driving tips for the snow? - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

RG5384 · #1 01-14-2004, 01:44 PM

some friends and i are going to be making a trip up to north carolina to go skiing this weekend, and i don't think any of us have any snow-driving experiance. I consider myself a competent/aware driver, dont' follow closely etc, but what are some things to keep in mind when the wheels don't adhear to the road? I know basic skid control, and the car we are taking is fwd and has abs(97 mercury sable). I also know that you want to brake harder where there isn't ice and very lightly brake where there is ice. I've also heard that if you are coming up to a stop light and you can't get traction, that for some reason pulling the e-brake helps? I dont really understand the physics of that, but i've heard it from many people. I don't think any of us are going to have time or a place to go mess around in a parking lot(as fun as that would be), but what are some considerations to take into account? Also, should we make sure we have anti-freeze stuff in the windsheild resevoir? Please help us florida people lol,
Ryan

rickg · #2 01-14-2004, 02:28 PM

I h ave had regular windshield washer fluid freeze up on me( a real mess!), so make sure it's some kind of "winter grade" stuff.

Hatterasguy · #3 01-14-2004, 02:46 PM

Drive slowly! I have used the e-break to do a 360 on the snow. (Monday actualy

) Snow isn't bad if you take your time. Sometimes on a quite street I will hit my breaks hard in the morning to see how the conditions are. You should fit right in, most people up here don't know how to drive in the snow so down in NC you should be golden. I use the blue windshield washer fluid availible at most stores for 99 cents a gallon. It's good to -20. If you have just water in your system it will freeze in the lines or on the windshield. Have fun, I am going up to Gore on Sat. It is supposed to be like -10 at the base.

bobbyv · #4 01-14-2004, 03:28 PM

one thing to really watch out for are those unplowed slush piles on the highway, that collect between lanes (usually around 4-6 inches high). When travelling at city speeds, hitting one of these is no problem.

but hitting one of these with one of the front tires at highway speeds can make your car spin, with all the related consequences (e.g., you can careen out of control across the median into oncoming traffic). The reason this is dangerous is that slush is quite dense, and offers a lot of resistance to your tire at highway speeds. Hitting one of these piles at highway speeds imparts a torque on your vehicle, and with the reduced traction on your other tires, will make your vehicle spin.

the heavier your vehicle, the less susceptible it will be to this reaction, but one has to be aware that vehicle speed is another factor that contributes to this.

joshhol · #5 01-14-2004, 03:42 PM

I may be confused, but isn't antifreeze something you don't want on your paint? So putting in the resevoir and squirting it all over your car would be a bad call.

bobbyv · #6 01-14-2004, 05:13 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by RG5384
I also know that you want to brake harder where there isn't ice and very lightly brake where there is ice. I've also heard that if you are coming up to a stop light and you can't get traction, that for some reason pulling the e-brake helps? I dont really understand the physics of that, but i've heard it from many people.

since your car has ABS, you do not need to "brake lightly" on ice - the ABS takes care of this. Just keep the pedal mashed and remember that you still have some directional control, so if you think you cannot stop soon enough, at least you can steer out of trouble (or choose a less expensive target!).

if the parking brake operates on the wheels that are driven, then using it (partly engaged) will limit the spin of the wheel with less traction, relative to the other driven wheel (which is also being partially braked). In this regard, it is a very crude form of traction control/limited slip device.

if your car is FWD and the parking brake operates on the rears, then you are just shooting yourself in the foot.

if your car has traction control, then the above is unnecessary.

if you have to stop and come up to a patch of ice, and succeed in doing so, be aware that the car behind you will also have this problem. Braking early to allow for the possibility of black ice gives the driver behind you (via your brake lights) enough time to react as well. In this regard, keep your taillamps clean - it will get dirtied up by road salt.

What is particularly annoying are those SUV drivers who drive fast and tailgate you, falsely thinking that their 4wd drivetrain will give them better braking as well.

use sunglasses to reduce the glare from the snow and to enhance contrast (a brown shade works well for me)

bring a shovel in your trunk and an ice scraper/windshield brush.

420SEL · #7 01-14-2004, 05:37 PM

Slow down and give your self twice the space to stop as you think you need. You don't need to know anything more than that.

ak300td · #8 01-15-2004, 12:20 PM

I agree with PaulC.

Go slow! It's amazing how many wackos are on the road...the first snow of the year in Fairbanks and 1/2 of the drivers are standing by their vehicles in the ditch! It's like they forget how to drive on snow!

I wouldn't live without ABS (OK, I would for an 84 300d) but it can lull you into a false sense of security. All ABS does is prevent your tires from skidding, you have to determine when to apply the brakes to allow yourself enough stopping distance. In an emergency, hit the brakes as hard as you can and STEER for the softest landing.

ABS doesn't do anything to help you if you're skidding sideways. If your skidding sideways always steer TOWARD the direction of your skid. I personally do this without my foot on the brake until I regain control of the car then I slam on the brakes or power out in a different direction (without spinning the tires).

Spinning a tire in snow is the worst thing you can do since it heats the tire up, melts the snow, makes everything that much more slippery and may be digging a hole you have to get yourself out of. If you get stuck, the key is to GENTLY rock the vehicle (between Drive and Reverse) with your friends pushing. Give the car gas until the point just before the wheel begins to spin. Oh, and the very first thing to do is get out the shovel and clear a path for the tires, or use your feet if you've forgotten your shovel.

Spinning the tires when you're stuck makes many drivers feel good, but I always smile when they dig themselves a big hole then they hit dirt or pavement and then they wear 5,000 miles of rubber off their tires!

To learn about controlling the car in a skid, I recommend practicing

in a mall parking lot. Seriously. But don't get caught of course. This is the ONLY time to use the parking brake...it'll help you go into some wild spins that you can learn how to get yourself out of.

G-Benz · #9 01-15-2004, 02:04 PM

Although I live in Texas now, I did grow up with driving experience in winters living in Ohio, Michigan, Missouri, and Illinois.

Everyone here has given very good and accurate advice, so I don't have much to add.

But I will say this...unless it's snowing heavily at the time, if the roads aren't wet, they are icy 99% of the time!

The only vehicle that gets to drive through snow is the first one through the road. That vehicle compacts the snow under the tires, so the next vehicle that follows the tire line is essentially driving through compacted snow, which shortly melts with tire friction to form an icy path.

Your tires will provide some grip in snow, but in ice, you have just as much of a chance as the guy with the 8WD SUV!

That said, your objective is to look for snow if you find yourself losing control or grip...namely, head for shoulders or curb lines where snow is piled along the sides. At least, in an icy skid situation, you can get two of your tires a chance to get a grip on the road...

Jim Anderson · #10 01-15-2004, 02:34 PM

Traction control only works when you have traction:p

koop · #11 01-15-2004, 02:55 PM

watch for the one thing that always gets me

your driving down a nice plowed/ clear main road and turn onto an unplowed side street carrying too much speed. I do it at least once a winter

blackmercedes · #12 01-15-2004, 03:17 PM

Some very good advice here. Just a follow-up on the issue of electronic control systems.

I have ABS, and like it. It means braking on ice is a no-brainer. Just stomp the pedal. Howwever, when at full threshold braking on ice, even with ABS, you have little or no tractiona available for lateral movement. If you need an abrupt direction change, you have to go against your reflexes and release the brakes, steer, and then jump back on the binders.

ABS does not increase the traction available to your tires. It maximizes the use of what is there. Lousy and tires and ABS still mean long braking distances. If you're coming from a warm climate and driving on some snow, then returning to your warm climate, it might not make sense to buy snow tires. However, make sure the tires you do have will not be completely useless. Low profile high-speed rated tires are useless in snow. Not because of tread-depth, but becasue their compunds are designed to shed heat like crazy. They freeze rock hard as temps fall. Think of them as hockey-pucks!

ASR/ESP can assist a driver than might have wandered beyond the envelope of their own ability by a small margin, but they do not repeal the laws of physics. Overcook the corner, and it's over-cooked. They are like ABS in that cannot create traction where there is none.

Make sure you fill your car's gas tank when you get to snow land. Most oil companies produce different gasoline and diesel for different climates. Get some in the tank as soon as possible. Also, don't forget windscreen washer fluid that is rated for below freezing temps. NOT ANTI-FREEZE. It's washer fluid with an alcohol of some form to keep it from freezing.

Smooth is the key to keeping the shiny side up. Don't jerk the wheel, jam the brake pedal (unless panic stopping, then do) or snap the accelerator open. All your movements should be designed to not upset the stability of the vehicle.

Following distances should be at least double the normal, or even longer. Don't forget that most people that live in the snow belts drive like morons and maniacs just like eveywhere else. They're going to tailgate you, drive aggressively and cut you off. If you're being tailgated, make sure you leave even more room in front of you so that you don't end up with another car inside your trunk. People will curse you, but you arrive unscathed. Thick skin is required for safe winter driving in a city.

If you're going on the highway, buy an inexpensive winter safety kit. It's got some stuff like emergency blankets, candles, etc. I see them all the time for about $40. Worth it. Also, do you have AAA? They usually have road condition info available in snow-bound areas. Sometimes you just stay home.

Have a good trip.

need2speed · #13 01-15-2004, 04:32 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by blackmercedes
Overcook the corner, and it's over-cooked.

Amen to that, brother. If you take away one thing from all this great advice on driving in snow.....do your braking BEFORE you initiate a turn.

That practice became so ingrained for me that it was a real effort to learn trail-braking for track racing.

blackmercedes · #14 01-15-2004, 05:58 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by need2speed
...That practice became so ingrained for me that it was a real effort to learn trail-braking for track racing.

Dean, try learning trail braking on a motorcycle! I had raced motocross for years and was shocked at the new skills required for getting a bike around a paved course. Trail braking on a bike feels completely wrong until you make it work, and then you wonder how you ever coped without it!

When I learned to drive I used a friend's Datsun 510 on the Ice Highway between Tuk and Inuvik. I learned to negotiate corners "rally style" by right footing the gas and left footing the brake. The first time I drove in town I was amazed at how much traction there was!

Learning to drive in the snow-belt (or 99% of Canada) makes you a better overall driver, methinks. Well, actually, thinking of the morons on the Whitmud today, maybe not...