Request to members in Germany - Klann or SIR spring compressor - Page 4 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

stevebfl · #46 04-19-2003, 01:28 PM

I was working on a ML430 problem Thursday and bought a day on the tech site www.startekinfo.com I printed a bunch of info and then decided I would look at all the service bulletins for that vehicle.

The list of bulletins was over 400 but they included numerous general topic or interest bulletins. There is a bulletin that decribes every version of the two types of spring compressor MB uses. My crude version is a similar to the tool 107 589 xx xx xx (don't remember the whole number). This tool is much like the one being drawn here. It might be valuable to look at the pictures to see how MB made the plate pivotable.

The Klann tool which is totally different is a tool with number like 202 589 xx xx xx. There are also different plate sizes with MB part numbers. There is also a chart that shows which combo works front and rear of every chassis. I printed a copy of this bulletin, as I was going to see what the price of these tools were from MB. It s surprizing sometimes how much cheaper they will be from MB.

afmcorp · #47 04-19-2003, 03:43 PM

dave

yes i could use all those dimensions. i also have a 1972 350 sl.

as for trying to fit all the sizes to one set of plates the answer is yes you can. however... you would need to put all the spring dimensions in matrix and then lay them out with the largest being the od measurement and the smallest being the id measurement. as for the channel i am assuming a bit of a spread from big od to small id. this will require the spring channel to be wide enough for all of them to sit within the channel. not knowing yet what those dimensions will be i could see a possible problem do to the upper and lower plates shifting to one side as you start to compress the spring. this could be a problem as steve has pointed out about the slipping or shifting without a channel for the springs to sit in. i may be getting anal because we haven't even looked at the dim as yet.

thanks for all your input.
craig

afmcorp · #48 04-19-2003, 03:49 PM

steve

my design uses a pivoting point at the top. once inserted and turned 90 degrees to lock it in place the plate can rock left to right on the round shoulders of the rocking top plate.

tks
craig

i'm trying to post but i've been unsuccessful in getting the drawing converted to a jpg, gif or bmp form. i do have it in pdf format.

dmorrison · #49 04-19-2003, 05:23 PM

123 coil spring dimensions

Front Coil Spring

A. 116mm outside diameter
B. 16 mm coil spring diameter
C. 100mm center of coil spring to center of coil spring
D. distance vertically coil spring to coil spring 20mm distance to
put a plate into the spring UNLOADED
E. distance coil to coil LOADED 10-12mm depending on the position you insert it. installed in car with the car on jackstands.
F. Distance between plates to install coil spring 280-290MM
G. Distance between plate to remove coil spring 240mm
H. Overall lenght unloaded 455mm
I did find that the replacment coil springs were longer unloaded.
I. Inner diameter 85 mm

Rear Coil Springs

A. 135mm
B. 15mm coil spring diameter
C. 120mm center of coil spring to center of coil spring
D. Distance vertically coil spring to coil spring 38mm unloaded
E. distance coil to coil loaded 25mm average.
F. distance between plate to install 220mm-230mm
G. distance between plate to remove coil 200mm. more if you disconnect the subframe bushing
H. overall length unloaded 450mm
I. inner diameter 105mm

hole at top of front spring perch 44mm

Dave

107 coil spring. I have been under the SL looking at the coil spring layout. The Sl has a front subframe assembly which requires removal of the subframe to work on it. You have to have an engine hoist to hold the engine when you drop the subframe. The Sir Tool and I'm sure anything we design will probably work but working on this front end will require some thought.

dmorrison · #50 04-19-2003, 05:36 PM

Craig
keeping the plate centered. Ithought about this yesterday. Either cut large grooves as the Sir tool does OR cut a plate as I have in my diagram. The inner and outer diameter of the groove will be the smalles to the largest so that the plates could work on all the springs.
To keep the plate centered you cut a round plate 3/8 inch round. In the round plate you would place a large offset hole and a a smaller center hole. The outer diameter of the plate is the inner diameter of the small spring. As you install the bolt you first go through the round plate and center the bolt shaft as you would in the bottom plate then install the bolt into the bottom plate. Because the round plate is held in the center by the same mechanism that is holding the bottom plate. And the round plate is above the bottom plate, resting on the bottom plate. This centering plate will prevent the bottom plate from shifting.
Just an idea. It could be y the time you build the centering plate you could build 4 plate as Sir tool does.

On the 123 coil spring the difference between front and rear outer diameter is about 3/4 inches. Not much.
The large Sir tool plate for the rear springs was not a snug fit it did have some slop to it.

Dave

vince · #51 04-21-2003, 08:43 AM

Steve, if you don't mind, how much is a subscription to the Startek system?

stevebfl · #52 04-21-2003, 10:05 AM

Twenty dollars a day, $300 a month or $2500 a year.

pmizell · #53 04-21-2003, 11:41 AM

Steve:

Would the info found on that site be helpful to the advanced DIY'er, such as info that is not found on the MB CD series? $20 is reasonable, provided you can print information that you come across that might be helpful in the future.

Thanks!

Paul

dmorrison · #54 04-22-2003, 05:59 PM

The measurments for the 126 a 1986 300SDL
The springs are in the car

Front

A. outside diameter 130mm
B. coil spring diameter 17mm
C. average space between coils to insert plate 13mm at top
D. Average space between coils to insert plate 13mm at bottom
E. Coil lenght installed in car 345mm

Rear

A. outside diameter 139mm
B. coil spring diameter 17mm
C. average space between coils to insert plate 20mm at top
D. " " " " " " 24mm at bottom
E. Coil lenght installed in the car 330mm

Dave

stevebfl · #55 04-23-2003, 07:48 AM

I have been on the startek site a bunch over the last few days solving a CAN problem towed to me from a Tampa dealer.

I have found that the system is very incomplete. The newest info found no where else is only about 10% there, most inquiries bring a no info available sentence.

Most of my time was spent in the wiring diagrams section which is the best thing since sliced bread. With links and colors it is an immense help.

It also is only for late model cars going back as far as 140 and 202 chassis.

It does include a WIS that has been simplified (once you install some java browser thing)a bit. The document numbers have been replaced by web addresses so you can't refer.

This is definitely professional info and well worth a few hours or as long as one is interested. I spent a couple hours reading service bulletins on this 99 ML430 (over 500 in no particulr order - probably time/date)

Snibble · #56 06-12-2004, 01:21 AM

Craig and Dave... any updates? I am curious as to what happened with the plans... a success?

Snibble · #57 06-12-2004, 02:52 PM

ttt

dmtinker · #58 09-01-2006, 10:38 AM

For that price, I bet you could have a machine shop make you one much cheaper with better materials. I had a sailboat that needed a part for a tiller that was no longer made. On a lark, I went to a local machine shop and they made me the part. The online the part would have cost me about $600. The shop made me one for $80 and they made it out of a tungstun/molybednium allow used as armor plating in Apache choppers. The part is so strong, I could lift the 27' foot sailboat by it........

Just a thought.

rs899 · #59 09-02-2006, 06:40 AM

This thread is now somewhat overcome by events. Decent copies of the Klann are commonly available on ebay for $200, not really worth the troble of making one .

donbryce · #60 09-02-2006, 01:25 PM

Well, $200.00 is still a lot for the number of times I'd use it. FYI, here's a link to the one I made, for well under $20.00

http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/showthread.php?t=134474&highlight=spring+compressor