Hi everyone,
I've been reading the archives for the past 2 days on the pros and cons of converting to 134A (or not). I've gleaned lots of info, but I still need details of installing new compressor and oil (mine has locked up-confirmed by a Mercedes mechanic), flushing the system, pulling a vacuum, charging an empty system. Do you know of a web site or book that could give a play by play of A/C reconstruction for the do it your selfer with lots of details? I was encouraged by the fact that both the local Autozone and Advance Parts Stores can supply all the parts, but I tend to need more details before I start pulling parts off.
Thanks--

__________________
1999 E300 TD
1999 E300 TD, WVO conversion
2007 Jaguar XJ8
1993 190E 2.3, Limited Edition, 239,000 miles (sold)
1991 300 SL (sold)
1977 MGB
1969 TR6
1980 TR8
joturbe@comcast.net

Maybe one should be made
I do have access to a "Cooltech 700" in Richland. To easy dial in the specifications for 134 and oil. It will pump down, do a leak test then put the exact amounts in the system.

__________________
BENZ THERE DONE THAThttp://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/...c/progress.gif
15 VW Passat TDI
00 E420
98 E300 DT
97 E420 Donor Car - NEED PARTS? PM ME!
97 S500
97 E300D
86 Holden Jackaroo Turbo D
86 300SDL
(o\|/o)

For more efficient reading on the subject of r12 to r134 conversion, try the following web site:

aircondition.com

__________________
95 E320 Cabriolet, 159K

For the best A/C Webforum click on the link below.

http://www.autoacforum.com/categories.cfm?catid=2
http://www.autoacforum.com/index.cfm?nocookies=yes

You must remember that most of the reading that you find will not be up to date.

To get you up to date consider the fact that R12 prices are coming down due to decreasing demand while 134 prices are going rapidly up. It just makes absolutely no sense whatsoever to convert a system from 12 to 134 with todays prices. You will spend more on adapter fittings and ester oil to make the conversion than you will spend on the difference between 12 and 134.

In my book, even if R12 were still five times the price I would NOT convert. Think about it, you will have so much in the compressor and time in the flushing than you will ever put in R12. Staying with R12, percentage wise will make almost no difference in your repair cost. THEN you will lose 15% of your cooling capacity.

It just makes no sense. Stay with R12.

Good luck,

Larry, you forgot to factor in the time and expense the average DIYer needs to spend procuring a license to buy r12, then the trouble to get the r12.

For most of us, it's very convenient to get r134 from the local auto supply house.

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95 E320 Cabriolet, 159K

Stan,

Yes, if you FILL a system with a refrigerant having 15% LESS cooling capacity, then you will indeed have colder air than a system that was low on R12. It would be violating laws of chemistry to expect a properly charged R12 system to have lower cooling performance than the same system properly charged with R134. Do you think that I'm stupid or something?

Kestas,

It takes about 2 hours and $15 to log onto www.imaca.org and take the OPEN BOOK test and get your certificate immediately ready to print out. It then takes another 10 minutes to log on to refrigerant supply and order R12 for very little more money than it would cost for the same quantity of 134 on todays market and have it delivered to your door.

Compare that to the added time and expense to properly convert your system PLUS consider the statistical fact that a converted system will typically have a 2 to 3 year life span.

Staying with R12 is easy if you will take those steps. Those steps are easier than a conversion and in the long run will SAVE you money. The reason is that by staying with the correct refrigerant, when you DO have a problem, you simply repair the problem, which must be done regardless, and then recharge.


Come on folks, let's look at the big picture, not just the short term fix!

Have a great day,

I agree with Larry.

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2012 E350
2006 Callaway SC560

I agree with Larry 110%!

having done 2 conversions (properly)i am re-converting to r12. even at best 134a convert did not cut it around town at 35 mph and stop lights in my 95-100 degree dog-day-hot and humid NC climate.

134a oe designed cars 1993-present have; dual condenser fans, different designed and size condensers for the extra head pressures with 134a.

i have heard that 134a is in the process of being replaced.

check with friends, family, co-workers, ebay and you will be surprised how available R12 is.

__________________
1993 Mercedes Benz 300D 2.5 205K (ex wife's)
1984 Mercedes Benz 300SD 320K (SOLD)
2004 Mercedes Benz C240 75K
1995 GMC Sierra 2WD 5.7L 188K
1983 Mercedes Benz 300SD 239K (SOLD)
1987 BMW 325i 220K (SOLD FOR SALVAGE)

609 Certification

Larry,
I had already decided to keep the system as R-12 from reading your previous posts in the archives. The new cars I've been test driving this week don't cool nearly as good as my old Mercedes with R-12. So today I took the online test for $15 and got 609 Certified, then went on Ebay and purchased 3 cans of R-12 for $16.33 per can including shipping. I saw R134A on the shelf at Advance Auto Parts for $8.99 per can which has gone up from last summer. That price difference is not unbearable and I get keep it cold now with legal R12. Yeah!

Now a question about the situation. I can get the compressor, expansion valve and dryer for $400 at Autozone, but I don't have shop air so I'm not able to blow out the condensor or evaporator, nor do I have a pump to vacuum the system out, so is it best to take it to a repair shop along with my R-12 ? Thanks--

__________________
1999 E300 TD
1999 E300 TD, WVO conversion
2007 Jaguar XJ8
1993 190E 2.3, Limited Edition, 239,000 miles (sold)
1991 300 SL (sold)
1977 MGB
1969 TR6
1980 TR8
joturbe@comcast.net

i think i will have to take that test....

the 300e has been converted and every system part was replaced new before I got the car..... actually that's why I bought it.... i have to admit the 134 blows very cold.

the 300ce is r-12 and I will keep it that way.....it blows very cold too....although I have mentioned that strange center pod problem... I worry about this car...because it has had a new expansion valve and condensor...but I can't find evidence of a new evaporator or compressor.... some day it could get ugly....

but I think I am in the r-12 boat, if you still have it in the system... probably only takes 2-3 cans to fully charge....

__________________
1989 300ce 129k
( facelifted front,updated tail lights, lowered suspension,bilstein sports, lorinser front spoiler, MOMO steering wheel, remus exhaust,stainless steel brake lines). (Gone)

1997 s320 154k (what a ride). Sold with 179k miles. Replaced with Hyundai Equus

1994 e320 Cabriolet 108k



1972 280se 4.5 153k Owned for 12 yrs, sorry I sold it


[/SIGPIC]

Larry Bible:

Could you provide the name(s) of WEB sellers who can provide R-12. I'm aware of the 609 cert. requirement.

I've read your comments about the price coming down, unfortunately, no one in my area is aware of a price drop. It still goes for $26-$32 a can and that's what it was 4-5 years ago.

Not interested in eBay sellers. Too many crooks on eBay.

Thanks.

__________________
Mike Murrell
1991 300-SEL - Model 126
M103 - SOHC
"Fräulein"

Another good site for A/C info, compressors and equipment is :

www.ackits.com

babybenz,

For your situation, I think that your best bet is to borrow a compressor, even a small 110 volt job like is used with an airnailer. This way you can flush everything and get the flushing agent out, very important. Then put everything together, putting the r/d in place as the last thing.

THEN go to the auto a/c shop or some shop where they can evacuate and charge. The only problem will be that they may not want to use your refrigerant, but call around and find someone that will work with you.

Mike Murrell,

I have purchased R12 from Refrigerant Sales in Colorado. Good folks.



bamamb is correct. Ackits and acsource are good outfits.
Hope this helps,

Advance Auto Parts Store has a 2HP, 4 gallon, twin tank, 125psi, 5CFM@90 psi, 110 volt air compressor (Mechanics Power brand) 90 day warranty for $88.00! I bought one and it works great! Has enough power for shop tools and is a few more dollars than a rental. As with all air compressors watch the oil level on the sight glass so as not to burn up.

__________________
1993 Mercedes Benz 300D 2.5 205K (ex wife's)
1984 Mercedes Benz 300SD 320K (SOLD)
2004 Mercedes Benz C240 75K
1995 GMC Sierra 2WD 5.7L 188K
1983 Mercedes Benz 300SD 239K (SOLD)
1987 BMW 325i 220K (SOLD FOR SALVAGE)

609 Certification