97 E420 engine pinging - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

brokebyducati · #1 09-23-2004, 09:58 AM

my wife's car is a 97 E420 w/ 89,000 miles on it - engine runs strong and pulls like a sonofa#@%&*, but when sitting at idle, there is a distinct "tic-tic-tic" sound. It's not constant, but occurs often enough that I recognized it. We are using 91 octane and oil level is perfect - local dealership suggested it may be a sticky lifter. Suggestions???

Gilly · #2 09-23-2004, 09:41 PM

Sorry to disagree. I am 90+% sure what you have is a problem with these small tubes the MB referrs to as "oil bridges". There are relatively easy to replace and not expensive, I'd either do them all or at least the all of them on the bank which seems noisiest. Do a search here at the site and you'll see more info and how-to-do-it stuff. This has been relatively common on these 119 engines.
YES those E420's sure do "pull" don't they?! One of my favorites.
Gilly

Gilly · #3 09-23-2004, 09:44 PM

Here is a good link to a thread on this topic:

http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/showthread.php?t=53532&highlight=119+oil+bridge

Gilly

Gilly · #4 09-24-2004, 05:07 AM

Hi
OH! Ok we're talking about the same thing, I wasn't sure what you meant by "oil guide". Oil BRIDGE is what they're usually referred to as in a shop.
I think you did OK and fixed it, people just don't realize how tough these motors really are. I heard there have been some of these engines radically modified for racing (unsure what the engines were used in, anyone know?) that were brought up to around 1000 hp (yes, 1000) with a stock block.
But I am hoping too that you didn't harm the engine. If the ticking is gone it's fixed. Hardest part of the job is r&r the valve covers(ps buy new valve cover gaskets when you buy the oil bridges!). Second hardest is deciding to replace all of them on the engine, or just the side that's ticking.
I can't help you there.
I'm sure there are 3 basic types of personalities: Those who replace JUST the bad one, those who replace all of them on the bank that's ticking, and those who replace all of them on both sides. I think I'd replace all of them on the side that's ticking, but BUY enough to do the whole engine if I find a deal on them.
Gilly

blackmercedes · #5 09-24-2004, 07:12 PM

It's my understanding that the M119 was tested in some prototype racers with the 5.0L version being highly modified by AMG including turbocharging. The bottom end was rumoured to be completely stock and easily withstood the 1000+ ponies. What I do know is that there are "tuner" versions of the M119 around with 400-500hp with stock bottom ends and they seem to hold up very well.

Gilly · #6 09-24-2004, 08:22 PM

The M119 is tough as nails, other than these oil bridges and maybe an occasional timing chain tensioner, very little goes wrong, other that the electrical gremlins (throttle motors, maybe a wiring harness or Mass airflow sensor). Nothing with the head I can think of..
Maybe the 400-500hp tuner versions are what I'm thinking of, but I was sure I read about 1000hp, stock "bottom endZ" is what I meant to say, not stock block per se.
YES the aircooled Porsche engine actually was put into a certificated airplane, the Mooney Porsche. Pretty rare, I'll see if I can find a link. I think it needed to have a reduction gearbox to work. The usual problem with using auto engines in aircraft is the prop speeds are way lower than the auto engine will produce any decent power at, so you need to use a reduction gearbox so the prop is spinning the proper speed (they become less efficient if they are over-revved) but the engine is in it's peak rpm range.

Gilly

Arthur Dalton · #7 09-24-2004, 08:51 PM

I built a VolkPlane VP-1 and we used a VW 1600 engine . These get direct prop coupling , as the prop speed is 2500/3000 rpm and the 4 stroke has the torque and low rpm power band perfect for prop.
But most Kit planes and Ultra lites us 2 stroke and that is where you will see the prop reduction set-ups. The 2 stroke have plenty of RPMs , but no power .. we call them Stop/Go engines High R s or None..
There is actually a kit conversion out that cuts the VW boxer in half and uses the 2 cylinders /opposed. It is preferred over the 2 strokes , which are usually Snow Mobile engines.
Mine had dual ignition , the standard 009 VW distributor as back-up,and a Wico Mag on the back of the crank.
For fuel, we used Posa throttle body/slide valve... some may remember them from the old Harley conversions.. Slide body metering, no floats/bowl.
The VW is actually ideal for aircraft as it is magneseum. opposed piston, air cooled and converts easily.. they use them a lot in small pylon racers on the West Coast..
The VP flew simular to the the old J-3 Cub tail dragger.. They had Continental engines , somewhat simular to the VW..
Days gone by.....

Arthur Dalton · #8 09-27-2004, 01:05 PM

I
I have sold to VP-1

The plane was built from Evan Aircraft plans
Basic as it gets ..Rag Wing, tail dragger , open cockpit, 22' W/S
The best design feature was it had a Full Flying Tail, no elevator/rudder.
This was originally a homebuilt in Popular Mechanics, way before Kits became coool..

The Rotax you mention are used a lot , but originally , guys stole them from Snow-Mobiles.
The engine for the VP actually came out of a 1966 VW Flower/Peace Sign BUS...
Had a Hegy wood prop... 56/45.

Do you do Sun and Fun or Oshkosh ??

haasman · #9 09-27-2004, 01:34 PM

Here is a very detailed opinion of the Porsche Mooney aircraft engine. Sorry to hear it was not well receieved.

Haasman