Sticky starter ONLY when cold outside - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

#1 10-17-2006, 08:12 PM

On cold days, I turn the key to the start position and the starter clunks (Like it's connecting with the flywheel) then it runs free. Repeating this cycle two or three times will usually get it to connect and start the engine. I've never hit the starter and it never does this when the air above 40*f. If the engine is warm or it's a warm day, it works flawlessly.

I had this problem last winter and it went away completely once it the days got warmer. Now that it got down to 35* today, it's happening again.

Any ideas on what it's doing or how to fix it? Is the starter about to cr@p out?

pawoSD · #2 10-17-2006, 08:17 PM

Our car ('83) has the opposite problem, it will crank right up when cold, but the starter is slow to disengage and it makes a kuhuhuhuh sound for a second. Its been doing it for years, never has any problems when the engine is warm or its above 45-50 out. Below that it will do it once a day. Odd, but we're just going to leave it alone.

Shorebilly · #3 10-17-2006, 08:53 PM

Howdy,

My old but classic Tractor ('67 Eicher ES202), of West German manufacture has a Bosch starter.....and it has the same problem.....

On the Eicher, the forward Transmission (ZF) seal leaks a bit, and it slings gear oil across the clutch/pressure plate/flywheel...and into the cupped end of the starter (the part that the Bendix popps out into)......the heavy gear oil and other sludge accumulates on/in the Bendix itself......causing it to hang up and not throw in smartly in cold weather......

...as that particular Bendix assembly is kinda rare here in the USA (last spring there were 2ea in Atlanta.....period) and they are also quite expensive.....and changing the transmission seal requires splitting the tractor, which will get done some time this winter.......and servicing everything inside and accessable when tractor is split......I may then pony up for a new bendix assembly....

....the Bendix can be made to work well for awhile if it is disassembled and cleaned......there are little ball bearings that work against a ramp (circular), and profide enough friction to allow the starter to turn over the engine.....these little balls get gummed up, and then the bendiz hangs up.....

.....or you can, try to start....if it dosen't engage....let the starter run for a little bit longer than normal.....vibration and warmth of bearings will help it to work a little quicker......trust me....lol

SB

TheDon · #4 10-17-2006, 09:42 PM

its probably the grease like the previous poster suggested.. id think that too.. as it gets cold it starts getting firmer and perhaps its to the point where its a pita to move

Stevo · #5 01-13-2007, 10:28 AM

I would take off the battery connections and clean them, make sure the connections are tight on the starter. You most likely need a new starter if the problem persists after that, it'll run you around $125 for a good Bosch reman, I personally don't mess with "chepos"

Knightrider966 · #6 01-13-2007, 10:41 AM

Alikely cause would be the starter solenoid slider binding up somewhat. Removing the starter and greasing up the slide fixed this for me. Mine just spun when it was cold ans after that it was fine, put a little Molybdenum grease and problem solved!

#7 01-13-2007, 11:15 AM

I had the same issue (only in very cold temperatures, about -5F) a few years ago. I replaced the starter after the first time it did it, and it never happened again. It was probably just sticking, but IMHO it's too much work to R&R the starter without putting in new one. You can get a reman Bosch for under $200, don't bother with the cheap rebuilds.

Mustang_man298 · #8 01-13-2007, 11:26 AM

I had the same thing happen on mine, swapping it out with my spare solved it, I still have to tear into the other one. Generally this happens bacause either the lube on the bendix mechanism gets old and gummy, so cold starts are hard but once the engine heats it up a little its fine the rest of the day, eventually it gets so bad it just wont move. The other cause is some debris or moisture got in there, and caused some galling in the solenoid slider, cold metal shrinks over night tightening up on the burr(s) making it hard to slide, apply a little engine heat and the metal expands allowing free movement. cleaning andregreasing is easy enough, and if its scored some, a little crocus cloth will take the burrs down.

whunter · #9 01-13-2007, 12:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChicagoJones

Sometimes on a cold start (the first start of the day) with the first turn of the key and having the glow plug light on, the starter will sometimes not engage and free spin. I would then turn the key to the off position, then turn it to the glow plug position for a few seconds and finally start it -It works. The rest of the day the starter will engage all the time. This does not happen every day.
Any ideas why it is doing this?

Car 1983 300D.

Your issue is a defective solenoid or gummed up Bendix.

My advice would be to remove the starter, disassemble, clean, lubricate, and re install it, or you can replace it.

Some links that may help.

Starter health is important to your diesel!!!
http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/diesel-discussion/107318-starter-health-important-your-diesel.html#post739798

Gear reduction starter for W126 diesel?
Gear reduction starter for W126 diesel?

Tackling a starter, need suggestions (and sympathy)
http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/diesel-discussion/135985-tackling-starter-need-suggestions-sympathy.html#post1001659

Battery Safety
http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/diesel-discussion/141479-battery-safety.html#post1057827

Battery selection / Charging System / jump starting / cold weather battery issues
http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/diesel-discussion/141516-battery-selection-charging-system-jump-starting-cold-weather-battery-issues.html#post1058189

Have a great day.

Knightrider966 · #10 01-13-2007, 01:31 PM

Thanks guys! I could not remember the name of the Bendix Spring Slide!

ChicagoJones · #11 01-13-2007, 03:34 PM

I've got the exact same issue. I will take a look at the bendix mechanism and think real hard about getting a rebuilt one. It got down to 24 degrees this morning and it acted up. So far afterwards no problems. Do you think if it continues like this I could possibly tear up my flywheel?

Stevo · #12 01-13-2007, 05:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChicagoJones

Thanks guys, I will take a look at the bendix mechanism and think real hard about getting a rebuilt one. It got down to 24 degrees this morning and it acted up. So far afterwards no problems. Do you think if it continues like this I could possibly tear up my flywheel?

You are probably the best judge of that, does it make an ugly sound

when engaging? Pulling the F/W and having a new ring gear installed is not a fun or cheap job.

Knightrider966 · #13 01-13-2007, 05:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChicagoJones

Thanks guys, I will take a look at the bendix mechanism and think real hard about getting a rebuilt one. It got down to 24 degrees this morning and it acted up. So far afterwards no problems. Do you think if it continues like this I could possibly tear up my flywheel?

If it's making a rasping noise while spinning freely and catching the flywheel in the process, YOU BET! And if allowed to go for to long, this will not be an easy or cheap repair!

Samuel M. Ross · #14 01-14-2007, 12:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stevo

You are probably the best judge of that, does it make an ugly sound

when engaging? Pulling the F/W and having a new ring gear installed is not a fun or cheap job.

... that is during the cold of winter it often fails to engage when first we try to start it.

Thanks for this discussion. I suppose to test this theory I could remove the starter, clean up the bendix, lubricate it with a light oil and then see if the slipping goes away for a while... or should I just bight the bullet now and go for the complete rebuilt starter...~$150?

Regards,

winmutt · #15 01-14-2007, 02:29 AM

I went through the forum a while back on this. The best bet was to take apart the actuator and regrease it with something less temp sensitive.