Bio-Diesel OK in new E-320? - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

robbin · #1 12-10-2007, 06:02 PM

What is the truth regarding Bio in a 2007 Mercedes Bluetec? Mercedes has only approved a 5% blend provided the bio meets ASTM D6751 & has the necesssary osidation stability )min. 6h, proved with EN14112 method) to prevent damages to the system from deposits and/or corrosion.

Does the biodiesel sold here in Houson meet these criteria?

Is Mercedes being overly conservative? Can you actually run a higher percentage blend? (B-20)

Will running biodiesel adversely affect my engine?

Can mercedes tell when servicing the car whether it has been using biodiesel, and if so, can they tell what percentage blend I have been using.

Just concerned because there are so many unknowns for me.

Thank you for any input you all could give.

#2 12-10-2007, 06:06 PM

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Does the biodiesel sold here in Houson meet these criteria?

Ask. Find a station that sells it and ask them if it meets the standards.

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Is Mercedes being overly conservative?

Yes, for their own protection. BioD in the states varies widely from station to station as there are no concrete quality standards required for it. They set the limit low to protect themselves from a potentially large number of warranty claims from poor fuel quality.

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Can you actually run a higher percentage blend? (B-20)

Yes, if you want to immediately void your warranty.

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Will running biodiesel adversely affect my engine?

Probably not. Willie Nelson had issues with his fuel lines melting with B100.

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Can Mercedes tell when servicing the car whether it has been using biodiesel, and if so, can they tell what percentage blend I have been using.

Yes, they have tests for it. However, they will likely not check unless they have a reason to suspect it's use (Bumper stickers, you say something about it, etc) or a fuel/engine related part has failed. Unfortunately, there are some crooked dealers out there that will "overlook" its use.

It's all up to you and if you want to risk it. Retail B5 is all you can use if you want to keep your warranty, WVO and SVO are completely out of the question.

Hatterasguy · #3 12-10-2007, 06:35 PM

Considering the car is under warranty I would only run what the manual says you can, until it expires. Because if you have a major fuel system problem, and the dealer suspect that you run biodiesel you will be SOL. It wouldn't take much for them to send a sample of your fuel to the lab and see it come back as B20 or B100. Then say by, by to any warranty.

#4 12-10-2007, 06:45 PM

Especially a Bluetec. That filter/cat combo alone runs in the $x,000 range to replace.

Hatterasguy · #5 12-10-2007, 06:49 PM

Replacing whatever makes it a "bluetec" part would be scary!

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

greasybenz · #6 12-10-2007, 06:51 PM

You will NOT void your warranty if you run biodiesel. BUT dont expect them to honor a fuel related repair if you have over B5 biodiesel in the tank, most common biodiesel problems with late model diesels is that they dont take very well to bad fuel, whether it be diesel or biodiesel.

Biodiesel on the other hand doesnt have mandated standards, so it can vary in quality. To be 100% sure ask the vendor for the test sheet from their recent batch of biodiesel to see if it meets the ASTM standards. If they cant provide you one then run the fuel at your own risk.

Can they test your tank for the amount of biodiesel in your tank? YES! but its an expensive test, dealers wont waste their money on a $500 test at every oil change just to screw with you. But if you happen to come in with a bad injection pump and they suspect biodiesel was the culprit they will have the test done to see if your over the B5 limit.

But you can always siphon out the bad fuel fill it up with diesel and they will have to honor your repair

Hatterasguy · #7 12-10-2007, 06:56 PM

Yeah but on a bluetec the "fuel system" would include some really expensive parts. Like the CDI system, the emissions system, exhuast. If you run B100 fry your injectors and cook the cats, MB is going to say your SOL. Thats probably a $6k+ bill on one of these. Or what if you cook the engine! OMFG bend over I bet a new dealer installed engine is $15k or more!

But is saving the world in a $60k leather and rare wood lined luxury car is that important, whats a couple of bucks.

#8 12-10-2007, 06:55 PM

I wouldn't do it; too high a risk/reward ratio.

TMAllison · #9 12-10-2007, 06:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Craig

I wouldn't do it; too high a risk/reward ratio.

Agreed. Wait for your warranty to run out and in the mean time let others be the guinea pig to determine exactly what % that engine can run w/o problems.

Don M · #10 12-10-2007, 08:01 PM

I have repaired more Common Rail injectors damaged from bio diesel use that its no longer funny. Follow the 5% max and it will be fine. Anything over that and you are asking for destruction.

greasybenz · #11 12-10-2007, 08:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Don M

I have repaired more Common Rail injectors damaged from bio diesel use that its no longer funny. Follow the 5% max and it will be fine. Anything over that and you are asking for destruction.

Can you explain what had happen to the injectors from the biodiesel? Was it a biodiesel quality problem?

Because you do know that biodiesel is allowed at 100% in germany becaue of the mandated quality control.

aklim · #12 12-11-2007, 12:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by greasybenz

Because you do know that biodiesel is allowed at 100% in germany becaue of the mandated quality control.

But this ain't Germany and we don't have that sort of QC here for Bio.

greasybenz · #13 12-11-2007, 02:36 AM

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Originally Posted by aklim

But this ain't Germany and we don't have that sort of QC here for Bio.

We do have quality check standards, its just not mandated. Here is how to understand ASTM test results.

http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=110004&highlight=biodiesel+pd

People just make things more complicated or harder then it really is, its not hard to ask for the test results and check. If the results are good the fuel is ok in your car, if the test results just barley meet the standard or just suck then run it at your own risk.

simple dude

aklim · #14 12-11-2007, 01:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by greasybenz

We do have quality check standards, its just not mandated. Here is how to understand ASTM test results.

if the test results just barley meet the standard or just suck then run it at your own risk.

If it isn't mandated, how does the company know whether you are getting the good stuff or not? If not, why should they warranty your car?

True. However, when it is under warranty, you are running it at THEIR risk. Again, why should they take the risk?

thesst · #15 12-10-2007, 08:18 PM

Why would you want to run bio in a 2007 Bluetec? Just curious.