Parts Catalog Accessories Catalog How To Articles Tech Forums
Call Pelican Parts at 888-280-7799
Shopping Cart Cart | Project List | Order Status | Help




Go Back   PeachParts Mercedes ShopForum > Technical Information and Support > Diesel Discussion

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 05-03-2005, 11:12 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Geographically challenged on the S.W shores of Lake Michigan in S,E Wisconsin
Posts: 1,160
do clogged injectors=blue taolpipe smoke?

heard this today from a former mechanic. he said an accompaning loss of power occurs when the injectors are clogged and the tailpipe smoke is blue?

this is a diesel schoolbus non mb(but we are getting mb engined buses in the near future).

any truth?
__________________
currently
[1981 300 td tdidi 165500 dark brown/palamino-Brownie-mine-3k miles of ownership
1983 240d 162+++ Anthricite grey w/ henna red interior and hella lights-wifes car-Red

the above two cars are for sale
and can be seen on the cars for sale thread here. pix also available.


240d-144+ Manilla Yellow w/ palmino interior-greasecar kit-Blondie-the college kids car

23" gt 21 speed still on original tires-still got the nubs
21" khs tandem
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 05-03-2005, 11:17 AM
boneheaddoctor's Avatar
Senior Benz fanatic
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Hells half acre (Great Falls, Virginia)
Posts: 16,007
Quote:
Originally Posted by 83-240D
heard this today from a former mechanic. he said an accompaning loss of power occurs when the injectors are clogged and the tailpipe smoke is blue?

this is a diesel schoolbus non mb(but we are getting mb engined buses in the near future).

any truth?
blue/white smoke from exhaust is always oil burnig....

clogged injectors would have either white smoke or black smoke along with a heavy odor of fuel in the smoke.
__________________
Proud owner of ....
1971 280SE W108
1979 300SD W116
1983 300D W123
1975 Ironhead Sportster chopper
1987 GMC 3/4 ton 4X4 Diesel
1989 Honda Civic (Heavily modified)
---------------------
Section 609 MVAC Certified
---------------------
"He who fights with monsters might take care lest he thereby become a monster. And if you gaze for long into an abyss, the abyss gazes also into you." - Friedrich Nietzsche
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 05-03-2005, 11:29 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: PA
Posts: 5,440
83-240D,

Seems like clogged injectors would not cause smoke from the exhaust. If an injector was not injecting fuel the engine would miss fire on that cylinder and only air would come out of the cylinder.

White smoke from the exhaust it actually unburned fuel, fuel that has not ignited. I don't see how a clogged injector would cause unburned fuel to get into the exhaust sine it isn't injecting any fuel.

Just my logical conclusion.

P E H
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 05-03-2005, 11:33 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Geographically challenged on the S.W shores of Lake Michigan in S,E Wisconsin
Posts: 1,160
thanks fellas.

i thought that idea was wrong. loss of power would then be caused by the rings getting a little wide reducing compression and allowing oil into the cylinder. i will ask the driver about hard starting also.
__________________
currently
[1981 300 td tdidi 165500 dark brown/palamino-Brownie-mine-3k miles of ownership
1983 240d 162+++ Anthricite grey w/ henna red interior and hella lights-wifes car-Red

the above two cars are for sale
and can be seen on the cars for sale thread here. pix also available.


240d-144+ Manilla Yellow w/ palmino interior-greasecar kit-Blondie-the college kids car

23" gt 21 speed still on original tires-still got the nubs
21" khs tandem
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 05-03-2005, 03:53 PM
Old300D's Avatar
Biodiesel Fiend
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Denver, CO
Posts: 1,883
I've seen "clogged" injectors that still pass fuel -- dripping instead of spraying. In that case you get nailing and black smoke from unburned fuel.
__________________
'83 240D with 617.952 and 2.88
'01 VW Beetle TDI
'05 Jeep Liberty CRD
'89 Toyota 4x4, needs 2L-T
'78 280Z with L28ET - 12.86@110
Oil Burner Kartel #35

http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b1...oD/bioclip.jpg
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 05-03-2005, 04:05 PM
TwitchKitty's Avatar
Just fix it
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Varies
Posts: 3,312
http://www.freeautoadvice.com/diesel/smoke.html

Here is a link to a diesel exhaust color analysis article. It is not the best one that I have seen but it was high on the google list. Google will probably give you better.

I googled:diesel diagnostics smoke color

Quote:
The first category is blue-white smoke:

Blue-white smoke may be noticed at engine start-up whether the engine is at normal operating temperature or not. Blue-white smoke can be observed at all ambient temperatures and should not last longer than a minute or two after the vehicle has been driven. Blue-white smoke can return when ambient temperature is below 10 degrees C (50 degrees F), and after the engine is warmed up due to extended idling. This is due to combustion chambers cooling own during periods of extended idling time. Heavy blue-white smoke may also occur if the engine is operated at full throttle with the transmission in neutral or park. If you see continuous Blue-white smoke while driving, then you probably have air being sucked into the fuel system.

The second category is white smoke:

White smoke and blue-white smoke share some of the same characteristics. White smoke is fuel not being burned. Extreme white smoke can be caused by the combustion chambers cooling down. One cause of this could be incorrect injection pump timing. Coolant getting into the combustion chamber can cause white smoke also. Possible causes are blown head gaskets, cracked heads cavitation, etc.

The third category is black smoke:

Black smoke is caused by an over rich mixture and normally occurs whenever the engine is working hard. Like going up a steep grade, being loaded heavy or during heavy acceleration. More black smoke can be observed when the vehicle is operated at higher altitudes because the air is thinner. A dirty air filter is also another cause of excessive black smoke. If black smoke is noticed while the engine is idling at low altitude or under normal driving conditions this condition should be diagnosed a.s.a.p. to prevent engine damage.

The fourth category is blue smoke:

Blue smoke is not normal and you do not want to be driving behind a truck that produces it. Blue smoke occurs when oil is entering the combustion chamber and is burning along with the fuel. Blue smoke usual indicates a condition which should be corrected a.s.a.p. Blue smoke also smells like oil burning. Possible causes include valve seals or cracked piston rings.
__________________
And that's the way it is. Sorry if this is not what you wanted to hear. I reserve the right to be wrong, others take the liberty. My posts are not intended to be complete, just enough to help you find your own answers. Don't let the Relevance Paradox get you.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 05-03-2005, 06:26 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Geographically challenged on the S.W shores of Lake Michigan in S,E Wisconsin
Posts: 1,160
Quote:
Originally Posted by Old300D
I've seen "clogged" injectors that still pass fuel -- dripping instead of spraying. In that case you get nailing and black smoke from unburned fuel.
wqe got a couple of those too. i had one friday and i sat for 2 min revving the motor to get it warm enough to get over 20. then the smoke went away.
__________________
currently
[1981 300 td tdidi 165500 dark brown/palamino-Brownie-mine-3k miles of ownership
1983 240d 162+++ Anthricite grey w/ henna red interior and hella lights-wifes car-Red

the above two cars are for sale
and can be seen on the cars for sale thread here. pix also available.


240d-144+ Manilla Yellow w/ palmino interior-greasecar kit-Blondie-the college kids car

23" gt 21 speed still on original tires-still got the nubs
21" khs tandem
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 05-03-2005, 06:53 PM
t walgamuth's Avatar
dieselarchitect
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Lafayette Indiana
Posts: 32,147
smoking

the blue smoke from unburnt diesel and the blue smoke from oil consumption is not easily distinguished in my experience. the way to tell one from another is to look at how and when it is smoking.

otherwise the above list of symptoms etc is excellent.
__________________
[SIGPIC] Diesel loving autocrossing grandpa Architect. 08 Dodge 3/4 ton with Cummins& six speed; I have had about 35 benzes. I am finishing a 39 Studebaker Coupe Express pickup in which I have had installed a 617 turbo and a five speed manual....I also have a 427 Cobra replica with an aluminum chassis.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 05-03-2005, 09:35 PM
Johnhef's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Frederick, Md
Posts: 4,540
very informative

I have recently been dealing with some unusual smoking with my 300CD, maybe someone can shed some light on.

For the last few months, when it was cold out, I'd start the car in the morning and let it idle about 5-10 minutes. After backing out of the driveway and on the first acceleration, a nice BIG cloud of white smoke with some blue tint would exit the car. The rest of the time, it produced no visible smoke. It will still do this.

With in the last two weeks, I've noticed when I'm sitting at a light it will start smoking heavily untill I pull away, and then no visible smoke, only at idle. There also doesn't seem to be a pattern to it, as in it doesn't do it everytime I come to a stop. The last time it did it was yestarday when I came to stoplight after about 10 miles of Interstate driving between 70-80mph.

Its really starting to bug me. Thanks for any advice...
__________________


1980 500SE/AMG Euro
1981 500SEL Euro
1982 380SEL
1983 300TD
1983 500SEC/AMG Euro
1984 500SEC
1984 300TD Euro
1986 190E 2.3-16
1986 190E 2.3
1987 300D
1997 C36 AMG
2003 C320T 4matic

past: 1969 280SE 4.5 | 1978 240D | 1978 300D | 1981 300SD | 1981 300SD | 1982 300CD | 1983 300CD | 1983 300SD | 1983 380SEC | 1984 300D | 1984 300D | 1984 300TD | 1984 500SEL | 1984 300SD | 1985 300D | 1986 300E | 1986 560SEL | 1986 560SEL/Carat | 1987 560SEC | 1991 300D 2.5 | 2006 R350
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 05-03-2005, 10:20 PM
TwitchKitty's Avatar
Just fix it
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Varies
Posts: 3,312
Quote:
Originally Posted by Old300D
I've seen "clogged" injectors that still pass fuel -- dripping instead of spraying. In that case you get nailing and black smoke from unburned fuel.
In our injectors what clogs are the tiny holes drilled through the pintles. The fuel is supposed to inject through the holes. When the holes clog the hydraulic pressure abnormally lifts the pintle off of its seat and the fuel injects through the abnormal opening between the pintle and its seat. The car will actually run quite well like this but you will get cold start nailing, smoking, uneven idle and many of the symptoms in the common complaints.

Tech Specs Injectors- Torque and Bar Pressures

More info and some links in this thread.
__________________
And that's the way it is. Sorry if this is not what you wanted to hear. I reserve the right to be wrong, others take the liberty. My posts are not intended to be complete, just enough to help you find your own answers. Don't let the Relevance Paradox get you.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Black smoke at take off mrhaney Diesel Discussion 10 04-12-2005 09:02 PM
Two Questions: Smoke and Glow regsatx Diesel Discussion 6 11-20-2004 01:05 PM
help just white smoke on 500sec engine striper Tech Help 3 05-24-2004 05:44 PM
Lots of smoke from Car...need assistance. Damion Vintage Mercedes 8 04-10-2003 08:14 PM
white smoke from under the hood. emilo Tech Help 8 04-03-2001 03:56 AM



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 11:55 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2018 Pelican Parts LLC - Posts may be archived for display on the Peach Parts or Pelican Parts Website -    DMCA Registered Agent Contact Page