Disease...??? - Page 2 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

davidmash · #16 05-31-2011, 12:39 PM

I do not know what they are but to place them on the same level as say cancer, MS, or any other genetic type disorder some how seems a bit wrong to me. I have a hard time equating an addiction to a disease. Exerting self control will not make MS go away, it can make a eating disorder go away. Big difference in my opinion.

I also think part of the classification falls into the "not wanting to hurt peoples feeling' category. If it's a disease, a person is not responsible for their actions, if it's an addiction issue, then it is at least partially your fault.

aklim · #17 05-31-2011, 01:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by davidmash

I do not know what they are but to place them on the same level as say cancer, MS, or any other genetic type disorder some how seems a bit wrong to me. I have a hard time equating an addiction to a disease. Exerting self control will not make MS go away, it can make a eating disorder go away. Big difference in my opinion.

I also think part of the classification falls into the "not wanting to hurt peoples feeling' category. If it's a disease, a person is not responsible for their actions, if it's an addiction issue, then it is at least partially your fault.

The PRINCIPLE is the same as with what I read a few years ago about NAMBLA wanting to classify themselves as homosexual men. After all, it is about 2 males going at it, right? Why would they want the classification? SYMPATHY. It is easier to feel sympathetic to someone who is ostracized because he is gay as opposed to someone who is ostracized because he likes little boys. So, if I am going to be unpopular, it might be best if I link myself up with a less objectionable group. I have MS so I can't have much output at work. You need to feel sympathy for me when I am slower and cannot get things done. If I have an addiction to heroine, you might not care. OTOH, if I classify it as a disease, it puts it in the same class as MS so you might be more forgiving when I am late for work or not at my peak.

That is EXACTLY it IMO. Think about this. If we didn't give any breaks to people who had this "disease" in court and their punishment was the same either way, do you believe that Mindfawks (psychology or psychiatry) will be so widely used? Before ADD or ADHD, a lot of kids behavior was blamed on sugar. "Oh, Johnny was a monster because he ate too much candy.". What a load of crap. The Lunar New Year is 15 days of sweet stuff. Families who celebrate it would be having kids go amok. Predominantly Chinese areas would be having to have the riot squads out ever LNY. Unfortunately for the Mindfawks, telling the parents "Johnny is a brat because you did a crap job of raising him" doesn't sell as well as blaming a disease that is God's fault. If the Mindfawk did that, the parents would go to another more sympathetic or disease blaming Mindfawk and the first guy would lose money. So why not. Blame a disease that is nobody's fault.

aklim · #18 05-31-2011, 02:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Craig

I do know that most employers offer treatment, as opposed to disciplinary action, to employees with substance abuse issues; I assume they have some legal requirement to treat these conditions as a medical condition of some type.

EXACTLY. Wanna bet that if the outcome was the same, nobody would bother with the DSM? Remember Michael Fay who tried the "Classic American Defense" and blamed it on ADD? Singapore govt said "6 strokes. Since you have ADD, 6 strokes". What did our friend do once he got back? Almost blew himself up freebasing Cocaine.

layback40 · #19 05-31-2011, 09:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aklim

The PRINCIPLE is the same as with what I read a few years ago about NAMBLA wanting to classify themselves as homosexual men. After all, it is about 2 males going at it, right? Why would they want the classification? SYMPATHY. It is easier to feel sympathetic to someone who is ostracized because he is gay as opposed to someone who is ostracized because he likes little boys. So, if I am going to be unpopular, it might be best if I link myself up with a less objectionable group. I have MS so I can't have much output at work. You need to feel sympathy for me when I am slower and cannot get things done. If I have an addiction to heroine, you might not care. OTOH, if I classify it as a disease, it puts it in the same class as MS so you might be more forgiving when I am late for work or not at my peak.

That is EXACTLY it IMO. Think about this. If we didn't give any breaks to people who had this "disease" in court and their punishment was the same either way, do you believe that Mindfawks (psychology or psychiatry) will be so widely used? Before ADD or ADHD, a lot of kids behavior was blamed on sugar. "Oh, Johnny was a monster because he ate too much candy.". What a load of crap. The Lunar New Year is 15 days of sweet stuff. Families who celebrate it would be having kids go amok. Predominantly Chinese areas would be having to have the riot squads out ever LNY. Unfortunately for the Mindfawks, telling the parents "Johnny is a brat because you did a crap job of raising him" doesn't sell as well as blaming a disease that is God's fault. If the Mindfawk did that, the parents would go to another more sympathetic or disease blaming Mindfawk and the first guy would lose money. So why not. Blame a disease that is nobody's fault.

X2
Its now not ADHD any more, its asperger's . What ever happened to just saying the child is bad behaved?
Funny how when these kids get to the work force these problems all go away.
Maybe they could be all summed up as attention seeking behavior. That goes for most of the druggies as well. ~ hey look at me I am an idiot !!!!

tonkovich · #20 05-31-2011, 09:58 PM

as my friend said, after he spent three months in "rehab": "let's be honest, i was in a mental institution. because i have mental problems. that i treated with crack cocaine and scotch."

i mean no offense to anyone by quoting him. to me, focusing on the "self medicating" ignores the underlying problems, which may be depression, anxiety, bi-polar disorder, post-traumatic stress disorder etc. which usually have their roots in one's childhood or adolescence, and involve neglect or abuse.

aklim · #21 05-31-2011, 10:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by layback40

X2
Its now not ADHD any more, its asperger's . What ever happened to just saying the child is bad behaved?

Funny how when these kids get to the work force these problems all go away.

Maybe they could be all summed up as attention seeking behavior. That goes for most of the druggies as well. ~ hey look at me I am an idiot !!!!

Sorry, I guess I haven't been keeping up with the "flavor of the day" when it comes to these so called diseases. I tend to see Mindfawks as "excuse peddlers".

Well, if the problems don't go away, they get fired so.

I don't believe so. There is only so far excuses will go at work.

tbomachines · #22 05-31-2011, 10:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by layback40

X2
Its now not ADHD any more, its asperger's . What ever happened to just saying the child is bad behaved?
Funny how when these kids get to the work force these problems all go away.
Maybe they could be all summed up as attention seeking behavior. That goes for most of the druggies as well. ~ hey look at me I am an idiot !!!!

Yeah, I'm sure all those autistic kids are just acting out so they get attention

tbomachines · #23 05-31-2011, 10:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tonkovich

as my friend said, after he spent three months in "rehab": "let's be honest, i was in a mental institution. because i have mental problems. that i treated with crack cocaine and scotch."

i mean no offense to anyone by quoting him. to me, focusing on the "self medicating" ignores the underlying problems, which may be depression, anxiety, bi-polar disorder, post-traumatic stress disorder etc. which usually have their roots in one's childhood or adolescence, and involve neglect or abuse.

x2. A lot of people are very quick to judge, especially if they have not experienced addiction themselves. Its a severe mental issue when you repeatedly do something to physically harm yourself.

The Swede · #24 05-31-2011, 11:01 PM

I often think depression is a load of bull and meds make it worse. When they clean up and get off psychotropics, start eating right, good sleep hygiene and exercise- things start to turn around.

Hatterasguy · #25 05-31-2011, 11:18 PM

Its a disease, no different than drugs, alcohol, eating disorders, or internet addiction for that mater.

They are mental issues, and extremely damaging to the people and there families.

All are terminal if not treated.

tonkovich · #26 05-31-2011, 11:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Swede

I often think depression is a load of bull and meds make it worse. When they clean up and get off psychotropics, start eating right, good sleep hygiene and exercise- things start to turn around.

obviously, you have never experienced depression. for those who have, we - yes, i said we - would say that you should consider yourself very lucky. as for meds, i would say they are a necessary evil. imperfect, but sometimes one's only option. as to the behaviorist / cognitive approach you seem (excuse me if i am inferring incorrectly) to be suggesting, i will only say that i have always found such approaches seem to ignore the "soul" of the individual, and the "journey" of said soul.

aklim · #27 06-01-2011, 12:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tbomachines

Yeah, I'm sure all those autistic kids are just acting out so they get attention

Isn't autism a neural disorder? Kinda like being born with a birthmark?

aklim · #28 06-01-2011, 12:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tbomachines

x2. A lot of people are very quick to judge, especially if they have not experienced addiction themselves. Its a severe mental issue when you repeatedly do something to physically harm yourself.

OK. I had an addiction that I have fixed, Same with Dad and Adopted Dad and good friend. Enough points to make a judgment?

aklim · #29 06-01-2011, 12:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hatterasguy

Its a disease, no different than drugs, alcohol, eating disorders, or internet addiction for that mater.

They are mental issues, and extremely damaging to the people and there families.

All are terminal if not treated.

Drs Remmington, Winchester or CCI all have cures for those "illnesses"