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  #1  
Old 12-15-2012, 10:25 PM
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Earth's Magnetic Field Declining. Results...?

Any geophysicists here?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4XNMCTBdQtk

Watching this video raised a question. When a magnet is heated it looses it's magnetism, that is, if it had any to start with...I was told this by my science teacher many moons ago and have learned so when permanent magnet electric motors overheat.

Being 2000 miles down, no one can go see what state it is..

So, being as 'they' believe the earth's core is a molten sphere, how come it is giving off a magnetic field...magnetosphere, that is a very effective shield from solar radiation ?


One final question...Is this magnetism the same thing as gravity ? Nothing I have read explains what phenomenon gravity is.


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  #2  
Old 12-15-2012, 10:35 PM
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Old 12-15-2012, 11:08 PM
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Einsteins theory of gravity that was accepted as fact for decades.. The bending of light creates it I believe was the one . Has been discredited not that long ago.

I am not sure even if there are any new ideals about gravity with much merit. One large mystery that mankind still struggles with.

If the earths magnetic field is weakening. Since the earth is pretty much static or at least in the relatively short time frame man lives in. There may still be an unknown component that we have no ideal of what it is. We know there have to be things that are totally unknown as they leave some evidence of their existance. The true cause of gravity may be one of them.

I suspect the earths magnetic field could be subject to one of these at present unknown issues. It is somewhat strange that gravity the effects of it that are so easily understood. Yet the how it is generated remain unknown. That alone to me indicates that gravity may be based on some form of currently unknown or understood agent as well.

Einstein was cautioned about working on the problem of gravity. As the greatest minds that ever existed had tried before and failed in all their attempts to find the cause.

It is impossable to estimate just how much man will learn in his remaining time on the earth. There is also no way to estimate how much longer we humans will inhabit this planet.

More has been learnt in the last 100 years perhaps than in all the previous recorded time of mans existance on the planet. I wonder if we were given the oportunity to look at the world a thousand years from now what suprises we would see.

Not too much is predictable with any accuracy I feel. To me it is the same as a person might have thought a thousand years ago. The present period might overload that individual. What we take for granted would seem beyond his wildest imagination or even perception I suspect.

It is not acceptable to say from a scientific viewpoint that gravity just is what it is. Yet that might pretty well sum up the accurate knowledge at this point in time. This does leave a door open for a major discovery though at some point. Or perhaps still a lot of them. Some things they are able to examine now are scary in many ways. We have magnetic poles and a magnetic effect present. Plus of course iron in high quantity in the world.

This does not mean that a magnet as we know them is the only thing that might exist to produce the effect. We can only relate or link magnatisim to our current knowledge that may be very inadaquate.

It is pretty bad when the status of you dropping something and it hits the ground. We have to be content with just calling it the gravity effect. We apparently do not have a clue of the why it does this.

Last edited by barry12345; 12-15-2012 at 11:30 PM.
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  #4  
Old 12-15-2012, 11:19 PM
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Originally Posted by dkveuro View Post
One final question...Is this magnetism the same thing as gravity ? Nothing I have read explains what phenomenon gravity is.
No. What comes to mind is wood is affected by gravity but not magnets. In the Newtonian sense, anyway.

Minute Physics: What is Gravity? - YouTube

As barry12345 said, though, saying that gravity bends light is a mischaracterization of what actually occurs.

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Old 12-15-2012, 11:21 PM
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No. What comes to mind is wood is affected by gravity but not magnets. In the Newtonian sense, anyway.

Minute Physics: What is Gravity? - YouTube

As barry12345 said, though, saying that gravity bends light is a mischaracterization of what actually occurs.

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Old 12-15-2012, 11:24 PM
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My puzzle is, as follows :

Gravity is known to effect light photons and seeing a star light years away is no reference to where it actually is, due to the path the photons had to take...past large masses......besides the time since the photon started it journey.

So, if gravity is an effect, why are we not able to shield ourselves from it ?
Say by standing on 10 feet thick lead floor. ? Gravity seems to work not in a direct linear manner. It's influence seems to be relative to the density of the earth beneath (Solid granite vs sand.) or the distance from it.

Are we pushed down, or are we pulled down ?

Still does not answer the earth's liquid core being a magnet.

Perhaps I should heed the advice given to Albert !


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  #7  
Old 12-15-2012, 11:30 PM
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Very small rocks!

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  #8  
Old 12-15-2012, 11:38 PM
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Originally Posted by dkveuro View Post
My puzzle is, as follows :

Gravity is known to effect light photons and seeing a star light years away is no reference to where it actually is, due to the path the photons had to take...past large masses......besides the time since the photon started it journey.

So, if gravity is an effect, why are we not able to shield ourselves from it ?
Say by standing on 10 feet thick lead floor. ? Gravity seems to work not in a direct linear manner. It's influence seems to be relative to the density of the earth beneath (Solid granite vs sand.) or the distance from it.

Are we pushed down, or are we pulled down.

Still does not answer the earth's liquid core being a magnet.

Perhaps I should heed the advice given to Albert !


.
Gravity (whatever it is) is a affectation of mass. To balance a frce vector one must introduce a force (magnitude and direction) proportionate to the displacement one seeks.

Magnetism is a result of charged alignments of atoms within a volume and is also a function of the direction and magnitude of current (atomic factors which can be ignored, depending on scale). Gravity is a function of mass, regardless of charge.

One could shield a volume of space by exactly replication (and opposite sign) the space-time distortion plus the magnetic force in a sign-opposite direction.
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Old 12-15-2012, 11:43 PM
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Originally Posted by Botnst View Post
Gravity (whatever it is) is a affectation of mass. To balance a frce vector one must introduce a force (magnitude and direction) proportionate to the displacement one seeks.

Magnetism is a result of charged alignments of atoms within a volume and is also a function of the direction and magnitude of current (atomic factors which can be ignored, depending on scale). Gravity is a function of mass, regardless of charge.

One could shield a volume of space by exactly replication (and opposite sign) the space-time distortion plus the magnetic force in a sign-opposite direction.

Yeah. What 'e said.

Hi Bonst. If that was an attempt to edumicate me, I must admit I still don't understand.
Can you answer my last two questions please? Thank you....btw..another Monty Python fan.



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Old 12-16-2012, 12:01 AM
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Liquid core?

That's a fair point. Being a botanist rather than a geophycist does not impede my willingness to speculate ....

A model

Imagine a rotating semisolid ferrous mass. The rotation is a vector (constant magnitude and direction). The core flows with respect to the velocity and direction of the rotation. This is the origin of the magnetic flux about the Earth.

Liquid core in rotation will establish channels of flow. The flow channels are equivalent to a dynamo (a coil of solid wires oriented to a magnet).

To balance that force vector one would seek equal and opposite vectors oriented with respect to rotation direction and velocity)
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Old 12-16-2012, 12:13 AM
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Martha Lewis was at home with her two daughters when she heard a loud noise. It was 3 a.m., so Lewis immediately called police and grabbed her gun. She went to her daughters’ room and told them each to get something with which to defend themselves. They were at the top of the stairs when a man, who had kicked in the door and entered the home, spotted them. When the man started up the stairs toward them, Lewis warned the intruder that she would shoot him. When he ignored her warnings, Lewis fired causing him to stumble outside where police found him. The 25-year-old male was hospitalized in stable condition. After the incident, Lewis said, “There’s so much talk about banning guns and gun control, but they’re for protection. There’s no way that I could have fought him off.” (The Blaze, Dora, AL, 8/17/12)
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Old 12-16-2012, 12:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Botnst View Post
Martha Lewis was at home with her two daughters when she heard a loud noise. It was 3 a.m., so Lewis immediately called police and grabbed her gun. She went to her daughters’ room and told them each to get something with which to defend themselves. They were at the top of the stairs when a man, who had kicked in the door and entered the home, spotted them. When the man started up the stairs toward them, Lewis warned the intruder that she would shoot him. When he ignored her warnings, Lewis fired causing him to stumble outside where police found him. The 25-year-old male was hospitalized in stable condition. After the incident, Lewis said, “There’s so much talk about banning guns and gun control, but they’re for protection. There’s no way that I could have fought him off.” (The Blaze, Dora, AL, 8/17/12)
Well gravity made him fall when he lost the strength to resist it I suppose. Adding to his new mass where the bullets of course.
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  #13  
Old 12-17-2012, 04:28 PM
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Einsteins theory of gravity that was accepted as fact for decades.. The bending of light creates it I believe was the one . Has been discredited not that long ago.
Einsteins theory of gravity has not been discredited to my knowledge? Where did you hear this?


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  #14  
Old 12-17-2012, 05:28 PM
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It was the idea that photons are affected by gravity and therefore must have mass that was debunked. I haven't been in a physics class in a few decades so I'm sure there is fresher thinking but this is what I found - Gravitational lens - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

One fellow put it in terms that make sense to even me -

Quote:
Even though a photon has a zero mass, it is still affected by gravity. In particular, we can see the effect of gravity on light in a phenomenon called "gravitational lensing," in which a massive object warps spacetime such that it bends light. Light passing through the gravitational lens can be bent such that the light takes multiple paths and we end up observing artifacts of this effect.

The first gravitational lens was discovered in 1979 even though Einstein predicted the effects of a gravitational lens in his general theory of relativity several decades earlier. In the case of the Twin Quasar, a galaxy between the star and ourselves acts as a gravitational lens and we end up with the observation of two identical objects in the sky.

Similarly, truly massive objects like black holes have escape velocities that exceed the speed of light. That is, their gravity is such that light cannot move away from the black hole's gravitational field.

What these examples illustrate is that photons, like everything else, follow the straightest possible path through spacetime, and when spacetime is warped or bent by massive objects, the photons adhere to this curvature. We often think of gravity affecting objects based on their mass, and since photons have 0 mass it seems counterintuitive to suggest that light is affected by gravity. There is still much to be learned about light and gravity, but for now we must conclude that light is affected by gravity, even if you consider conformity to spacetime curvature as "indirect" effect compared to, say, our gravitational attraction to the Earth.
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  #15  
Old 12-17-2012, 06:25 PM
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It was the idea that photons are affected by gravity and therefore must have mass that was debunked.
S if I read that quoted text correctly if gravity is distorting space time itself it is not the photons that are affected by it but merely the path they travel thru a distorted space time.

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