Engine..or Motor? - Page 5 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

Benz Dr. · #61 03-06-2011, 02:50 PM

My understanding has always been that a motor uses an outside source of energy, be it electricity, steam, air, wind or others.
Engines create power from an energy source and convert it to mechanical power. So, in essence, you could have a coal fired turbine engine creating electrical power to run an electric motor 1,000 miles away. Noting connects the two except the transmission lines. In motors the energy source is not connected to the motor but is created elsewhere. Modern trains use diesel engines to power up generators that run electric motors.

If we REALLY want to get into a hornets nest just try telling someone their 57 Chev isn't a Classic car. It's not, it's a Milestone car, but the term Classic ( take your pick ) has become so over used that anything older than a toddler is classic these days.
The real, '' Full Classics '' from the 1930's are all but forgotten in the mix.

chilcutt · #62 03-06-2011, 07:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Benz Dr.

My understanding has always been that a motor uses an outside source of energy, be it electricity, steam, air, wind or others.
Engines create power from an energy source and convert it to mechanical power. So, in essence, you could have a coal fired turbine engine creating electrical power to run an electric motor 1,000 miles away. Noting connects the two except the transmission lines. In motors the energy source is not connected to the motor but is created elsewhere. Modern trains use diesel engines to power up generators that run electric motors.

If we REALLY want to get into a hornets nest just try telling someone their 57 Chev isn't a Classic car. It's not, it's a Milestone car, but the term Classic ( take your pick ) has become so over used that anything older than a toddler is classic these days.
The real, '' Full Classics '' from the 1930's are all but forgotten in the mix.

Thanks for that info. I have never heard the term 'Milestone car'.

MS Fowler · #63 03-06-2011, 08:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chilcutt

Thanks for that info. I have never heard the term 'Milestone car'.

Correct, IF you allow only the definition of "Classic" as propounded by the Classic Car Club of America (CCCA), which I do.
But language is a living thing as they tell us, so we should expect definitions to be degraded in normal use.
For those who care, here is a link to the definition, and complete list of all cars that meet the definition:
http://www.classiccarclub.org/pdfs/Why%20We%20Define%20Classic%20as%20We%20do.pdf

chilcutt · #64 03-06-2011, 08:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MS Fowler

Correct, IF you allow only the definition of "Classic" as propounded by the Classic Car Club of America (CCCA), which I do.
But language is a living thing as they tell us, so we should expect definitions to be degraded in normal use.
For those who care, here is a link to the definition, and complete list of all cars that meet the definition:
http://www.classiccarclub.org/pdfs/Why%20We%20Define%20Classic%20as%20We%20do.pdf

I didnt know you were a car buff, thats cool. I am sure you have heard of Woodward Avenues 'Dream Cruise'
When I look back at all the cars I owned, crashed, didnt take care of, sold, (lost in a title-for-title race).........
Aside from my benz, I still own a 57 Ford Fairlane, that is stored, and kept in my Brothers garage.

I still will use the word 'Engine', and will still say 'Classic Car' tho.

Benz Dr. · #65 03-06-2011, 11:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chilcutt

I didnt know you were a car buff, thats cool. I am sure you have heard of Woodward Avenues 'Dream Cruise'
When I look back at all the cars I owned, crashed, didnt take care of, sold, (lost in a title-for-title race).........
Aside from my benz, I still own a 57 Ford Fairlane, that is stored, and kept in my Brothers garage.

I still will use the word 'Engine', and will still say 'Classic Car' tho.

Yes, as many do. Mostly I don't mind so much as long as the person sort of understands that there is a real difference between the two. Most people don't, and really believe that their '85 Ford pickup is a Classic too.

One thing to remember: the ACCA was formed in 1952, long before most of this so called Classic stuff was even built. I usually hear something like, '' Who in the hell do those guys think they are, telling us our stuff ISN'T Classic and they're stuff IS? We were here first, ya know! ''

Keep in mind this is usually stated by a guy with a pot belly, drinking a beer, standing next to his street rod, POS, ( fill in the blank ).

chilcutt · #66 03-07-2011, 02:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Benz Dr.

Yes, as many do. Mostly I don't mind so much as long as the person sort of understands that there is a real difference between the two. Most people don't, and really believe that their '85 Ford pickup is a Classic too.

One thing to remember: the ACCA was formed in 1952, long before most of this so called Classic stuff was even built. I usually hear something like, '' Who in the hell do those guys think they are, telling us our stuff ISN'T Classic and they're stuff IS? We were here first, ya know! ''

Keep in mind this is usually stated by a guy with a pot belly, drinking a beer, standing next to his street rod, POS, ( fill in the blank ).

I suppose this argument could also be applied to what some people refer to as a 'Classic Movie'. In my mind a classic movie would be a film from pre- 1945, as opposed to someone saying..'The Deer Hunter' is a classic movie. Out of curiosity, could you tell us what/if any cars you own that are considerd classic?

MS Fowler · #67 03-07-2011, 06:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Benz Dr.

Yes, as many do. Mostly I don't mind so much as long as the person sort of understands that there is a real difference between the two. Most people don't, and really believe that their '85 Ford pickup is a Classic too.

One thing to remember: the ACCA was formed in 1952, long before most of this so called Classic stuff was even built. I usually hear something like, '' Who in the hell do those guys think they are, telling us our stuff ISN'T Classic and they're stuff IS? We were here first, ya know! ''

Keep in mind this is usually stated by a guy with a pot belly, drinking a beer, standing next to his street rod, POS, ( fill in the blank ).

When I am at a local car show ( Home Depot has one every Friday evening when the weather warms up), I just smile when people get all excited over a "classic" 57 Chev.
If I heard that same comment among a group of knowledgeable car historians, I might actually say something.

Benz Dr. · #68 03-07-2011, 09:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chilcutt

I suppose this argument could also be applied to what some people refer to as a 'Classic Movie'. In my mind a classic movie would be a film from pre- 1945, as opposed to someone saying..'The Deer Hunter' is a classic movie. Out of curiosity, could you tell us what/if any cars you own that are considerd classic?

Exactly none. I have a 190SL, 230SL 5 speed and a 3.5 coupe. Those are all Milestone cars.
I have about 25 parts cars ranging from a ' 52 300 to a 126 300SE. The old 300 and some 111 coupe parts cars I have would all fall into the Milestone definition but everything else is simply old cars. Anything pre 1972 might fall into Milestone level and is what I think of as being older cars.

Even Gullwings are not Classic cars, that's a Milestone as well. You have to go back to 540K and prewar before you get to Classic car status. A model T would be an antique car but not a Classic - too pedestrian and too many made. Think Auburn, ( not all of them ) Cord, Duesenberg, Pierce Arrow, Bugati, Horch and cars like that. High end, hand made, and few built. These cars were made during the '' Classic era '' of coach built cars. You often bought the frame with engine and then you went to any number of places that would custom build the body for you.

Compare those cars with the assembly line crap that poured out of Detroit during 50's to the 70's that your average guy considers '' classic '' and amost none of them even come close.

Benz Dr. · #69 03-07-2011, 09:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MS Fowler

When I am at a local car show ( Home Depot has one every Friday evening when the weather warms up), I just smile when people get all excited over a "classic" 57 Chev.
If I heard that same comment among a group of knowledgeable car historians, I might actually say something.

Interesting comment. The Home Depot crowd will know their cars and little else. In their mind they ARE knowledgeable and consider their stuff to be Classic while the ACCA are ones who stole the Classic name from them. They generally become hostile if you push it at all...... so I don't.

I tried to explain all of this on the 113 site and I got a Home Depot response. You'd think they would want to know that their cars are considered Milestones ( which is not bad, BTW ) and maybe get a little bit of automotive history? But it always fall into the same predictable rut like, that's what everyone calls them, that's what we call then over here, etc.

whunter · #70 03-07-2011, 10:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chilcutt

Thank you for the clarification. It would seem that some people are confused, and raise the argument..'Why is it called FORD MOTOR COMPANY'.
Automobile, Motorcycle, Truck assembly companys have these names as it represents the entire vehicle.
Each car company has a number of divisions, such as 'Detroit Deisel Allison-Engine Facility'...Ford-'Trenton Engine Plant'. etc..

Are there any mechanics here,or Automobile manufactureing people here who would like to substantiate whether the proper term is 'Engine, or Motor', when referring to a vehicles power-plant?

Engine.

a. A machine that converts energy into mechanical force or motion.
b. Such a machine distinguished from an electric, spring-driven, or hydraulic motor by its use of a fuel.

whunter · #71 03-07-2011, 10:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by layback40

Mr Chilcutt didnt like some of the following in another thread, hence this thread.

I think I would be asking a few English teachers for their opinion of what is the appropriate use of "engine" & "motor" before I would take the view of a Singapore night club disk jock !!
We seldom hear of an electric engine, that dosent make a petrol motor an incorrect expression.

Are you saying that General Motors only makes electric motors ?
Interestingly Detroit Engine & Turbine Company have made electric motors. I dont know if they still do.
Toyota Motor Company ?
Ford Motor Company?
Yamaha Motor Company?
Motor bikes?
National Motor Museum?
Motor shows?
Motor Homes?

The words "motor" & "engine" are generic terms and in most cases are interchangeable.

To ask the question;
"Is the correct word for the powerplant in a car, truck, or motorcycle called an engine, or a motor?"
Is nothing more than an attempt to generate a division. Depending where you are, where you grew up & where you were educated both could be correct. It is very divisive to try and call one correct & the other not.
There are plenty of other words that one could do the same thing with.
For example "Sister" or "Nun".
For those with a strong chemistry background ; Is Manganese a metal?

Its interesting to see what parts of modern society have a need for strict right & wrong as destinct from shades of gray.

There is only one correct name for the internal combustion "ENGINE".

whunter · #72 03-07-2011, 10:43 AM

Little known fact.

Detroit is known as the Motor City because for many years "ALL" electric motors where made here.

Edison, GE, and thousands of other companies produced Billions of electric motors here, at one time every industrial block had several motor manufacturers.

Consider...
How many electric motors are on the average automobile today?

Consider...
Automobile manufacturers such as FORD, GM, Chrysler, etc, made/make a percentage of their income selling direct current electric motors.

Mike D · #73 03-07-2011, 11:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by whunter

Engine.

a. A machine that converts energy into mechanical force or motion.
b. Such a machine distinguished from an electric, spring-driven, or hydraulic motor by its use of a fuel.

Hey! Don't ruin a perfectly good discussion thread with facts!

Don't make me start an "oil", "coolant" or freon thread. Let us have our mild disagreements in peace.