WVO and no modifications to car, ?s

[Big J]

I have searched and read many many good threads on WVO. There is a mountain of information here. Many people are stating that you must have a heating system to run WVO. But splattered throughout these threads pops the occasional message stating, you don't need a heated fuel system to run WVO. Many times the point was made that these engines are not the same as the original Rudolph Diesel designed to run on peanut oil. OK, point taken. I still wonder . . . .

I do not want to offend anyone, but I also read many posts where the author states 'I think' or 'I heard'. I really don't want speculative answers to my questions. Again, no offense intended, but would prefer those who have actual hands on experience to answer the following:

Do you run WVO in an unmodified Mercedes? If so,
1. What are the particulars of the car?
2. What is the ambient temp when you run WVO?
3. What State do you live in?
4. What negative affects did you experience, if any?
5. What positive affects did you experience, if any?
6. How many miles have you driven running WVO?
7. Do you blend WVO and another fuel? What mixture?
8. Any other comments . . . .

Thanks for any input.

[grindMARC]

"Single tanking" (i.e., little or no heating elements) is being done, but by only a tiny fraction of people. I'm guilty of bringing up these people a lot in defense of the misconception that the only way to run VO is with major alterations to the car.

I'm in Jersey. One or twice a season it might get down into single digit temps here. The components of my car are in my sig.

[muleears]

My 87 is not modified other than injection line heaters. It has run on mixtures from 40-100% WVO depending on the weather. Summers in SC and VA it happily burns 80-100% WVO, balance D2 or kero. As the weather cools the % of D2 goes up accordingly to a max of 60%. Coolest winter temp this year has been low 20'sF. I have been running this setup for over 20K miles, since may of 2006. My oil is VERY clean and has NO water.

[bigfredb]

Heating the WVO is not a must. The vehicle will operate with out the heating. However, this may put a huge strain on your system, cause early wear, or damage.

In this case, there are a couple of factors to take into account. Oil Viscosity and the quality of the Oil.

Oil Viscosity IS a factor in engine degredation. That is why most will agree that heating the oil is necessary in the vast majority of situations. To make the oil flow (etc.) better and act more like diesel. There are very few locations in the US where it is up around 120deg on a regular basis. So I would say heating is a necessity for SVO/WVO. How much heating would depend on your location, etc.

The other factor is Oil quality. It needs to be good quality oil. The dryer the better (NO suspended water). Water will tear up an injection pump really fast. You also need to filter the oil as much as possible. There are almost as many different filter setups as there are people doing the filtering.

Here is a link to a forum that has more extensive information . . .

biodiesel.infopop.cc General SVO Discussion

Good Luck!

[NC Benz]

Originally Posted by Big J

I have searched and read many many good threads on WVO. There is a mountain of information here. Many people are stating that you must have a heating system to run WVO. But splattered throughout these threads pops the occasional message stating, you don't need a heated fuel system to run WVO. Many times the point was made that these engines are not the same as the original Rudolph Diesel designed to run on peanut oil. OK, point taken. I still wonder . . . .

I do not want to offend anyone, but I also read many posts where the author states 'I think' or 'I heard'. I really don't want speculative answers to my questions. Again, no offense intended, but would prefer those who have actual hands on experience to answer the following:

Do you run WVO in an unmodified Mercedes? If so,
1. What are the particulars of the car?
2. What is the ambient temp when you run WVO?
3. What State do you live in?
4. What negative affects did you experience, if any?
5. What positive affects did you experience, if any?
6. How many miles have you driven running WVO?
7. Do you blend WVO and another fuel? What mixture?
8. Any other comments . . . .

Thanks for any input.

1. 1983 and 1984 300Ds. 83 - 240,000 miles 84 - 317,000 miles
2. 23 - 105F
3. NC
4. One car we needed to change primary filters a LOT. Below 50 degrees we put in kerosene. Colder it gets the more kero we put in. Slightly slower acceleration. We actually went back to diesel for a while in January as we ran out of time to filter. Until I get to adding fuel line heaters I think it was a good thing we went to diesel at that time. It takes time to get a feel for what the mix should be for your car. You will know if you didnt add enough when your car dies on the side of the road due to gelling. It should start up a little while later, but add kero as soon as you can. We use the block heaters when it gets below 32F.
5. FREE FUEL?!?!? One car I actually got better idling, and with the tea kettle test it went from blowing the cap off to just bubbling. Better smelling exhaust.
6. 83 - 16,000, 84 8,000
7. I usually add kero in winter. I have also added mineral oil because a neighbor gave it to me for free. I dont find RUG to be as good as kero.
8. Give the oil time to settle. Add heat in the winter to help settling out the particles and water. I use this one: http://www.tractorsupply.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay_10551_10001_28400_-1______?rFlag=true&cFlag=1

Keep a lot of Primary fuel filters around.

I use whole house filters, and find a good source of them. I find the string wound type work better. Get a good gear pump to transfer oil I bought mine at Tractor Supply (where I get my filters as well). Here is what I use: http://www.tractorsupply.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay_10551_10001_36366_-1______?rFlag=true&cFlag=1

I am probably going to add fuel line heaters in the future.

Keep your glow plugs operating. Get the Bosch.

Do an Italian Purge once and a while (once a month??) Spring and Fall do a Diesel Purge (or whatever product you use). When it is cold out, let your car warm up before driving.

I would not use WVO in the winter Wisconsin (where I am from originally), unless you mix it with about 80% BioDiesel or reg diesel.

Any other questions?

[mobetta]

I ran mine for a year in MN w/ a single tank. started off mixing w/ D2 or Gasoline(Less than 15%) , and then added ILH's and dropped the solvents for the summer. come winter, i burned up to 80% D2 w/ wvo blended in. had added a coolant heated filter.

I am now a 2 tanker, makes me feel better about it. 32K so far on wvo.


I do have some ILH's- (injector line heaters) PM if interested.....

[ob1 canola]

Two tank is really the best way to go.
Hydrogenated wvo is almost solid at 50 degrees.
you never know what you'll get at restauarants.
I live in vt .single digits yesterday and 20 below is not uncommon.
Single tank system would be summer only here.

[bigfredb]

Originally Posted by NC Benz

I use whole house filters, and find a good source of them. I find the string wound type work better. Get a good gear pump to transfer oil

I bought my these Whole House Filters on ebay. I bought two of them at once to save shipping.

Overall time from Bid to Item Receipt - 3 days. Same seller has filters in bulk as well.

[grindMARC]

Originally Posted by NC Benz

I would not use WVO in the winter Wisconsin (where I am from originally), unless you mix it with about 80% BioDiesel or reg diesel.

Is that a typo? B100 + VO is very, very different than D2 + VO.
When you say BioD, maybe you meant something like B15 (15% B100 and 85% D2). Just trying to clarify for the sake of the thread.

[Biodiesel300TD]

I run my 240D on WVO in a two tank system. I'm not sure the risk of a single tank system is worth killing my engine, although I have spent a fair amount of time figuring out how I could do it and have it be realiable.

You can run WVO in an unheated system. The deal with VO is that it won't burn completely if it's not hot enough. VO is too viscous to burn properly at most ambient temps. When VO is too thick it won't spray out of the injector properly. Which can cause problems, namely incomplete burning of the VO. What happens when WVO and it doesn't burn completely, among other things, it gums up the piston rings, so they don't seal to the cylinder wall like it should. Which eventually will begin to allow the unburned VO into the motor oil. When motor and veggie oil mix the motor oil in the engine will polymerize, turns to sticky goo. I've seen it happen. When your oil turns to goo your engine gets no lurbication, and thus it will seize in short order. The trick to all this is that there is a threshold for how much VO can be in the motor oil before it polyermizes. The motor oil will stay oily until a certain volume of VO gets into the motor oil. At that point the oil imediatly turns to goo. If you change your oil often you can avoid this.

The worst part about any single tank conversion is you are starting the engine on cold VO, which is the worst thing you can do. You can do some pretty simple modifications to solve this issue. If you install injector line heaters that you can turn on before you start the car. And if you created a heated loop with that the injection pump and an auxillary fuel pump that you could also turn on before the car is started you could raise the temp of the VO before the car starts and alleviate the cold VO starts.

[argus445]

What about a mix i would think a 20-30% mix wouldn't change the mix enough to require it to be heated? and besides just guessing it gets preheated by the underhood air temp and general temps of engine say 10-20 degrees anyhow right?

[BioDieseLandon]

When i set my car up to run on WVO i am going to some how run my lines along my exhaust pipe to possibly collect heat from that and then do injector line heaters.

[Sbean]

BioDieseLandon,
When you run your WVO line along the exhaust pipe, are you going to measure the resulting temperature? Better use metal line. Every time I've heard anybody mention this idea, the general opinion was that the heating would be hard to control.
I've been running two '80 300 TDs on 90% WVO and 10% RUG for about 3 years. At first I got a lot of clogging of the primary (plastic) filter as the accumulated gunk was cleaned out of the tank. I'm in central California 15 miles from the coast; we get occasional light frost. I'm also using this blend in my '99 E300 turbodiesel. Steve

[firemediceric]

I've been single tank blending in my truck for two years and the MB for 18 months.

I'm in Florida and the particulars of the vehicles are in my signature

[zsmith29]

Single tank looped return w/ a lift pump. Wow that is a genius idea. I have never thought about it.
I am going to buy a fphe soon and add that to my heated fuel filter and injection line heaters.
I am thinking about adding a small marine tank in the rear for the diesel and start up and shut down on that.. Maybe.. I doubt it though (I livin the the city)