Britains wind farms - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

pj67coll · #1 08-22-2011, 02:42 PM

Any body here up on the issue of the off shore wind farms the brits are supposed to be developing to provide "clean" energy as part of their committment to "Europe"? I hadn't heard of the issue till my brother e-mailed me about it.

Does not seem to be a well thought out plan from what I can gather.

- Peter.

padrino · #2 08-22-2011, 03:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pj67coll

Any body here up on the issue of the off shore wind farms the brits are supposed to be developing to provide "clean" energy as part of their committment to "Europe"? I hadn't heard of the issue till my brother e-mailed me about it.

Does not seem to be a well thought out plan from what I can gather.

- Peter.

Don't know about "offshore" but I am just back from Scotland and they have wind turbines all over the place, Close to Glasgow we counted 65 in one field alone. They are about 300 feet high and working on full capacity.

have a look Peter:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wind_power_in_Scotland

pj67coll · #3 08-22-2011, 03:31 PM

I saw a few when I was in England last year as well. But I'm talking about an apparently ill convieved plan to generate a third of the countries power from wind by 2020 at a cost that's supposedly 22 times greater than present power costs. Just doesn't seem sane to me especially if they have to build backup fossil fuel plants for when the wind doesn't blow.

- Peter.

spdrun · #4 08-22-2011, 03:33 PM

Better than the US's "agenda" of coal-Coal-Clean Coal-More Coal, throw some cheap oil in, and renewables for window dressing only. At least other countries are trying to be responsible.

SwampYankee · #5 08-22-2011, 03:49 PM

I don't know about Britain's, but they've been trying to build a 130 turbine one off the MA coast for quite awhile now (Cape Wind Project).

According to their numbers, the turbines begin generation at 8 mph and conditions in Nantucket Sound are such that they would be rotating and generating energy 86% of the time and provide 75% of the power demand.

Interestingly, Ted Kennedy was instrumental in the fight against it.

spdrun · #6 08-22-2011, 03:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SwampYankee

Interestingly, Ted Kennedy was instrumental in the fight against it.

One more reason to hate the old murdering drunkard (RIP).

pj67coll · #7 08-22-2011, 04:54 PM

Well the ciritcs of the British proposal claim that the existing wind farms have never provided more than 21 percent of their claimed capacity. Not that they cannot do so under ideal circumstances mind you but that there are very seldom ideal circumstances. Problem being you need strong wind blowing all the time without which they are white elephants. Also considering the amount of surface area required to meet these stated goals its not surprising that many are up in arms about it. It's one thing to have a few windmills around, quite another to have them literally ruining the landscape across the entire island. They also dont appear to be economically feasible. Thus massive tax increases would be required to subsidise them. Of course this comes from the critics but that doesn't mean they aren't correct given that the policy seems driven by the governments committment to the EU's eco-freakism rather than sound energy policy or economic sense.

- Peter.

Hatterasguy · #8 08-22-2011, 04:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SwampYankee

I don't know about Britain's, but they've been trying to build a 130 turbine one off the MA coast for quite awhile now (Cape Wind Project).

According to their numbers, the turbines begin generation at 8 mph and conditions in Nantucket Sound are such that they would be rotating and generating energy 86% of the time and provide 75% of the power demand.

Interestingly, Ted Kennedy was instrumental in the fight against it.

Nah the NIMBY's think electricity is magic, just plug in their Iphone charger and it works! The thought that it has to come from somewhere doesn't really register with them.

Ted didn't want his view spoiled.

spdrun · #9 08-22-2011, 05:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pj67coll

Thus massive tax increases would be required to subsidise them. Of course this comes from the critics but that doesn't mean they aren't correct given that the policy seems driven by the governments committment to the EU's eco-freakism rather than sound energy policy or economic sense.

"Eco-freaks" is just doublespeak for "environmentalists" from people who care more about money than the planet. Better that high taxes subsidize renewable energy research (as the tech is improved, efficiency will increase, but we've got to start somewhere) than the murder of people in the Middle East for the sake of a black, toxic liquid.

pj67coll · #10 08-22-2011, 07:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spdrun

"Eco-freaks" is just doublespeak for "environmentalists" from people who care more about money than the planet. Better that high taxes subsidize renewable energy research (as the tech is improved, efficiency will increase, but we've got to start somewhere) than the murder of people in the Middle East for the sake of a black, toxic liquid.

No.Envinronmentalists, at least theoretically, have a grip on reality and might understand that human technical civilization is not ever going to be in balance with nature absent humans. Eco-freaks, are not capable of such rational thought and dont care what damage they do to human civilizatoin in persuit of their agenda.

- Peter.

TwitchKitty · #11 08-24-2011, 09:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pj67coll

No.Envinronmentalists, at least theoretically, have a grip on reality and might understand that human technical civilization is not ever going to be in balance with nature absent humans. Eco-freaks, are not capable of such rational thought and dont care what damage they do to human civilizatoin in persuit of their agenda.

- Peter.

Paraphrase please, rewrite. I think there is more here than I am getting.

TwitchKitty · #12 08-24-2011, 09:59 AM

I like the sounds of the home fuel cell and solar with geothermal HVAC. Home wind power where efficient. Transmission lines are archaic.

Oil and power company lobbyists will enforce protectionist stategies until the bitter end. Once again, until the corrupt system of lobbying is corrected expect little significant improvement.

spdrun · #13 08-24-2011, 10:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TwitchKitty

I like the sounds of the home fuel cell and solar with geothermal HVAC. Home wind power where efficient. Transmission lines are archaic.

Great if you live where you have enough land for that. Also, if you have a network, you can move power between areas that have wind at the moment and areas that don't.

pj67coll · #14 08-24-2011, 10:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TwitchKitty

I like the sounds of the home fuel cell and solar with geothermal HVAC. Home wind power where efficient. Transmission lines are archaic.

Oil and power company lobbyists will enforce protectionist stategies until the bitter end. Once again, until the corrupt system of lobbying is corrected expect little significant improvement.

Home solar, hell yeah. Every damm house in the US especially where I live should have solar roofs. There's no excuse not to at all. But wind is never going to be anything thane a nice auxilliary supply when it actually blows. It will never replace real power generation in sufficient quantitiy no matter how much money you waste on it. It's not a technology that you can improve efficiencies of because fundamentally you have no control over wether or how the wind will actually blow.

- Peter.

Stretch · #15 08-24-2011, 01:27 PM

Peter when you visited the UK did you ever go to Wales or Scotland?

I've never known a sunny day or a day without wind in either of those countries... both utterly miserable places in my opinion. So fill 'em up with windmills and then start inventing converting rain into electricity machines - they would be stupid not to use their most abundant natural resources!