Hey everyone,
This post is releated to the post below:
http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/showthread.php?t=257912

I was wondering if there is a known relationship between the amount of fender height increase/drop for an increase/ decrease in the spring pad number. I am pretty sure there are similar spring pads used across the mercedes models, but I've been looking for W201 info. I have found the part numbers, thickness and identifying "number" by the bumps present, but after searching online, I can't find any indication of how changes in the spring pad will affect wheel geometry/ fender height. I know it is NOT a 1:1 relationship (ie. that an increase from a 13mm pad to an 18mm pad will NOT increase fender height by 5 mm.) Here's what I know:
front-
1 bump= 8mm pad
2 bumps= 13mm pad
3 bumps= 18mm pad
4 bumps= 23 mm pad (highest available oem)

rear
1 bump= 8mm pad
2 bumps= 13mm pad
3 bumps= 18mm pad (this is the highest avail oem)

Maybe a chassis manual has info? Please help- this info would be very valuable to our community- and me with my front fenders currently sitting at 26.5." Thanks- John

Spring pad does not affect fender height.

__________________

hai,
i think so the spring pad will not effect,
the findle height will not depending upon the spring pad,
once again know about it from another side
------------------------------------

steven

view for free communication

Since the spring pad sits on top of the spring, it has a direct relationship to the ride height of the car. A thinner pad will most assuredly lower that end of the car.

I'd expect the change to be pretty close to the difference of the pads - 13 to 18 would be 3 or 4 mm change. I don't know the compression factor of the rubber pads, but as you surmise, there will be some.

My W126 has a self-leveling suspension (SLS) in the back. If I change the springs/pads, I need to adjust the control valve on the sway bar. Does the W201 have an SLS setup??

__________________
There is a very fine line between "hobby" and "mental illness."
FrankenBenz: '87 560SEC with an '02 cammed LS6 and custom 4L60E.
Bling: '87 560SEC, ported/polished, lowered
Lisa: '87 560SEL, lowered

the logic board in my brain is inclined to side with mramay on this, i.e.
thicker spring pad, more gap, higher ride height. where else is that
gap going to be manifest itself?....since the pavement isn't going to
allow the tire to go below the surface.

the spring pad is added above the spring, in effect, lengthening the
spring.

thinner pad = shorter spring/pad overall length

the chassis rides above the spring, ergo, thinner pad = lower ride height

....and vice versa.

__________________
-- raymond~
47º 34'N 122º 18'W

From experience, there isn't a 1:1 relationship between the differences in thickness and the raising or lowering of the car's ride. Due to the geometry of the suspension, the effect is slightly more than the difference.

heyyy.....hadn't thought about it from that angle (pun intended). good thinking!

__________________
-- raymond~
47º 34'N 122º 18'W

Thanks for the replies. The w201 in question doesn't have sls- but the spring pads would have a similar effect on both vehicles, I think. There is a change in ride height (or fender height) depending on the spring pad used, and like MTI said- its NOT 1:1, due to the geometry of the suspension components. Despite installing a set of "lowering springs" my front end is sitting 2.5" higher up front than in the rear after an increase of 1 size spring pads all around.

After fiddling with the numbers (and I thought/hoped I'd never use algebra again...) it looks like in the REAR there was close to a 1:1 change resulting from the spring pad change- 40mm drop from the springs plus 5mm increase in spring pad- and I'm sitting just under 24" compared to the original 25."

Up front tho- I'm baffled. I've spent HOURS trying to find info on this- and have come up with nothing. The only thing I found was on a euro board- where they described an estimated 2mm change in height for every 1mm change in spring pad thickness. This would give an estimated 10mm change in height for a change in 1 size of spring pad. That wouldn't account for the drastic increase in ride height in the front of my 190 though....

satyr-
i'm not familiar with the 201 suspension system, ergo my question: is the top
of the spring secured within a spring perch, like a big hollowed donut (which
is turn, welded to the car frame)...and the bottom of the spring nesting within
the lower control arm?

if so, the lower control arm is likely to include an indentation in which the
spring is to reside within....and importantly, indexed against a stop. if you
didn't, and simply inserted the spring in blindly then it's certainly possible
that the spring will be as much as an inch higher than it should had the
spring been indexed properly.

http://video.tinypic.com/player.php?v=48pwb5s

video shows individual shock and spring system, which is what i'm picturing
for your car

__________________
-- raymond~
47º 34'N 122º 18'W

Nailed it. I dont think they were installed right.

Wow- excellent video! Thanks! Well, the W201 is similar- and does have a perch for the spring on the lower control arm, and an inverted cup where the spring pad and spring reside above. I backed the 190 out of the garage and checked it- and the spring is resting in the perch properly. It appears everything is where it should be. I found some more info on a euro site- and the #3 is the thickest pad MB used on the 201, which was what I replaced with the #4 to partially compensate for the 40mm drop by the springs.

I suppose I should go with #2 pads and see what happens. I wonder if she'll start hitting the bump stops or rubbing the fender in pot holes....

Of course you are correct. Those that say it will make no difference, well........

I changed the rear spring pads (they are officially called something else) in my 2008 C300 from 15mm to 5mm which doesn't sound like much but it did make an easily seen difference. The pair of pads cost $17.

__________________
Roger E.

I would expect the increase in fender height from the ground to be roughly double the difference in pad height on both ends....though they are not likely to be exactly the same.

__________________
[SIGPIC] Diesel loving autocrossing grandpa Architect. 08 Dodge 3/4 ton with Cummins & six speed; I have had about 35 benzes. I have a 39 Studebaker Coupe Express pickup in which I have had installed a 617 turbo and a five speed manual.[SIGPIC]

..I also have a 427 Cobra replica with an aluminum chassis.

Well- I've researched this on as many boards as I could (that means the ones in english.) What I've found is that because of the weird "point" system MB uses to configure the suspension to the different "options" for the different chassis, its really hard to tell what the effect will be. In some cases on a W201, a 5mm spring pad/shim change will have an effect at around 1.8x the pad/shim thickness. In other cases, however it seems the change will be much more significant- upwards of 2.3 to 2.5x the thickness of the pad. It depends on not only the year, make, model, but also the market (US vs euro) AND "points" added due to things like AC, standard vs auto tranny (huge difference in weight), which size/type motor (little 4cyl gas vs heavy 5 cyl diesel for example), power sunroof or none, etc., etc.

This is PROBABLY one of the reasons the aftermarket suspension companies don't want to bother with making springs for the w201- its unpredictable and a big hassle for them. No wonder they all have little asterisks about using spring pads to configure ride height in their (mostly now discontinued) catalog listings...

They use the point system to decide which pad to supply. The basic suspension geometry does not change though and the multiplier would not change for the change of height for various pads.

The aftermarket suspension people don't make products for Mercedes because the demand for it is not great enough for them to make money at it, IMHO.

__________________
[SIGPIC] Diesel loving autocrossing grandpa Architect. 08 Dodge 3/4 ton with Cummins & six speed; I have had about 35 benzes. I have a 39 Studebaker Coupe Express pickup in which I have had installed a 617 turbo and a five speed manual.[SIGPIC]

..I also have a 427 Cobra replica with an aluminum chassis.