My '82 WVO "experiment" may be over! (help!) - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

holtonmusicman · #1 03-01-2009, 10:06 PM

Well, I've had mixed "luck" with "betsy".

I purchased her this past summer...ran wonderfully and then I began my WVO experimentation.

I thought I had the bugs all worked out.

I let my WVO settle for two to three weeks (I get it from Hooters and it is EXCEPTIONALLY clean) I then filter it with 10 micron filter bags.

I dilute the mixture 3/1 (3 gallons of WVO to 1 gallon of regular gasoline) and have very few problems other than plugging the primary and recently plugging the fuel strainer...MOST of this is from the old rubber lines deteriorating and I know I need to replace them with Bio-friendly lines...

SO, the other day I took a 200 mile trip...weather was @ 60 when I left...car ran beautifully on the way down...exceptionally really.

On the way home... (temp. dropped 40 degrees overnight) it felt like the filters were clogging again. I have installed a water separator/strainer to replace my pre-filter (actually has a finer mesh screen than the factory unit).

My strainer looked "clean" so I thought maybe I had plugged up the strainer in the tank again...so I pullled over, reversed hoses (inlet and return) and fired her up...ran the same, so I figured I must have plugged up the secondary...

Limped into the next town (about 25 miles away, I was doing 30 mph MAX by the time I got there).

Finally found a parts store with a filter...replaced her, primed her and fired he up...Fired up right away then sputtered and died.

I could not get her running and had to be picked up.

SO, today I spent two hours draining my strainer, filter and the lines in and around the injection pump. Took a can of good diesel with me and hooked it all up straight to this source of fuel.

She acts like she wants to catch...but she will not fire.

I will be towing her home tomorrow.

I am fearful that I may have done something to the IP (rebuilt about 150,000 miles ago).

My vehicle has 430,000 miles but rebuilt Tranny, Engine, IP and Rearend 150,000 miles ago.

ANY suggestions/Help?

( I will be eliminating my WVO experimentation until I can get my two tank system installed)

first300D · #2 03-01-2009, 10:16 PM

So are you experimenting by just adding this blend to the regular Tank ? You have not modified the care in any way prior to running the blend ?

Diesel911 · #3 03-01-2009, 10:17 PM

Give up on the WVO and use Diesel Fuel until you get it started and going good.

Disconnecting everything allowed all kinds of air to get into the system.
When you loosen the Injector Hard Line Nuts are you getting Fuel up to the Injectors?
Are you Glow Plugs all working?
Do you have a Fuel Heater?

TMAllison · #4 03-01-2009, 10:22 PM

Is it wet around your manual primer pump?

holtonmusicman · #5 03-01-2009, 11:15 PM

I have not been pre-heating the oil...and I know this is probably the root of my problems

I ran straight diesel when the temps dropped below 40 degrees...made the mistake of filling my tank with this blend in order to save on fuel costs then the temps dropped 40 degrees.

It started right up though, and ran well (70+ mph) before she started losing power...which led me to believe that filter (or screen) was plugging up.

I just couldn't figure out why it ran to the parts store...started after I replaced the filter, then puttered out. I thought that i had gotten some air in the lines, but now (after two days of trying) I still can't get her to run.

The primer pump area does appear to be "wet" but I thought this was from the fuel filter replacement (could the pump be leaking?)

I purchased a two tank system but ran out of time to get her installed...I'll do that before I run any more WVO.

This site has already been invaluable to me! Saved me when my GP's went out and I panicked.

I won't panic until someone here tells me I need to!

What suggestions to get her running though...I'm lost (I was a "regular" mechanic for 10 years...but do not have the knowledge to diagnose a diesel)

THANKS!

Diesel911 · #6 03-02-2009, 01:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by holtonmusicman

I have not been pre-heating the oil...and I know this is probably the root of my problems

I ran straight diesel when the temps dropped below 40 degrees...made the mistake of filling my tank with this blend in order to save on fuel costs then the temps dropped 40 degrees.

It started right up though, and ran well (70+ mph) before she started losing power...which led me to believe that filter (or screen) was plugging up.

I just couldn't figure out why it ran to the parts store...started after I replaced the filter, then puttered out. I thought that i had gotten some air in the lines, but now (after two days of trying) I still can't get her to run.

The primer pump area does appear to be "wet" but I thought this was from the fuel filter replacement (could the pump be leaking?)

I purchased a two tank system but ran out of time to get her installed...I'll do that before I run any more WVO.

This site has already been invaluable to me! Saved me when my GP's went out and I panicked.

I won't panic until someone here tells me I need to!

What suggestions to get her running though...I'm lost (I was a "regular" mechanic for 10 years...but do not have the knowledge to diagnose a diesel)

THANKS!

You have pretty much identified the most likely problem a being a Fuel Supply or Fuel Injection issue.
However, it is possible for some other problem to coincidently happen.

Let us know if you are getting Fuel up to the Injectors.
Running a longer hose from the inlet of the primary plastic filter to a separate container with Diesel Fuel would bypass any fuel supply problems to the rear including the Fuel Tank.

Just like the regular mechanic stuff ounce you checked the things that you think might be causing the trouble; after that it is methodicaly going down the list to eliminate all possibilites starting with the most likely ones.

Suggestions:
If you bypass the Fuel Tank by sticking the hose in a seperate container of Diesel Fuel and you work the hand primer and flush out the WVO from the IP.
I would change the Secondar/Spin-On Filter to rule that out as a source of the problem (if you think the last filter is OK; put it in a Zip-Loc Bag and save it for use later).
After that I would get the air bled out of the Hard Lines before you tighten the Injector Hard Line nuts down. Air trapped in the Hard Lines is difficult to get out by Cranking the Engine and hard on the Battery and Starter.
After the cranking to bleed the Injector Hard Lines I would put the Battery on the charger and get it fully charged or use jumper cables connected to another running Vehicle before trying to start.
Before you try to start I would be nice to know if the Glow Plugs were all working too. If you have a Meter it is easy to check.

Paulc66t · #7 03-02-2009, 08:05 AM

I would test your blend of RUG &WVO in your freezer to see what the gel point looks like temp wise.
I don't think blending with RUG is very good from my experience. I would use diesel or heating oil.
Also you should install the 2 tank set up with heat or at the worst blend more fuel into your mix dependent on temperatures.

colincoon · #8 03-02-2009, 08:47 AM

Even if you let it settle for that long you should ALWAYS pan test it to make sure there is no water in it. The water will kill your injectors and engine. The best way to de-water is to get a centrifuge, and it's well worth the money.

Also, I second using the two tank system. Just drove from Sarasota to Atlanta through a bunch of snow in the low 20's with no problems at all.

Good luck!

fireman1073 · #9 03-02-2009, 09:23 AM

One problem with running cold wvo that i experienced is that it will form a gray grease that does not dissolve until you heat it.

this is what clogs your filters

cutting with gas or anything does not seem to help

run hose in hose heated fuel lines to solve your problem permenantly

i have many miles of experience with this and this has been my experience

If you do not know how to make hose in hose heated lines do a search and you will find pictures and articles

Steve

oldsinner111 · #10 03-02-2009, 09:57 AM

Go to fattywagons they have a kit or line heater,and filter heater $70. for both.
I will only add 1 gal. gasoline to 20 gals. 70% wvo. gasoline is opposite from Cetane.

diametricalbenz · #11 03-02-2009, 10:37 AM

You might want to try putting a jar of your fuel in the fridge to see if there are solids coming out of solution. I have been carrying a jar of used fryer oil in a jar in my car and through the repeated cooling to -15F and even up to 40F there are solids that have settled out despite being perfectly clear at 70F before being put in the jar.

first300D · #12 03-02-2009, 10:49 AM

What type of fuel primer pump does your car have ?

Push type or Twist type

I've heard that the newer Push Type Primer pump doesn't like Vegi and will fail . So maybe due to the Filter's and temp you suffered from fuel starvation and then after you switched the Filter you just can't get it primed to start again. I know I've had some trouble getting mine to restart after Filter change out. Just seems like it can take a long while to get a good plug of fuel flowing again so they will start. Doesn't occur each and every time but I've seen it. Just an Idea.

But your right you need to get a 2 tank heated system it will help. I've been running for 3 years on a homemade system.

Lexxani · #13 03-02-2009, 10:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by holtonmusicman

SO, the other day I took a 200 mile trip...weather was @ 60 when I left...car ran beautifully on the way down...exceptionally really.)

That sounds eeerly similar to an issue that I had with my old diesel suburban, the rear axle seal went south on I95 at about 70mph, the ride was absolutely perfect! then I pulled off because I noticed the smoke of burning oil. I stopped at a gas station and the rear end went up in flames at the gas pumps.. I ended up driving the vehicle away from the pumps (still on fire) and using a fire extinguisher from the station to put the fire out. . .bearing seized and had to be towed 225 miles home... $875 later I had that axle rebuilt....

Not nearly the same as your problem but that discription made me think of that experience...

I second what everyone has said about the cold temps promoting the formation of waxes in your fuel supply...get a tank heater and you should be alright as the waxes will return to a normal state under a little heat, or try a 2 tank system. clean the fuel system and run on pump diesel untill you can straighten things out.

spark3542 · #14 03-02-2009, 11:44 AM

I say too much gasoline. I never make my blend more than about 15% RUG. That is more than enough to go down into single digit temps. 39,000 miles on the WVO/RUG blend on the 83 without issue.

I would recommend adding petro diesel to get it running again.

muleears · #15 03-02-2009, 12:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spark3542

I say too much gasoline. I never make my blend more than about 15% RUG. That is more than enough to go down into single digit temps. 39,000 miles on the WVO/RUG blend on the 83 without issue.

I would recommend adding petro diesel to get it running again.

X2 33% RUG is a strong blend. I've been blending in my 124 for the last 30K and never used more than 15% RUG. My current blend is just WVO and D2. Right now, with temps in the 20-40*'s its about 50-50. In the summer its straight WVO.