W123 300td Backup Lights -- Now with Aftermarket Fogs! - Page 2 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

mobetta · #16 07-29-2008, 08:05 PM

Here is a good place to learn the basics of a relay.

run a 12 0r 10 ga wire from battery - fuse - relay - lites. use the existing wiring for the trigger on the relay.(pin 85, usually.)

I think the best route is to run the wiring back to near the power antenna, and then you can also have a 12v socket back there. gives the kids a place to plug in the dvd or videee-oh games. simply wire in the socket before the relay, so it always has power to it.

two 55 w lites=10 amp minimum fuse. plus the 12v socket- I recommend 10 ga wire and a 25 amp fuse. if you skip the socket, then 12 ga wire and a 15 amp use is prolly what you want.

mounting the lights for me was pretty easy- the holders for the old ones were pretty rusty, so I wedged them in there and used some wire ties to fasten them to the old brackets. once you get the old ones out and the new lights in hand, it will come to you.

pizzachef · #17 11-17-2008, 05:13 PM

Rather than start a new thread, I figured I'd put this here since its related.

Does anyone know of a light that's about the same size as the wagon reverse light that is part red also??I'd like to wire the red portion to the rear fog light source and the whites will be reverse (naturally). Right now I have one red and one white, as is the euro way, but neither have the reflector in them...they rusted away long ago. For the reverse, I have some aluminum foil crammed back there, and the fog has no bulb...I didn't want to melt the housing.

But I'd like to have some rear fog lights, since my rear tail lights are pretty minuscule and one's not that bright.

Hmm...maybe I'll just make them both all red and leave a bare bulb dangling back there for reverse...its never lit for long

disqo · #18 11-17-2008, 06:31 PM

I have had good luck finding replacement Euro foglights for my TD on ebay.co.uk. The cost of shipping hurts, but the prices so far have been been pretty good.

pizzachef · #19 11-17-2008, 07:41 PM

Hmm...I hadn't thought of that. I'll look around the UK ebay site. I would still like to add some additional tail lights...they don't necessarily have to be bright like rear fogs, but some combo reverse/tail lights was all I had come up with so far.
Thanks

Mark DiSilvestro · #20 11-17-2008, 11:39 PM

I just went through this with my '84 Euro TD while installing a replacement rear bumper. This car had previously been hit in the rear at least a couple times, mangling the left corner of the original Euro rear bumper and slighly bending the tailgate enough to jam the lock.
Since a PO had already fitted a USA front bumper to the car, I decided to install a matching USA rear bumper, along with the matching USA end-boots and skirt.
Unfortunatly, I was unable to come up with any TD rear bumpers at local salvage yards or the Virginia Beach Pick-N-Pull, so I decided to use one of my spare w123 sedan rear bumpers and hang the existing, mismatched backup lights below and slightly inboard.for now. I considered installing a pair of fogs but didn't want to rewire the car, or modify the fogs for a low-watt backup bulb. While browsing through several autoparts stores, I found several $20 sets of low-profile LED driving light kits at Advance Auto, that may work better below my sedan bumper. One of the styles uses 12 LEDs housed in a 5" wide by 1" high by 1" deep chrome-plated plastic housing that would hang down far less than the mismatched pair I'm using now, and the chrome housing would look OK attached under the bumper. I'm hoping the LED's current draw would be low enough to not require a relay, but there's no wattage information on the package. What do you think?

Happy Motoring, Mark

pizzachef · #21 11-18-2008, 07:32 AM

My car was also rear-ended, a little heavier on the left side. I got a replacement hatch that doesn't seal as well as the original one (could also be due to the wreck) and I found a replacement bumper in the parts section here, but had to ship it from CA. Both my original bumper and the one I got from CA had completely rusted out reflectors in the light housings.

But to answer your question, LED's in general draw much less current that regular lights, but the manufacturer could have installed resistors to make them draw about the same current that a regular light would...that's the case with turn signals anyway, if those lights aren't meant to be turn signals, then that's probably not the case. Are they red or white? Another clue is the size of wire that powers the lights. I got an LED 3rd brake light that's about 12" long, a single row of LED's and it has a tiny wire to power it.

Mark DiSilvestro · #22 11-18-2008, 10:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pizzachef

My car was also rear-ended, a little heavier on the left side. I got a replacement hatch that doesn't seal as well as the original one (could also be due to the wreck) and I found a replacement bumper in the parts section here, but had to ship it from CA. Both my original bumper and the one I got from CA had completely rusted out reflectors in the light housings.

But to answer your question, LED's in general draw much less current that regular lights, but the manufacturer could have installed resistors to make them draw about the same current that a regular light would...that's the case with turn signals anyway, if those lights aren't meant to be turn signals, then that's probably not the case. Are they red or white? Another clue is the size of wire that powers the lights. I got an LED 3rd brake light that's about 12" long, a single row of LED's and it has a tiny wire to power it.

AS far as I can tell without opening the package, the Chinese LED-light wires look smaller than the original ones feeding my existing, mismatchd backup lights. The impact that mangled the left end of my original Euro bumper, also smashed the original backup light into the fender (hence the mismatced lights) creating a large crater that I had to hammer out in order to attach the trailing end of the replacement US-spec bumper boot.

The original Euro bumper was also so close to the the body that apparently a second bump slightly flattened the curve at the trailing end of the tailgate hatch. This prevented the tailgate from being unlocked, as the latch is designed to keep it locked if there is any pressure on the external release button. After an al-day struggle to get the hatch open and remove the latch assembly, through much trial & error I was able to slightly modify the latch interlock and restore normal lock function to my slightly-deformed tailgate. As it appears this tailgate was also a replacemebt by the PO, I'm willing to live with the minor cosmetic flaw, but decided on better protection from a US rear bumper, that also matches the PO-installed front bumper.

I think I'll gamble $20 on those Chinese LED lights, just to experiment, as I believe eventually something may snap off one or both of my current low-hanging backup lights.
The package is labled "White LED Driving Lights", and in small-print "Show or off-road use only". They're also availble in Blue.

Happy Motoring, Mark

Mark DiSilvestro · #23 11-19-2008, 09:55 AM

Well, I bought a set of chrome-trimmed Chinese LED 'driving lights'. They're about 5" wide by 1" high and !" deep. They come with real flimsy mounting brackets that I'll need to change if I decide to use them. They only draw about 5 watts and definitely aren't as bright as halogen driving lights, but they would be adequate as backup lights in this situation as they wouldn't hang more than about 1" below my bumper. I also asked my local Virginia state auto inspector and he said the backup lights aren't a state requirement and it would b OK if I competely removed them. So I have the options of staying with the more vulnerable setup I have now, instaling my cheap but more suitable Chinese LED lights, doing without, or finding a complete intact wagon bumper with matching OE lights.

Happy Motoring, Mark

Mark DiSilvestro · #24 11-24-2008, 12:19 AM

While finishing up the rear bumper swap on my '84 Euro 300TD, I solved the mystery of why my left backup lamp wiring harness wasn't supplying power, and why someone had wired a jumper from there to the right backup light harness in order to get both backup lights to work.
I checked my W123 Haynes manual. Though sometimes the Haynes is frustrating, mine at least has wiring diagrams for both US and UK variations of the 300TD.
I discovered that the Euro/UK TD has the right rear bumper-lamp wired as a backup light, while the left rear bumper-lamp is wired to the headlamp switch as a fog-light. Saved me countless hours trying to root around my wiring to search for a fault.
Unfortunately, I'll have to leave both rear bumper lamps wired for backup lights, as some VA state inspectors might not appreciate the concept of a backup-light on the right and a rear fog-light on the left.

Happy Motoring, Mark

pizzachef · #25 11-24-2008, 08:47 AM

Mine has a red lens on the left and it comes on when you pull the headlight knob to the second detent. This is supposedly the euro way. My mechanic/inspector doesn't have a problem with it, then again, he's a Mercedes guy and really digs the car

Can you post a link to the lights you got? Or were they just generic lights from Advanced Auto? I'm having trouble keeping all the lights in this thread straight

Mark DiSilvestro · #26 11-24-2008, 09:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pizzachef

Mine has a red lens on the left and it comes on when you pull the headlight knob to the second detent. This is supposedly the euro way. My mechanic/inspector doesn't have a problem with it, then again, he's a Mercedes guy and really digs the car

Can you post a link to the lights you got? Or were they just generic lights from Advanced Auto? I'm having trouble keeping all the lights in this thread straight

Unfortunately I have no links or way of posting photos, but there was a GTG here last Spring and someone may have posted a picture of my Euro wagon on the Forum. Try a search.

My rear lights were probably like yours originally, but the fog must have been destroyed when the left end of my Euro bumper was smashed. A PO replaced the destroyed fog with some generic German backup lamp assy, then wired it to the right backup wiring haeness. When I replaced my mangled Euro bumper with a US 300D sedan unit, I mounted both backup ligts under the bumper. My inspector might let me slide if I had an original rear-fog hooked up, but I don't have a red lamp unit to put back there anyway, so I'm staying with my existing arrangement for now.
Later, I may decide to replace my tacked-on backup lights, with the less-vulnerable compact Chinese LED units I got from Advance Auto.

Happy Motoring, Mark

cullennewsom · #27 08-19-2012, 03:12 PM

Thanks OP for the tip. I had originally tried to salvage my heaps of junk to make two good lights from four. I was minimally successful, but it took more mylar tape than I found pleasing. In fact, I found the whole thing to be dis-satisfactory. I was also not excited about buying more new OEM lenses to break. I scored some cheap-o driving lights from O'reilly for less than twenty bucks. They had a little cheap-o relay kit too for about twelve bucks. Their website is useless, or I'd post a link. The lights came with some chintzy little brackets. At first I was skeptical. The brackets were very flimsy. They bolted right up, but stuck out a little bit too far. After a little bit of persuasion though, I think they fit just fine. And now, the increase in light output makes it possible to safely reverse at night. You can really see where you are going.
For the moment, I just wanted to get the thing inspected*, so I did the dumb lazy thing and connected them to the original wiring. I plan to add a power plug back there and run them the proper way with a little relay. Let's hope my reverse switch can take the abuse long enough for me to do that. I might add one of these fuse blocks too.

* mission accomplished, passed without a second glance.

To hell with this junk

Much better

Close up

Shawn D. · #28 08-20-2012, 08:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cullennewsom

Thanks OP for the tip.

You're welcome. Glad folks are still getting some use out of the post.

Saybough · #29 08-28-2012, 03:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shawn D.

Y'all,

The stock backup lights on my 300td were pretty much useless (both sides smashed beyond repair), so I had to replace them. I really didn't want to spend $80 each for them, so I searched for some aftermarket replacements.

I wanted to install a "utility" type of light as I'd done for backup lights on my motorhome, but all of the ones I could find were way too big. Almost every fog light out there is way too big as well, but I finally found one that would fit: the Peterson Manufacturing V557-2, at $30.95 when I purchased the kit from Amazon in January (it's $39.99 as of this writing). The lenses are glass and are bonded to the reflector, so they should not get stained by the soot and soot shouldn't be able to sneak in. They're also short enough vertically that they don't hang down below the bumper.

To install them, I drilled the stock backup light brackets in the bumper, next to the hole the stock lights mount to. The stock backup light brackets have a ridge that mates with the back of the stock lights, so to get the V557-2 brackets to fit flush against the stock bracket, I cut the V557-2 brackets, removing 1" or so in the middle. However, once I had them mounted up, the lights sat too far inside the bumper, so I added spacers under the V557-2 brackets; that meant that I didn't end up needing that cut in the V557-2 brackets, as the spacers were taller than the ridge on the stock backup light brackets. I had planned to reinstall the rubber surrounds, but they wouldn't have fit well without serious cutting, so I decided to save them in case a subsequent owner cared to go back to stock backup lights. I think they look fine without the surround anyhow.

For the wiring, I installed a relay next to the high beam relay I installed earlier, using the same fuse as the power source. The stock backup light power wire coming from the switch at the shifter is now the trigger wire for the relay. I considered running dedicated backup light wires from the relay (and had started on that), but decided to use the stock wiring for now. Since these are just backup lights, they won't be on for long durations and I'm not concerned too much about any possible voltage loss in this case. To connect the new lights to the chassis wiring, I used the pigtails off the stock backup lights and connected them to the new lights with crimp-shrink connectors.

While the fog beam pattern obviously isn't optimal for use as a backup light, they work great, and at less than 1/4 the cost of going with the stock units, I'd do it again. Of course, offending MB purists by installing non-stock parts is bonus!

-Shawn

I think I need to follow your experience for backup lighting system and what is your thoughts about LED lights as flash lights?

Ndralle · #30 02-12-2013, 08:55 PM

I just did this mod!!!

While doing some rust repair i noticed that both bumper mounts were broken. I got a new bumper from Chiwanga. I figured while the bumper was off i might as well fix dem' Lights.

Before:

After:

I bought the lights for pep boys. they fit perfect and used all the original mounting holes.

mounted the bracket using existing hole.

mounted light to bracket. feed wires through existing hole. If you look closely the light is not centered in the bracket. It is off set. this allows the light to fit nicely while still using the stock grommet.

To get the right bolt threaded i had to pull the rubber grommet out of place and insert a screw driver from the inside of the bumper.

i mounted a relay behind the passenger side light.

Then i ran a constant power from the battery, through the firewall, under the carpet and out the back of the wagon. The lights came with a fuse so i used it up near the battery.

then i wired everything up. the picture is not that great sorry. essentially, the reverse stock light switch powers the relay and the constant powers the lights through the relay. the relay and both lights are grounded to the stock grounds. the left stock backup light power is capped. this way the lights are still triggered by the shifter but will not over load the stock switch.

the only thing left to do is re attach the bumper. (dont forget the washers)
when i was doing this i acidentally pushed the two outer bumper bolts into the body. if the happens you will need to remove the right deck panel and reach through a little hole to reset the bolts. in the picture the hole is where the green wire is fed through. (i left the extra wire so i can re route it in the future)

And with everything back together...

i tried the make sure that everything is reversible. (except a few end connectors).
I still need to go through and replace a lot of the electrical tape with insulated connectors.

sorry that the pics are crooked and huge. this is my first write up.
let me know if you have any questions.
I will probably post some night time pics soon.

P.S. I know the paint looks terrible, shes a work in progress.