Using a Vacuum to Change Oil
 

I'm considering purchasing a vacuum to remove the crankcase oil instead of the drain plug method. I currently have a 92 300E. Are there any particular MB models that are not recommended for this method of oil change. What are some of the better vacuums currently on the market? Thanks....

tarheel75 ;)

They're pretty much all the same. I use the Tempo "Oil Boy" and it works great. Has a 5 qt capacity, like most of them do.

What I do after I fill it is pour the first 5 qts of old oil into an empty bottle I saved from my previous change, then siphon the remaining 2 qts into the empty 5qt container from the current change, after the new oil is added to the engine.

A quirky thing I do, because I have 3 qts to spare in one container, is siphon 3 qts of transmission fluid and replace with 3 fresh. As I said, quirky, but probably cheap insurance for a well-behaving transmission.

I have a Top Sider, and I hate pumping the thing. I'm about to buy a compressed-air powered unit.

I am a real fan of sucking out the top. On my 606, I get more oil out of the dipstick tube than I can get out of the sump drain.

And in my case, I'm not ignoring a good time to do an under-car inspection. Doing an inspection means putting the car on stands. You can hardly reach under the car at its normal (factory) height, and you certainly can't see anything. You would need to put the car on four stands to also change the oil, since the car must be level.

just use the drain plug like real guys do...there is a drain plug you know...

Mitey Vac makes a good unit. It's available at Sears. Get the 8L version, about $80.

I use it a lot. I do fleet maintenance and I have several remote locations. I can change the oil and filters in my units with just a couple of small spots of oil left on the ground. Easy to clean and the old oil is in a sealed container ready to be taken to any store which accepts old oil. Much easier and neater than draining the 10qts in a pan, replacing the drain plug every 4th or 5th time (I'm a little pedantic at times), messing with trying to drain the oil into a sealable container and then having to clean and store the drain pan.

The first one I did I pulled the drain plug just to see how well it did. After 2 or 3 minutes I got maybe three small drops of oil from the pan.

Yep, it doesn't cost anything for equipment and gives you a chance to look underneath and see what's falling off. For those times in bad weather or for other times that come up where you just need to do a quick change and let the under car inspection wait until next time, I have YET to find a Mercedes that I could not drain the oil into a shallow pan with the car setting flat on a level floor.

If you think you can't get the drain plug out without raising the car, you must be trying to change oil while wearing your wedding tuxedo. Get some old clothes that you use specifically for the purpose and crawl under the car by the method that I call "walking on my shoulders."

what guy keeps a rented tux lol.

I can't even get the pan under the car without raising it up. It is much too close to the ground. Older models, sure, no problem.

Purists schmrists,belly pans and bottom plugs
 

I've had two hand pumpers(too slow or too small) then I got small 12v jabsco unit. Still not satisfied with speed. I you want to change piping hot oil think metal tank. The two I've been looking at for some time now (I'm a lazy, cheap SOB) are 6-1/4 Gallon Oil Extractor http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/Displayitem.taf?itemnumber=46149
and Jabsco Porta Quick Oil Changer
http://www.jthelectronics.com/product/31416.html

Spend the money from the get go it's a great tool. Many uses, lawn mowers, snow blowers, rear ends, brake res. etc.....

Yep, ramps are the way to go.

Those ramps are the best investment I have ever made, along with a floor jack. I remember back in the '60s seeing in the JC Whitney catalogue a quick-release drain plug with a cable that went to the dash. The idea was to pull the cable, drain the oil, and return the cable to closed when finished. Anyone know if this thing fizzled or not?

I don't know what kind of drain pan you're using or how much trouble you have with a half dozen or so little screws with an 8MM head.

I have removed the hush panel underneath 210 cars and 203 cars which are some of the newest with no trouble at all. A 1/4" ratchet, a short extension and an 8mm socket plus about three minutes and that thing is out of there. Takes no longer to put it back in place.

I have a couple of drain pans that will slide under any MB that I've tried. If you're driving an SL or an SLK, maybe they won't, but I expect that they will.

Come on folks, life is not a bowlful of Cherries at every turn. Put a just a little bit of effort in your work!

I'll bet it fizzled due to the difficulty and mess changing most cars' filters, under and/or behind the engines, not worth the cable installation to save draining.

I use an older TopSider, it's a 10-quart metal container, works great. Pulls as much oil as going under and getting to the plug, I've removed the pan from one car after sucking the oil out and it was empty.

I'll never go back to the under-the-car method, no advantage and lots more work. The topsider method is quick enough I can do a filter and oil while my wife changes for dinner (and I'm still clean).

"work smarter, not harder" cover it?

Hard to find fault in that statement.

If you are a Mobil 1 user changing your oil once or twice per year then getting under the car is no hardship. If, however, you are a short interval changer, doing it every other month or so, vacuuming is the better option.

I typically change oil every 2,700 miles since convenience and opportunity always present themselves before 3K miles. The color of the oil and cleanliness of the filter suggest the engine is not suffering because of it.

As for changing 50% ATF at the same time, I began doing that when a transmission tech told me he’d be out of business if people changed their ATF more frequently.

I'm a short interval changer and I've never "sucked" oil out in my life. Draining from underneath is just no problem.

As Arthur said, the worst thing to do is NOT change it. Of course, it's not a good course of action to ignore inspection of everything else under the car either.

I just can't think of any chore in my life that's simpler or easier than simply draining the oil out of my car. I'm sorry, but I just don't get it.

Call me what you wish.

I am NOT a frequent ATF changer though. Maybe that's because I refuse to drive cars with an automatic. Maybe that psyche matches my oil change psyche, you know change gears AND oil the manual way. KISS (Keep it simple.)

I say if it makes you feel smarter than everyone else because you suck oil, then you should definitely go for it. I'm definitely not in my young days (just turned 60) but I haven't let my age get in the way of expending effort either.

I don't think anyone is implying they are smarter. It's just easier, cleaner and more convenient for us than getting under the car.

Aint that the truth!!

I have older ramps - no rubber stops. I have found some old carpet tiles with a rubber base. Sit them underneath the ramps to stop them being pushed back.
I'm 60 and don't mind getting underneath the car. A friend of mine has a hoist. Every few months or so I put my cars up on it and go over the underneath with a very bright torch.

I bought a Mity Vac last year and it's great. I have the hand pumped version, but it's really not that hard. Once you have it pumped up some, you can stop and it will just suck that old oil right out.

It's not as clean and tidy an operation as I had hoped, but it's easier than crawling around under the car.

Some people are just resistant to change . . . .

In your opinion....... I find a drain pan and a wrench about as easy and convenient as anything I can imagine. Messing around with some contraption is about as inconvenient as it can get. As far as cleaner goes, I can pour the oil out of my drain pan into an old oil jug for recycling using a funnel without making a mess.

Now days, I usually change oil with a vehicle on my two post lift with a five gallon container that has a tube and funnel. It has a cap that I remove to pour the drained oil into an old jug for recycling. Sometimes if the lift is tied up, I push a pan underneath and drain it on the floor or driveway as I used to.

There is no resistance to change here. I have changed LOTS of my methods for doing things, but this one doesn't need change. It's only changing oil, it's not building a rocket ship for a trip to the moon.

Whatever works for you is great!

Exactly -- which is why I wrote, " It's just easier, cleaner and more convenient for us than getting under the car" -- with "us" being the folks who use these "contraptions." :D

I use a 5qt container with a hose and a pump handle. It has a cap that I remove to pour the drained oil into an old jug for recycling, using a funnel without making a mess.

You use a five gallon container that has a tube and funnel. It has a cap that you remove to pour the drained oil into an old jug for recycling, using a funnel without making a mess.

You stand up with the car in the air. I stand up with the car on the ground, however, I must bend at the waist from time to time, whereas you don't. Therefore, I concede your way is better. :D :D :D

(And isn't a lift just a big ol' contraption?)

Yep, and this contraption lets me easily do a COMPLETE inspection of everything under the car every time it goes on it for a job that must be done anyway. The 60 seconds it takes to get the car in the air pays off BIG TIME as opposed to the contraption that only accomplishes something that is already done in a quick and simple manner even without a lift.

And your're right, my contraption does lead to more work than your contraption, because I rotate tires and do quick visual brake inspection, visual inspection of everything else underneath such as looking for leaks, as well as pull and shake tests on this and that. So I think my contraption offers a little added value, don't you?

Larry, I'll swap you my Mity Vac for your lift . . . .

Yes. Your contraption is a game-changer. I want one. :)

Draining the oil is one thing, what about swapping out the old oil filter?

Can't be done from above on my car.

Then you have no choice. The filter can't be done from below on mine.

The M103, M104, OM602, OM603, and many other Mercedes engines have the oil filter on top.

I agree with all the reasonings of doing an oil change from under the car, as it was made to be done. But one thing that has not been addressed yet is the suction created inside the engine. Since I am totally ingnorant of this inane idea of sucking through a dip-stick tube, I have no idea how much suction is created while extracting oil the lazy way. I would be concerned with the suction pulling on seals, etc.

The siphon tube is basically a straw. The engine is like a soda can. There is no seal between the siphon tube and the dipstick tube, so the pressures you imply do not exist.

I would not call the method "inane." It is easier, more convenient, and more effective other methods -- except Larry Bible's.

This is nuts.

Change the oil however works people, if you like laying on your back, do it. If you prefer using another method, do it.

Really nuts.

WOW 3 pages on what method of oil change to use! What a waste of server space. Now if we could just figure out how ofter to change our oil. Oh wait, has that already been covered too? :D

You're absolutely right! I suppose it's simply easy to get sucked into (no pun intended) these silly discussions.



And an "inane idea" because it is supposed that we are all here on this forum because we choose to do our own MBZ repair & maintenance. If one wants to distance oneself from the hassle of it all, just take the car to the local mechanic and have done with it. Sorry for the confusion; I obviously made the mistake of thinking that we all read between the lines.

Yes, the subject has been beaten into complete oblivion here on mshop for a number of years. Everyone knows, however, that if you kick a dead horse enough, it might climb back up on all four feet.

Just being honest, somehow this one strikes a chord with me. I have spent my entire life getting dirty working on cars and other forms of wheeled conveyence. So, somehow, I find it difficult to walk in someones shoes who is afraid to do the same. I also find it difficult to identify with a man using hand lotion.

"Mr. Bible, you are charged with inciting debate regarding oil change method. How do you plead?"

Guilty as charged your honor!

That works great, as do surgical gloves. Easier to wash up later.

Some people have a difficult time accepting others' preferences and ideas. Whatever works, works.

On the subject of oil changes, I detest those infernal belly-pan/encapsulation devices Mercedes has used under their engines since the mid '80s. I'd seriously consider one of those top-side oil-change 'contraptions' if I had those belly-pans on my cars.
In my experience, without a lift, those pans rarely go back up so easily. It can be major pain, trying to get those tiny sheet metal screws into their greasy, tiny holes, while manuevering/supporting the pan.
It's even worse when some ham-fisted klutz has previously torqued those tiny screws and stripped some or all of those cheezy, tiny special speed-nuts.
On more than one occasion, while working under other's Benzes, I've had to custom-fabricate replacement speednuts when it was on the weekend, or too late/too much hassle to get cross-town to the nearest dealer for those parts.

Happy Motoring, Mark

I helped my son reseal the lower oil pan on his 1999 C43 (M113.944) last weekend. We used a Motive Power vacuum unit to suck the oil out through the dipstick tube. When we dropped the pan there was still oil in it. We set the pan back in place with three bolts, pulled the drain plug and drained the remaining oil into a graduated container. We measured 14 ounces (350 ML).

We checked the suction tube on the vacuum unit (we had previously marked the suction hose as a visual aid to ensure it would be inserted all the way to the bottom of the pan). The suction tube projected about 3/16" below the end of the dipstick tube extension inside the oil pan.

It appears that the suction method removes less oil.

A great idea, until you get some anal customer who doesn't appreciate that 4" hole, and makes you buy them a new 'encapsulation device'!

Incidentally, a friend has a 2004 turbo Subaru Forester. The engine can be a real pain to work on, but at least the factory belly-pan has a 3" access hole with a removeable cover for the oil-drain.

Happy Motoring, Mark

There ya' go!

Must depend on the engine and/or the method, mine removes at least as much as draining it based on sucking the oil out first, then removing the engine and having no drainable oil in the pan (M104 & OM602/603).

No simple way to drain the oil cooler though.

Oil Cooler Drain
 

'Given the Oil Cooler has Engine Oil Pressure...would it be feasible to
"drill and tap" for a drain plug in the bottom?

It is definitely true that some models will suck better than others. In previous dead horse kicking sessions there were claims that sucking actually removed more than draining.

BTW, as to all the claims of soap under the fingernails. lotion before working (my wife and daughter would definitely be up for that one) and gloves.... 1)Gloves are out for me. I just can't work with gloves on. 2)The soap under the fingernails sounds like a great idea if I could ever, at my age, develop the habit of doing it before it's too late. 3)The one that I DO take issue with though is putting on hand lotion before working. I can't stand the thought of leaving hand lotion prints on my Binford 9200.

I guess I sound like the biggest, nastiest slob that ever walked, but when I get in the shop I'm workin'. I stick my hands in oil or grease or force them into a tight spot so bad that the next day they might look like they went through a meat grinder.

My GoJo and shop towels are right by the door and I scrub up before heading back to the house and then sometimes have to peel off my work clothes before going in the back door. It's a good thing that the nearest neighbors house is at least a 1/4 mile away.

That's just me.

Just to level the playing field again
 

I hate to add any more to this pissing contest but...... I just changed my oil through the dip stick and also sucked out the filter bowl (try doing that from the bottom plug) Dip stick was a full mark when started. Refilled with the 4 liter (gallon jug?) of mobil 1. Took 2 jugs and only refilled to the halfway mark. So I either got jipped on the jug content or I got ALL of the oil out or maybe both.
So there ya go. It's a tool and like any tool you have to know how to use it. I shove it down the tube until I feel resistance, then go another 1/2 inch. Evacuate until audible slurping is noted, then pull back the 1/2 inch until you hear the slurping stop and more oil is noted emptying into the container. Continue this last step until no more oil is extracted.

Or take 30 seconds to pull the plug and walk away until the next morning and get it all with no screwing around.

30 seconds? Hell, it takes my old bones that long just to sit DOWN on my creeper!:D and with MY memory, I'd be doing an engine rebuild after about 15 seconds of wondering, "hmm, sounds like that chain tensioner is getting a little loose, oh well, I'll just give her a little throttle to build up the oil pressure":o

I do a top side oil change, then go under the car for an inspection. Pulling the plug makes too much of a mess for my tastes.

-Jason

The first time I ever seen an "oil vacuum" was in Germany at a garage. I said to myself "dang if that isn't neat" If the germans were doing it back in the early nineties why not now.
I don't see a thing wrong with it. Why? because it is easy and no seals to purchase when you replace the oil drain plug.

The MB dealerships were doing it in the US in the early nineties. For a shop with an elaborate network of pipes and hoses to each bay it just makes good sense. In their shops, the oil is never handled. It's just goes into a sludge tank where it remains until a recycle truck comes and sucks it out.

On the scale in which this method is used in the dealerships it just makes good sense AS LONG AS the tech is thorough with his sucking.

Ahhh, noooo, never mind I ain't going to say anything to that post!:D

I might suggest "As long as the tech applies a thorough vacuuming to the engine".