I checked the timing on my 79 300SD using the bubble method. It's 22 BTDC.... not 24. Is it worth the effort to change it? It seems to run ok, but I wouldn't know if it could be better. I live at about 5000 feet. Normally we can get away with an extra coulple of degrees of advance in a gas engine.

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Richard

"Die Schadenfreude ist die reinste Freude"

WoW, maybe I'm wrong but the timing for my 603 is after TDC, and by 15 degrees!

Are the older 5 cylinder diesels timed well before TDC? Maybe having a turbo changes this?

What is " the bubble method " ?

something I found here. It was in this post:

Engine running too hot. And I’ve been REALLY thorough – Have I missed something?

This is the paragraph in the post that described it:

> On the subject of diesel timing. If you are replacing the pump or rebuilding the engine. The simplest and most accurate way of setting the pump is: Disconnect the fuel line going into the pump from the filter. Take the spring and plunger out of #1 delivery valve, put the delivery valve back in and snug it down, hold the the pump linkage in the full open position. If you have the drip tube install it on the delivery valve, if not use the injector line in such a way that it is pointing away from the engine. It you don't mind the taste of diesel you can blow through the fuel line or use low air pressure. Put the open end of the injector line in a glass of water and watch the bubbles. Turn the engine slowly until the bubbles stop and check the timing mark. After tightening the pump recheck. This method is really more precise than it needs to be and although it may sound complicated it is very easy .


You should search the archives once in a while.

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Richard

"Die Schadenfreude ist die reinste Freude"

There is a post in the archive that talks about using a different tool and measuring it at 15ATDC. That must be the method you are using.

Injector timing on 300SD

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Richard

"Die Schadenfreude ist die reinste Freude"

"If you are replacing the pump or rebuilding the engine"
Ok,,, since you did not mention this being the case I would have thought that one of the methods ( high pressure , or low pressure ) would be the one used...
"The drip method" is much less work... and if you don't have the high pressure tools it is still doable for the average mechanic... and shown in the shop manual...
Most of my " searching " is done in my paper printed MB manuals... so much faster than my dial up connection for seeing stuff.... and you run across a lot of stuff which you don't even know to ask about with a CD or things like that...

hmmm... I wonder why he wrote that..... Actually, I'm doing neither, but it seemed to work fairly easily. I was just looking for a way to check the injection timing, and that one had a lot of praise.

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Richard

"Die Schadenfreude ist die reinste Freude"

15* ATDC is a reference setting vs the position of the IP timing lug for installing the timing chain. It has nothing to do with when the injector fires... which has to be BTDC or there isn't any point.

Sixto
95 S420
87 300SDL

I don't see how a diesel could fire if fuel was injected after TDC as it fires on compression..............

William Rogers..........

Advancing the injection timing by 2-5* is how most Olds Diesel owners got more power (And a blown headgasket ). The same effect can be found on these engines. Keeping it 2-3* (21-22* BTDC) should be safe.

Or you could do it the hillbilly way: Advance timing until it runs like cr@p, then back off a bit.

That reminds me to re-check the 220D this weekend, I forgot to wire the throttle wide open while checking, bet it's WAY off! (I got 20 BTDC -- should start there and it doesn't).

Anyway, the 15 ATDC timing for the 60x engines is for the hall effect pickup/pump lock tool method. There is a "pointer" on the back of the IP cam that can act as the trigger for the hall effect pickup OR can be used to lock the IP physically. It just happens to pass the "operating point" at 15 degrees ATDC. If you use a drip tube (and the bubble method mentioned above is nothing but the drip tube method using air instead of the primer pump), timing is 24-26 BTDC.

Peter

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1972 220D ?? miles
1988 300E 200,012
1987 300D Turbo killed 9/25/07, 275,000 miles
1985 Volvo 740 GLE Turobodiesel 218,000
1972 280 SE 4.5 165, 000 - It runs!

How much more power in a 300SD? Does the higher altitude here in the Rockies let you get away with it?

"The light that burns twice as bright only lasts half as long...." from my favorite movie: BladeRunner

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Richard

"Die Schadenfreude ist die reinste Freude"

I don't know the figures. But I did notice some "seat of the pants" difference, most like a 1/8 ALDA turn (For example).

Good quote.