And have the security advisors watch "Hellboy" for additional confirmation of things to come...

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Absolument, cher!

We should refer to them as a party with whom we have some minor disagreement.

Also, we should call them, "Freedom Loving" Islamic f**king terrorists.


B

Aaaahhhh! You're a friend of Thomas Pickerings! You too, must be a bigot! I think bigotry is a sort of radiation problem that emenates from anybody who is ever called a racist. From that time until the second coming of Jesus, you're a bigot if you're within a handshake distance of the assumed bigot.

Unless you're a Democrat. Then its okay if you just say you're sorry.

Like Wallace and Byrd.

Also, if you're a friend of an accused bigot and say something nice about the accused, you're a bigot. Like Trent Lott. Unless you're a Democrat and from Connecticut. Then you its okay to say something nice about an old guy who used to be a clan member.

Hope I cleared this up in time that you can go on camera, rip your robes, and beg forgivness.

B

If they did, they wouldn't be the first administration to have a chat with him. Either Reagan or the first Bush has called him in. In spite of his background, he's also lectured at the CIA...

I don't know if you've ever read his stuff, but while his books are fiction, he's done a heckuva job of researching materials in an effort to make his books as realistic as possible. And, at the time of writing, every scenario he depicted could have actually happened.

I'll admit to also thinking of "Debt of Honor" the moment I heard that the crashes were a terrorist attack and not an accident...

Clancy is part of the pop culture, with many movies and other pedestrian tripe having come from his pen. The folly is proclaiming it impossible for anyone to have thought someone might do this. A well circulated recent work of fiction posed exactly the same situation. I'm not suggesting that the admin should consult novelists, but that they should watch their rhetoric when making such grand false proclamations.

So Bot, when did you become a proponent of the 'if you aren't with us you are against us' cult? shades of grey?

Freedom hating implies a desire on the part of the 'enemy' to eliminate freedom. It is simplistic and false. It is designed to ignite a red blooded american to get with the gang and jump to the cause, jingo all the way. Toby Kieth responded admirably.

This is a tactic used by every government when killing others. make them a threat. Red-skinned savages! Aboriginal devil worshipers! Witches! Commies! slap on a label that makes all in the group expendible. Its shameful.

One bit that the administration has been correct about is that the terrorists do hate our way of life. This is not identical with freedom... the 'way' that they hate is our expanding market capitalism and intrusive paternalism used to perpetuate our global economic superiority. for the record, they also rather detested the placement of american troops including women in the most holy cities in the islamic world.

The method by which they expressed these frustrations is absolutely unforgivable. but it does not detract from the fact that the frustrations could have some merit on their own. We're awfully arrogant in this world, and rarely reflective until it is too late.

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but they are! Bush just got rid of the turban-ed menace in the east! ha ha.

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Dr. Rice and Richard Clark do agree on the point that there was probably no single item that would have prevented the 9-11 attack.

What is distrubing and what this commission should be focusing on, is her statement that there are still legal and procedural impediments to the flow of intelligence between agencies. Those are the questions the commission should be investigating.

Beg pardon. Who was Thomas, a signer of the Declaration of Independence. Probably another southern bigot in any case.

Nice anecdotes.

My middle child's godfather was a member of the legislature in MS a long time ago and was on the Sovereignty Commission in its waning years. He said the gov (don't recall which) asked him to accept the appt because he (the gov) hated the commission and knew my late friend was a strong critic of it. He was also a liberal (southern standards) Democrat. And a lawyer. I didn't change my party affiliation until after he died. I just couldn't face the look of betrayal I'd get from him. A fine man and friend.

B

Here's a gentle note from your "Freedom Loving" Islamic f**king terrorists.....

This is
LONDON
08/04/04 - News and city section

'We will burn them alive'
By Colin Freeman, Evening Standard in Baghdad

Iraqi militants are today threatening to burn three foreign hostages to death unless their country quits the US-led coalition.

Two Japanese men and one woman are being held by a previously unknown group which has vowed to kill them if Japanese soldiers do not leave Iraq. Elsewhere, seven South Koreans are being held hostage west of Baghdad by an unknown group, while a British man has been reported missing in the south.

The plight of the Japanese hostages - two aid workers and one journalist was revealed in dramatic video footage shown on al-Jazeera TV. It showed the three surrounded by masked gunmen, who claimed to be from Saraya al-Mujahideen, "the squadrons of holy warriors".

A written statement said: "Three of your sons have fallen in our hands. We offer you two choices: either pull out your forces, or we will burn them alive.

We give you three days starting the day this tape is broadcast."

The tape showed three passports and in Tokyo an official confirmed the abductions. One of the two men was named as Noriaki Imai, thought to be an aid worker based in New York. The other, Soichiro Koriyama, is thought to work for the Weekly Asahi, Japan's best-selling news magazine. The woman was named as Nahoko Takato. Japan has 550 troops in Iraq in its first overseas deployment since the Second World War.

London-born Gary Teeley, 37, has disappeared in the increasingly anarchic city of Nasariyah, the Foreign Office said. He is thought to have been working for a Qatari firm providing non-military services.

B, I just read that on Drudge, it pisses me off to no end.

You know taht part about not considering ramming planes into buildings?

"Under questioning, Rice acknowledged that she had spoken too broadly once when she said that no one had ever envisioned terrorists using planes and crashing them into buildings. She said that aides came to her within days and said there had been reports or memos about that possibility, but that she hadn't seen them."

good. two years later. she's blameless for her ignorant comments specifically because she was ignorant?

where do I endorse the methods of the idiot extremist dead men walking who continue to perpetrate unspeakable acts of horror? Oh yeah, I don't.

But their motivation is not because they hate freedom. Its not related to freedom at all, but the latest case you bring up might be, seeing as the stated intent of their slaughter and kidknapping is to get a foreign occupation force out. They are not freedom loving or hating or polar on the issue at all. call them blood thirsty, call them whatever, but be truthful. freedom hating is just false and stupid. Islamic f***ing terrorists is fine with me. that rather fits the bill.

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Alright, I'll play.

What do Sharia and droits d'homme have in common?

If you could point those out, I'll ease-up on my belief that they are freedom-despising, Islamic f***ing terrorists. If you can show me which part the frigging Declaration of Independence makes common cause between Bin Laden and me, then I'll call them freedom loving Islamic f***ing terrorists.

B

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sharia

as with any esoteric enterprise run rampant, things can get out of hand. Seems a core part of the Sharia doctorine involves consensus. I'll not argue that this is the desired end of those who currently plot against us. History is rife with cases of people getting a little too excited about their belief system to the point that they start stomping on others. Right now, it is not hard to argue, there are two.

What is the desired actualization of one who hates freedom? it is difficult to imagine-

libertarians insist on liberty up until the point at which one begins to harm another. Is our military presence harming islam? We might not think so, but holy cities and armies of an alternate faith tradition make bad bedfellows. I bet catholics would go nuts if a group of pagans decided to throw a bbq at the vatican on good friday.

Im going to look at this a bit more- seems quite polarizing. Can you make a case that these islamic f***ing terrorists (I DO like that...) ARE freedom-hating?

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I think that's a rather pleasant characterizations of freedom. I doubt Bin Laden would believe it to be a good thing. That view of freedom casts a benign eye on many, many activities that would get one burned, stoned (in a lithic sense), hung, whipped, skewered with a sword, limbs detached, and decapitated in Bin's world.

I am no expert in sharia. If anybody knows anything at all, they can help immensely.

Sharia is a lot more (and less) than consensus, its consensus only within the group. That's great for group members but not so hot for outsiders. That is anathema to freedom.

Sharia does not acknowledge a separation from Islam and law. Law is an extension of Islam. This may be okay if one is muslim, not especially helpful for Christians and Jews, and distinctly bad news for every other religion and atheists. That is anathema to freedom.

Sharia demands separate rules for men and women. Within Islam, this is often argued as being different but equal but there are plenty of bizarre exceptions. That is anathema to freedom.

B