010, 06:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vwbuge

I just noticed part number 363, "puller-flywheel. optional accessory"

So the lower portion of the recoil spins off and then I use a puller to remove flywheel?

I believe that is correct. The puller is simply a flat bar. You might be able to use a steering wheel puller, if the correct tool is unavailable.

rscurtis · #26 02-07-2010, 11:36 AM

This engine has a two-leg armature, so it can be replaced with Magnetron ignition. To do this, there is no need to remove the flywheel. Buy a new Magnetron coil from your local B&S dealer, they are not expensive. They are also impervious to moisture- a real advantage on a snowblower. If, however, you wan't to play with the points, you can remove the starter clutch by tapping the ears counterclockwise with a box wrench and a hammer. To remove the flywheel, pry it upward with a screwdriver, and hit the end of the crankshaft with a SOFT hammer- do not use a steel hammer, you'll mushroom the end of the crankshaft and will not be able to reinstall the clutch. Be sure to install the Belleville washer correctly, or you'll shear the flywheel key.

vwbuge · #27 02-07-2010, 05:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rscurtis

This engine has a two-leg armature, so it can be replaced with Magnetron ignition. To do this, there is no need to remove the flywheel. Buy a new Magnetron coil from your local B&S dealer, they are not expensive. They are also impervious to moisture- a real advantage on a snowblower. If, however, you wan't to play with the points, you can remove the starter clutch by tapping the ears counterclockwise with a box wrench and a hammer. To remove the flywheel, pry it upward with a screwdriver, and hit the end of the crankshaft with a SOFT hammer- do not use a steel hammer, you'll mushroom the end of the crankshaft and will not be able to reinstall the clutch. Be sure to install the Belleville washer correctly, or you'll shear the flywheel key.

http://cgi.ebay.com/Briggs-Stratton-Electronic-Ignition-Kit_W0QQitemZ330390493251QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item4cecced843

So that is it? I don't have to remove the flywheel to install?

Matt L · #28 02-07-2010, 05:49 PM

If a Magnetron coil fits, you could install it by simply disconnecting the points. There would be no real advantage in actually removing the points. You'll just hook the shut-off switch wire to the coil, without the wire going to the points (they go to the same place).

mpolli · #29 02-07-2010, 07:05 PM

Is that a shear pin in the picture?

Nate Stanley · #30 02-08-2010, 03:19 AM

Looks just like the old Briggs engine in my tiller. There will be a points set AND and condenser, you can get these in a tune-up kit from most outdoor power equipmment suppliers. I also have a socket to remove the recoil start device, and the flywheel "puller" is actually a spring loaded gizmo that you slip over the crankshaft. Smack it with a hammer and it shocks the flywheel off the shaft.

The points and condenser sit under an aluminum can beneath the flywheel. In my old unit, rainwater would leak in there and corrrode the points.

While you are getting parts, grab a few of the woodruff keys that locate the flywheel to the crankshaft. They are designed to fail if you strike a foreign object, and that will save the crank from damage.