Injection pump drive - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

coachgeo · #1 02-10-2006, 10:29 PM

on the 617 what drives the injection pump? Is it off the timing chain? How hard would it be to drive an IP via an electric motor? I'm Looking for a way to build a "WVO flash evaporator"* (spray hot veg oil in a mist to drive off water vapor. The water vapor would rise and be bleed off, while the oil would cool and return to the tank. Since I have an extra IP..... why not us it for this? Thinking of this idea for both ON THE ROAD dewatering of oil I collect from resturants while cross country driving and also for at home WVO oil to fuel preperation.

Anyone have another idea/better idea? for repeat popping one or more injectors.

Thanx in advance.

* more on flash evaporator here: http://biodiesel.infopop.cc/groupee/forums/a/tpc/f/159605551/m/352100169

#2 02-11-2006, 01:36 AM

Yes, the ip is driven by the timing chain. If you ever tried to turn an ip by hand (which to a small extent is necessary when changing the timing belt on volkswagens) you'd find that it takes a good amount of force to do so. So an electric motor could be used-provided it is geared down enough-very large pulley on the ip+small one on the motor. Without an onboard generator the electric motor would be hard for the alternator to handle. I did not check out the link only because I don't see how running fuel through it will cause enough rise in temp to make the water evaporate. I assume the basis for this has to do with a law of thermodymanics which says an increase in pressure will result in an increase in temp. Running fuel through the ip will pressurize it and therefore raise the temp, but I can't believe it would be raised enough so the water would separate from oil. I may be wrong by saying that. In any case water removal can be accomplished by a slow boil/simmer of the oil. Seems like the easiest thing would be to build a heating tank in the trunk. Something like a pressure cooker with a low psi relief valve, the water would dissipate in the form of steam. Even if you get the heat from a heating element which is powered by the alt, I think it would be more feasible than using the alt to drive an electric motor for a 2nd ip. I don't know...it is really cold where I live...mabee my response would have been different in summer.

coachgeo · #3 02-11-2006, 09:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark Tamburrino

Yes, the ip is driven by the timing chain. ... I don't see how running fuel through it will cause enough rise in temp to make the water evaporate. ....

In this project the IP is only to get a mist spray out of preheated oil. IP use is NOT intended to add any heat.

Ralph69220d · #4 02-11-2006, 09:43 AM

In my '51 John Deere it uses a simple glass bowl water/gasoline separator right before the carburetor; since water has a higher specific gravity than gas, the water settles to the bottom of the bowl and one can readily see when the bowl needs emptying. I don't see why that wouldn't work as a WVO/water separator.

TheDon · #5 02-11-2006, 10:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ralph69220d

In my '51 John Deere it uses a simple glass bowl water/gasoline separator right before the carburetor; since water has a higher specific gravity than gas, the water settles to the bottom of the bowl and one can readily see when the bowl needs emptying. I don't see why that wouldn't work as a WVO/water separator.

in WVO water is not only sometimes in little globuales but is also emulsified within the wvo in small amounts setteling would take for ever for the water to drop out so heating it and either boiling it or heating it up to 150 and letting it settle will get it out faster

Diesel Giant · #6 02-11-2006, 01:06 PM

Yep turned by the timing chain.

OMEGAMAN · #7 02-11-2006, 01:13 PM

How about a pump and nozzle from an oil fired furnace I wonder if that would work. You could probably just hook up 110v to that and run it.

coachgeo · #8 02-11-2006, 02:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OMEGAMAN

How about a pump and nozzle from an oil fired furnace I wonder if that would work. You could probably just hook up 110v to that and run it.

I dont have an extension cord that is long enough to reach from FL to..... say Mexico or Canada.

IP idea is for an On Board water remover from oil collected and used while traveling cross country (as was stated in the opening post). There are several options (includng this flash evaporator idea) that I can use for drying the fuel at home. In the thread linked above it was suggested that furnace nozles do not mist very well for water evap. purposes.

#9 02-11-2006, 03:58 PM

Use an IP off a 1976 or older Take an electric skateboard, remove motor and speed controller put a gear on the IP drive that will match the gear on the motor for the belt drive. Rig up power off the huge lead acid gel cells from the skateboard charge those off the alternator. I have not a clue if it will dewater your WVO but I know it will run the IP if you want to buy one I think I have most of the parts left except the IP it is in my car now.
Dave S

OMEGAMAN · #10 02-11-2006, 05:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by coachgeo

I dont have an extension cord that is long enough to reach from FL to..... say Mexico or Canada.

IP idea is for an On Board water remover from oil collected and used while traveling cross country (as was stated in the opening post). There are several options (includng this flash evaporator idea) that I can use for drying the fuel at home. In the thread linked above it was suggested that furnace nozles do not mist very well for water evap. purposes.

Thats too bad because you could use a power inverter.

p5150 · #11 02-12-2006, 02:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark Tamburrino

I assume the basis for this has to do with a law of thermodymanics which says an increase in pressure will result in an increase in temp. Running fuel through the ip will pressurize it and therefore raise the temp, but I can't believe it would be raised enough so the water would separate from oil.

Mark - I think your doubts are correct. It is my understanding that compressing a liquid will not raise its temperature. A gas temperature will raise when compressed simply because you are concentrating all of the heat energy from a larger volume of air into a smaller chamber. I guess it could be looked at like a magnifying glass with the sun. You dont increase the amount of energy, you just concentrate it. Liquids dont really compress a measurable amount.

PanzerSD · #12 02-12-2006, 03:32 AM

I can see that idea working for drying Biodiesel, not so much SVO.