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  #151  
Old 11-12-2010, 07:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by C Sean Watts View Post
It was from a two tank system belonging to someone else, I did the repair work. It speaks to the wildly variable chemistry in WVO - mostly acidic and you never get the same thing twice, even from the same grease pit.
Many who use WVO in cars do not filter it properly. Contaminants and variabilty in WVO is not an issue if you know what to do with it. In 7 years of running grease, with maybe one exception, I have not put any into my tank made by anyone but me.

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  #152  
Old 11-12-2010, 09:00 AM
C Sean Watts's Avatar
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Quote:
Originally Posted by funola View Post
Many who use WVO in cars do not filter it properly. Contaminants and variabilty in WVO is not an issue if you know what to do with it. In 7 years of running grease, with maybe one exception, I have not put any into my tank made by anyone but me.
Of the oil you use, what's the average pH?
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  #153  
Old 11-12-2010, 09:25 AM
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Problems I had with wvo

Hi,
Thought I would mention some of the problems I have overcome with with wvo over 150k miles in my 240d . The sd isn't converted. Funolas comments on the type of operator and individual inclinations are key.

1-I live in California and sometimes cold start on oil before switching back (2tank). I have ruined four glow plugs this way. Usually one will open up right after the cold oil start.

2-had a pinging problem that I traced to injectors, extensive post here on that. Turned out to be clogged pilot holes on my injectors. Those are the very tiny holes on the pintle tips. I ultrasonically cleaned every year but finally changed to Monark injectors w/o the holes and the problem went away. In that way I see Monark being better for wvo. Btw the car does stnk more on diesel now with said injectors.

3-air bubbles in lines, clogged filters causing stalls on highway and poor judgement using foul oil. All typical problems overcome by experience. Wvo is a skill you need to learn the pitfalls by doing.

4-line leaks. It is amazing how much engineering goes into keeping hoses and wires from rubbing through on the body during vibration. Many leaks over 6 years of running wvo from a hose just resting on the body and vibrating. Leak=air bubble =stall. You get smart about guarding lines.

5-filters spinning off. Because I use a coiled tube heat exchanger on my filter it sometimes works the filter loose. Then I get the dreaded air bubble. Why doesn't it work tight?

It depends on the driver and more importantly the wrench. It can be big trouble. Will it trash your engine? Dunno. That is why I use my 240d. I did destroy my Rabbit in a wvo glow plug heater fire. Scary how these devices are getting popular on eBay now. Those thermal switches wear out people and if they stick on your car will have a full on glow plug dipped in wvo. I would still be driving my rabbit (good thing it burned) if it didn't burn up. For another thread.

I stll think you shouldn't do wvo to a car you cannot write off. I probably will never do the sd.
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Last edited by ykobayashi; 11-12-2010 at 10:00 AM.
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  #154  
Old 11-19-2010, 01:21 PM
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benzhacker has the definitive post on this thread. I haven't torn down an engine, but I have successfully run a 1983 300 SD for 5 winters and summers in VT with little or no trouble on WVO. I have a heat exchanger, inline heated filter, and separate system with solenoid switchover. I run 75 miles a day on my commute have gone on several long trips with no breakdowns. The engine has less ping on WVO, shifts gears more smoothly, but slightly less acceleration. Would do it all over again.
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  #155  
Old 02-23-2011, 03:46 AM
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Do you sell diesel for a living, or what?

Quote:
Originally Posted by W124 E300D View Post
Bull****.


to anyone considering WVO, three points.

1/ The Bosch in-line injection pump used in the merc is one of the highest quality, most over engineered diesel injection pumps available in a motor car.

There are better pumps out there, but not in motor cars.

Here in Europe we have diesel cars coming out of our ass, literally everyone makes them, if WVO was so good, all of these old diesels would be running it, but no, every WVO'er in Europe wants to get their hands on a merc diesel, because the IP is so good... compared to all other cars, in which the IPs die a quick death.

That fact alone tells you WVO is crap and in fact you are trading on the remaining life in an over engineered IP.

2/ Run the numbers and do the math.

Trying to do a WVO conversion PROPERLY costs from £1,000 UK Pounds on up.

Trying to make WVO also costs money, I know people living on state benefits who claim their time as being free, and it still costs them about 15 pence per litre to make the WVO suitable for the engine.

Frankly I think this is unrealistically low and fantasy land stuff, I figure it is nearer 50 pence per litre even just counting my time at minimum wage, street sweeper stuff. But what the hell, we'll go with the fantasy 15p/litre.

Here in the UK pump diesel is UK£ 1.15 a litre. If you're in the states and your fuel is FAR cheaper, the numbers come out FAR worse.

I get about 7.5 to 8.5 miles per litre, depending on the type of driving I do. Call it 8.

The UK£1,000 conversion is a capital cost, 1000 / 1.15 = 870 litres of pump diesel, which = 6,960 miles of driving.

But WVO ain't free, those 870 litres @ 15 p litre WVO costs another £130, in fact as mpg on WVO is lower, it costs nearer £150.

So basically, you have to do 10,000 miles, 100% trouble free, to break even.

Then you get into the maintenance issues associated costs, you start getting through glowplugs, you get IP issues, you eat filters for a passtime, you have to up your regimen of lube oil and filter changes, and sooner or later even on the bulletproof mercedes heads start being removed, and of course all this costs money too (quite apart from the simple loss of having a 100% reliable, turn the key and go anywhere diesel car) and even at insane UK fuel prices, all these extra repairs and maintenance start to add up, and they all buy a LOT of pump diesel.

It isn't hard to spend £1,000 under the bonnet of a merc diesel, just a top end gasket set and some minor shop remedial work, even if you do your own spannering.

But that's another 870 litres of insanely expensive UK pump diesel you could have bought, and another 10,000 miles of trouble free motoring you could have had with it, and your car is off the road again.

And we aren't even starting to look at the capital cost of the car, which you just destroyed the instant you put WVO in it (nobody else will touch the car afterwards) and of course the ongoing depreciation of the once massively over engineered IP equipment.

Basically you have to do 30,000 miles to break even, and that's at UK pump prices, and that's assuming you don't mind eating the cost of the car and killing it, which you should be taken out and shot for IMHO.

This is before you factor in your own time work, this all assumed you work for 0 cents an hour..... I know one guy who uses 15% of his product to drive around getting more WVO, and another 10% of his product in an old stationary engine to run a genny to power his WVO setup, so in fact that is 25% of his product gone before any goes in the tank, which makes the sums even worse.

3/ The very people who consider WVO are in fact the least competent to do it successfully, they are skimpers, corner cutters, people who will work 6 hours to save 5 bucks... someone else made a comment that you have to be a half decent mechanic to make WVO work properly, I'll turn that on it's head, yeah, you have to be half decent, because if you were a damn good mechanic you wouldn't go near the stuff.

And please, spare me the crap about otto diesel and peanut oil, these engines were specified to run on #2 diesel, if you want to see an engine specified to run on bunker oil, which is in fact the dino-hydrocarbon closest to WVO/VO/SVO, then go to a ship bowels, or go to an old stationary engine place.

I am a time served engineer, I could design and build my own WVO kit, I live in a country where diesel is JUST SHY OF US$2.00 per litre, I have an old W124 that I paid about a thousand bucks for, I am not rich (just going through the divorce / child courts) and I am ****ing mean, I fix everything instead of throwing it away, I make stuff rather than buy it, but even I will not even dream of running WVO in a vehicle.

If I had the capital to make a biodiesel plant, I'd never get my money back, I'd have to run a fleet of diesel vehicles to even get close.

IF I ran a light truck, which a direct injection 7 or 8 litre straight six, something like an old MAN or Petter etc, yes, then I would consider WVO, because;

a/ the engine never exceeds 2,500 RPM which is within WVO flame front speeds

b/ the engine is direct injection.

c/ the engine is minimum 1 lire per cylinder

d/ the engine drinks enough juice anyway that it is worth it.

The MB diesel FAILS on every single aspect of a WVO/VO/WVO conversion except for one very small item, the Injection Pump is extremely high quality.

The rest of the engine is TOTALLY UNSUITABLE.

Jeeze, what a long winded tirade of quackery. None of that anecdotal slop actually proves anything. Thanks for the illogical gibberish... and from an "engineer". Like the man said... 100,000 WVO miles under your belt... then you'll have some knowledge instead of of just blabbery opinion. As for me, only a few tens of thousands on WVO so far, so the jury is still out. But so far no coking and she runs like a top. Gee, so sorry she wasn't intended for it... like I care!
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  #156  
Old 02-28-2011, 02:29 AM
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oil filter

This thread is interesting, it seems like some people will only use Dyno diesel on their cars and some other fuel will destroy you car to pieces, and some other people like the idea of WVO,

I will consider myself more in the group that use WVO, although I think it puts more wear on the engine It may be paid off after some time, I think it is also more like a hobby and you get to spend more time dealing with the oil collection and filtering process, It is far more interesting than just filling up your car with diesel.

In the other hand I get to the WVO by a friend, and I find it very interesting, I think there are lots of mis information around and the whole deal of heating the oil over and over kind of defeats the idea of saving energy, I found that filtering the oil cold help to separate the fat or lard more easily, I use a home made 7500rpm computer hard drive/cooking pan centrifuge that catch up the lard and lets the oil pas trough, many of the problems with the WVO are in fact related to clog filters smoke, coking, and things around the lard itself and not the only the oil as fuel.

So far the car has run with at least 50 WVO in th tank for more than a year without any significant problem.
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  #157  
Old 03-02-2011, 07:34 PM
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Burning Grease (WVO)

I just celebrated 3 years burning WVO, and saved on average $1,800 per year, and that is about what my car cost. So, if the engine blows up tonight, I have lost nothing. Although my entire experience is nothing more than antedotal, I can tell you running a centrifuge to clean the oil is a must -- beats 1 nominal micron bags any day of the week. Also, running Elsbett Technology. Also, heat exchanger, auxillary fuel pump, and running a 2nd tank and making sure you purge the system. Starting on No.2 and ending on No.2 seems to work. Not sure I can really identify any damage to my car. Having said that, I pull the injectors and glow plugs about every 3-4 months to look for a build up of junk. None. So, even adding all the costs of a centrifuge, Elsbett Parts, et cet., I am still ahead. I would rather prematurely blow up an engine every 5 years to avoid buying more than $100 or so of No.2. You can pick up a decent engine for about $500 to $700 at the junkyard and a long weekend putting in a new engine is a small price to pay for independence from the pump. So, the real question may be whether or not a premature engine failure is worth the $7K+ in fuel savings. For me, yes. I drive a 85 300D.
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  #158  
Old 04-14-2020, 02:18 AM
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Over 100K on WVO, unconverted

Is this thread from 2011 still alive?



I've logged over 100k on well filtered WVO, UNCONVERTED, and knock on weird, no significant problems. I start with decent oil not cooked to death, let it settle for weeks or months, pour the clear layer thru a 1 micron filter bag, add about a cup of gasoline to each 4.6 gallon cubie, pour it right in the tank, and drive. In freezing weather, i will up the gasoline (10% max), and/or mix in some kerosene, and if it is really cold, run mostly kerosene or diesel. If it below about 50 deg. F, i will plug in the block heater, and also i have a magnetic heater stuck to the fuel tank that i use in cold weather. I also try to let the car warm up before taking off, especially in colder weather. In cooler weather i also keep a cubie of WVO in the house behind the woodstove and pour it in just before driving. Every few tankfuls i add some ATF, or Power service additive.



About 70,000 miles on the 1981 240D so far (it currently has a clutch problem, but i doubt that is related), and about 50,000 on my main 1985 300D. The 300D was getting a bit hard to start and smoking about 10,000 miles ago, so i cleaned the injectors, and soaked the rings for about a week in Marvel mystery oil, and now she runs great! I've run these cars on WVO from the get go, but the few times i've run diesel, i've noticed slightly more power. But i just drove the 240D 1400 miles at 70 - 75 m.p.h. mostly freeway, and 75 m.p.h. is fast enough for an old tortoise like me.


If these cars, which between them cost about $2000, died tomorrow, they have paid for them selves several times over in fuel savings, not to mention environmental impact and and pissing off the fossil fuel industry.
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  #159  
Old 04-14-2020, 11:34 AM
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I will convert it to biodiesel, or when the apocalypse hits,burn wvo,wmo,and watf

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