Mrs. Jesus - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

elchivito · #1 10-01-2012, 04:17 PM

I've been reading about this supposed fragment of papyrus that seems to indicate Jesus may have had a wife. Someone named Mary. Church sponsored experts are now coming out of the woodwork proclaiming it to be fake in spite of it's C14 documented age. Why are they threatened? Why is Jesus' supposed celibacy so crucial to his being seen as the savior?

Even as a practicing Catholic in my younger years, I can remember being puzzled by the notion that he didn't marry. Rabbis, then and now were not expected to remain single. It was once suggested by an old aunt that I was possessed for even bringing such a question up in open conversation. If you're christian, why does Jesus' marital status matter? Or does it?

pj67coll · #2 10-01-2012, 04:21 PM

If you're catholic it's because the whole celibacy of the priesthood bull**** is based upon that. If you're some other xtian cult I have no idea.

- Peter.

tbomachines · #3 10-01-2012, 04:21 PM

At least they're arguing he was married and it wasn't some drunk hook-up?

kerry · #4 10-01-2012, 04:28 PM

The early Christian church had an extremely ascetic attitude towards marriage for the first few hundred years, even going so far as to encourage marriages without sex so the partners could remain pure. If Jesus was married, it suggest that some of the most early exponents of Christianity which were central to the development of the institution of Latin Christianity were at odds with Jesus practice regarding marriage and sex.

elchivito · #5 10-01-2012, 04:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pj67coll

If you're catholic it's because the whole celibacy of the priesthood bull**** is based upon that. If you're some other xtian cult I have no idea.

- Peter.

That's certainly the standard explanation for lots of lay Catholics.

This is an interesting Jewish angle on it. Some Jewish sages in the first century postponed marriage until their 30s or after, traveling around as itinerant teachers and preachers. So maybe Jesus just got himself killed before he had time to marry.

http://www.jerusalemperspective.com/1155

Dudesky · #6 10-01-2012, 04:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tbomachines

At least they're arguing he was married and it wasn't some drunk hook-up?

LOL, that's a good one.

C14 dating of broken wine casks all over the floor.

elchivito · #7 10-01-2012, 04:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kerry

The early Christian church had an extremely ascetic attitude towards marriage for the first few hundred years, even going so far as to encourage marriages without sex so the partners could remain pure. If Jesus was married, it suggest that some of the most early exponents of Christianity which were central to the development of the institution of Latin Christianity were at odds with Jesus practice regarding marriage and sex.

At what point did Jesus' celibacy become central to faith? For most lay christians today is it just sort of an inconsequential fact, and not that important?

I've often wondered how those early christians thought they were going to fare down the road, with no kids. "How's the whole Shaker thing doing for you??"

Celibacy of course isn't just a christian concept. Lots of spiritual traditions eschew sex, if not marriage entirely, during ceremonial and other times. In my wife's culture, men who are preparing for ceremonies may not sleep with their wives or even touch them for 14 days before the ceremony. They abstain from salt and meat as well.

panZZer · #8 10-01-2012, 04:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pj67coll

If you're catholic it's because the whole celibacy of the priesthood bull**** is based upon that. If you're some other xtian cult I have no idea.

- Peter.

Celabicy dosent include little boys for catholic prists.

greazzer · #9 10-01-2012, 05:03 PM

If this was common information, then why is there only one little fragment which purports to evidence Jesus had a wife ? One would think "that" information would have been in a lot of "fragments" which surfaced here and there. I wonder who found this little tidbit of history and what they are going to gain from it. I am surprised that the special interest groups suggest Jesus had a wife. I bet their political agenda would be better served if they said Jesus' "partner" was a Andrew or Peter. That actually sounds more plausible in our special interest driven society. But then again, it seems as if it is more politically acceptable to not not even mention God's name anywhere or face a lawsuit or a government crackdown -- unless you're muslim then its OK. Thanks B.O. a/k/a B.S ... I wounder if the administration was behind this historical artifact coming to the surface ... ?

kerry · #10 10-01-2012, 05:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by elchivito

At what point did Jesus' celibacy become central to faith? For most lay christians today is it just sort of an inconsequential fact, and not that important?

I'd say St Paul's general attitude towards sex and marriage started the move towards repressive views of sexuality in the early Church. Not sure exactly when Christians began to explicitly believe that Jesus was celibate and turn it into an article of faith. The importance of the fragment is not that it proves that Jesus actually had a wife. The person who found it and wrote about it does not think it actually indicates anything about whether Jesus was actually married or not. If it's authentic, it's just a fragment which shows that the ascetic majority in early Christianity wasn't the only one. I think it's important because certainly most modern Christians have no sympathy whatsoever with the view that Christians need to be celibate in order to be a Christian.

tbomachines · #11 10-01-2012, 05:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by greazzer

If this was common information, then why is there only one little fragment which purports to evidence Jesus had a wife ? One would think "that" information would have been in a lot of "fragments" which surfaced here and there. I wonder who found this little tidbit of history and what they are going to gain from it. I am surprised that the special interest groups suggest Jesus had a wife. I bet their political agenda would be better served if they said Jesus' "partner" was a Andrew or Peter. That actually sounds more plausible in our special interest driven society. But then again, it seems as if it is more politically acceptable to not not even mention God's name anywhere or face a lawsuit or a government crackdown -- unless you're muslim then its OK. Thanks B.O. a/k/a B.S ... I wounder if the administration was behind this historical artifact coming to the surface ... ?

What did I just read

Benz Fan · #12 10-01-2012, 07:27 PM

Think Jesus was ever at a corner bar, grousing to his neighbor about his wife's nagging?

Benz Fan · #13 10-01-2012, 07:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by panZZer

Celabicy dosent include little boys for catholic prists.

I attended a college prep school which employed Jesuits and lay people as teachers. When my 9th grade English teacher (layperson) was asked in class why he didn't become a priest, his answer was succinct: "I like girls"

Enough said.

Dudesky · #14 10-01-2012, 08:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by greazzer

If this was common information, then why is there only one little fragment which purports to evidence Jesus had a wife ? One would think "that" information would have been in a lot of "fragments" which surfaced here and there. I wonder who found this little tidbit of history and what they are going to gain from it. I am surprised that the special interest groups suggest Jesus had a wife. I bet their political agenda would be better served if they said Jesus' "partner" was a Andrew or Peter. That actually sounds more plausible in our special interest driven society. But then again, it seems as if it is more politically acceptable to not not even mention God's name anywhere or face a lawsuit or a government crackdown -- unless you're muslim then its OK. Thanks B.O. a/k/a B.S ... I wounder if the administration was behind this historical artifact coming to the surface ... ?

Jesus never got wood?

ah-kay · #15 10-01-2012, 08:26 PM

A new monk arrived at the monastery. He was assigned to help the other monks in copying the old texts by hand. He noticed, however, that they were copying copies, not the original books. The new monk went to the head monk to ask him about this. He pointed out that if there were an error in the first copy, that error would be continued in all of the other copies.

The head monk said, 'We have been copying from the copies for centuries, but you make a good point, my son.' The head monk went down into the cellar with one of the copies to check it against the original.

Hours later, nobody had seen him, so one of the monks went downstairs to look for him. He heard a sobbing coming from the back of the cellar and found the old monk leaning over one of the original books, crying.

He asked what was wrong.

'The word is 'celebrate,' not 'celibate'!' sobbed the head monk.