I think the following thread is pretty informative when it comes to CDI's/Bluetecs:
http://www.mbworld.org/forums/e-class-w211/197568-320-cdi-i6-v-v6.html

Posts like #42 have especially interesting info:

This thread struck a nerve...

About like telling the butcher he should be a vegetarian.

Well up until you typed that, you had a fairly weak argument. Now you just aren't making sense at all. You actually believe that little can go wrong with the new diesel emissions systems. Think EGR to the power of 4 or 5.

Speaking of not knowing what you're talking about, morty. :rolleyes:

A 606 runs without a battery in it, because I've had mine out before driving 25 miles to the MB store to buy a new battery. Husk is correct about them not needing a battery to run.

This is a very interesting thread. I hope it turns back to being more civil though.

I was a real fan of the new CDI technologies, based mainly on the already mentioned robust torque curve and very impressive fuel economy. In fact, I wrote a long (no surprise there, eh?) letter to MB and to The Star questioning the delay in bringing the "C" class over with one of these new Diesels in it. They could have spent 2000 to 2009 building a new Diesel clientele and owning the mileage, range and performance criteria in that class of vehicle (the C270D CDI or even C220D CDI are very nice cars that get well over 40 mpg), all in preparation for the Bluetec vehicles.

Then I looked at one of these engines in the "E" Class engine compartment, and I read about the Bluetec system in The Star a month or so ago. The EGR system is a much bigger part of the NOx control now, so much so it has to pass through an intercooler. Now, after cleaning my manifold to remove the build up of tar from oil fumes and exhaust particulate, I am not too certain I a believe a condensing exhaust with all that particulate content won't plug or corrode the intercooler in relatively short order. I am not overly concerned with the AddBlue or the catalysts other than to worry a bit about how they keep the AddBlue fluid from freezing in cold climates. But I am concerned the intercooler is going to turn into an expensive sacrificial element of the emissions system. Time will tell, though, and I have time to wait this out and find out how the machine does.

If the engine and emissions system prove to be reliable and long lived, I will be looking for a GL320 CDI or, possibly an ML320 CDI when they roll back into dealerships with ~60k miles on them.

Until then they are nothing more than interesting. And for the record, I will never be without a Diesel. I lived through those gas lines as well, and 90% of the reason there were no Diesel lines is there were no Diesels to line up, not even pick-ups, and there were no SUVs back then. And, I agree that anyone who makes an economic evaluation on a 20 year purchase based on 30 day gas vs. Diesel prices is short changing themselves. Oil prices will be back up to $90 a barrel inside a year. And they will likely go higher and lower a few more times in the next 20 years. At some point the added refining complexity has to affect the price of gasoline, especially premium grades. For most of our history with internal combustion engines Diesel has been less costly per gallon than even regular gas. When that price structure returns we will look at these days of inverted prices and wonder how we justified buying gas cars. Until then, however, I will buy them just for the challenge of getting over 700 miles to a 22 gallon tank of fuel. Jim

I'll stand by what I said, you can't run these cars without electrical power, but that doesn't mean that they won't run without a battery. Read post #51 and you will see my clarification:

"Sorry Husk, I misunderstood your prior statement and thought you meant you could run the OM606 without electrical power. You can probably run the car without a battery, of course just about any car, gas or diesel can run without a battery as long as it has a good alternator. I've driven gas powered cars without batteries too and yes, they will run off the alternator."

My point here is that Husk seemed to imply there was something unique about the ability to run a diesel without a battery - which of course there is not. In the old days, probably up to about 1980 you could run a diesel Mercedes without a battery or alternator because once started the engine required no electrical energy. That was unique to a diesel. After they started controlling certain functions with computers this became more problematic and once the IP became computer controlled it was impossible. That's what confused people about Husk's post - that somehow he could run his car without electrical power, not simply with the battery removed once it was started.

You and he seem to both have trouble reading all of the details of a post before responding. You both also seem to like goading people into arguments. A this point I'm done responding to him and also done with you - except to correct this error which you made in interpreting my post to mean you could not run the car without a battery...I concur that you can in this and just about any car (why you would want to I don't know).

Most people on this board appreciate a lively debate (as I do) but when people turn into instigators and have arguments like "today's gas engines require costly tuneups" and the bluetec emissions controls are "simple" and "have little that can go wrong" it's obvious they are either, ignorant, delusional or just trying to be irritating. That's when I get less diplomatic in my responses.

Running an engine without a battery is not the same thing as running an engine without electricity. :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

That's like confusing Berkshire A and B shares that you like to pretend to own.

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y71...k/Misc/bdh.gif http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y71...sc/popcorn.gif

Today's gas engines are not any simpler than their diesel counterparts. I'd say they're about equally complex and gas engines may still have more parts.

Invest in some cleaning & cetane boosting fuel additives and the occasional Italian tune-up. My intake is always clean, with just a little dry soot coating.

"Running an engine without a battery is not the same thing as running an engine without electricity." No kidding? :rolleyes::)

How astute.......owning both BRK.A & BRK.B.....there is 29/30ths of no comparison between them.
I know this because I sold two shares of "A" to buy my home. Thanks for reminding me!:D;)

Thanks for the LINK. Very informative!:)

How often do EGR valves fail, in a modern Mercedes?

I believe that the system is based on technologies which have been around for a long time and that these technologies are reliable enough to offer trouble free operation.

I would like to hear from you, what specifically you believe will be the weak link of this technology.



Not true remove the battery from your C43 and romp on the gas and see what happens, it will stall. Your postulates are interesting but are based not on fact, but your armchair research. I suggest you get your hands dirty and try things out rather than making statements which are untrue.

Quote:
Originally Posted by nhdoc
You and he seem to both have trouble reading all of the details of a post before responding. You both also seem to like goading people into arguments. A this point I'm done responding to him and also done with you - except to correct this error which you made in interpreting my post to mean you could not run the car without a battery...I concur that you can in this and just about any car (why you would want to I don't know).


That is exactly correct, Husk. Each of us gave personal accounts of driving without a battery. It will not work as he states, in his wife's leased C43. Claiming untrue mechanical realities are a problem to state without actually knowing.