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  #16  
Old 03-12-2009, 06:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phyxer View Post
Get the injectors back and use the WD40 . If you get it running remember to throw in new heat shields for the longevity. If the injector that did not shut off was leaking, make sure you crank the snot out of the motor to blow out any extra possible fuel left from the leak in the chamber before you install the injectors again. Make sure the battery is 100%. Glow, and let her rip. If you have a remote starter button, it helps to hose the WD40 while cranking. Good luck and let us know what happens.
Don't be afraid to use the WD40--these engines love it. It won't hurt anything. On the other hand, don't use ether, it can damage your engine. It may take alot of WD40, glow cycles, and extended cranking sessions to get it running. It really helps if you have an assistant to crank the car will you spray, if it starts just use the WD to keep it running until the IP takes over. I have started many cars that have sat for years using this method and it works. Good Luck

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  #17  
Old 03-13-2009, 12:00 AM
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Some questions regarding WD-40

On Monday I'll try the WD-40. Some questions about the application:

# Glow cycles: Do I need to glow the engine before spraying in WD-40? Also, keep in mind that my method of glowing the engine: since my relay is bad, I'm jumping the plugs from the positive battery terminal, which always throws some sparks when I connect and disconnect the wire. Will WD-40 in vapor form ignite with a spark at, say, 60* F?

# Duration of spray: I read in the ether thread that WD-40 can be used to help the engine bleed itself, and that the engine could be run on it with a continuous spray. Is there anyone out there who has tried this? Is this use of the spray recommended? Any cautions to offer?

# Point of application: Simply put, where do I spray this stuff in? Through the tube leading to the air filter? Into the air filter housing itself?
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  #18  
Old 03-13-2009, 01:33 AM
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The only caution is not to use any of those type sprays with a HEATED MANIFOLD vehicle... like my Ford Diesel...

But the warning about the 'ether' has been put to rest many times... check on JIMSMITH's posts if you need the definitive one...

You are only spraying the vapor into the intake tube... start spraying at same time as someone starts cranking. WD-40 works fine...but ' starter fluid spray' is made for this type thing....
Always glow if you have that capability.
The spray should not be anywhere near your sparks... and being put into the tube leading to the air filter when you start cranking it should just be sucked into the proper place...
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  #19  
Old 03-13-2009, 04:45 AM
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your doing all this work and not bothering replacing the relay????????????
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  #20  
Old 03-13-2009, 05:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by captainmonk View Post
your doing all this work and not bothering replacing the relay????????????
OK, I am curious too, why not just fix the glowplug system properly? As far as the WD40 is concerned, it is nowhere near as volatile as ether, so i wouldn't be overly concerned about the sparks. Yes, cycle the glowplugs prior to trying to start. I usually just take the air cleaner lid off and spray directly into the intake throat. I don't know how cold it is in NC, but if you plug in the block heater overnight or for 4-5 hrs. before it will help alot, even if it is not that cold out. I have started many MB diesels this way and it has worked nicely. Once it took me a couple days to get a 240 running, but after it started initially and I let it idle for about an hour, it started on the first try ever since.
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  #21  
Old 03-13-2009, 12:58 PM
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Leathermang: Thanks for the advice. No heated manifold here.

Captainmonk and kingdoc: A good question. Mostly it's because the budget is a little tight. Partially, it's because when the car runs and I drive it regularly (1 or 2 times a week), the glow plugs light without a problem. Car hasn't moved for seven weeks at this point.

I've wanted to troubleshoot the problem further to make sure my problem is in the relay itself instead of the wiring connected to the relay, or even in the temperature sensor in the engine block; but I've spent most of my time just trying to get smoke to come out of the back of the engine, which is just not happening.
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Last edited by apsaulters; 03-13-2009 at 01:04 PM.
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  #22  
Old 03-13-2009, 01:16 PM
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Ok..you are spending some time on this... how about just taking out the glowplugs and seeing if they need cleaning ? Maybe borrow the reamer on the forum and make sure mixture is able to get near enough to their tips to do some good ? That would be inexpensive...
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  #23  
Old 03-13-2009, 02:20 PM
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Heat:
# Glow plugs engage (relay is shot, so I've been removing the relay wire from the last plug and jumping the plugs straight from the battery for 30 seconds; voltage input at the plug on cylinder four is 10.6 V; all four plugs were replaced last month, and I measure voltage all the way down to cylinder one)

If you need a glow plug relay, I'm sure I have a few extra in the garage for cheap. I'm over in Raleigh.
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  #24  
Old 03-13-2009, 02:38 PM
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I believe that it is possible to put in new glowplugs.... and if one does not ream at that time still have obstructions to the proper functioning of the glowplug.
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  #25  
Old 03-17-2009, 08:08 PM
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Update

Got a local Mercedes enthusiast to look over the engine this afternoon. He noticed that the fourth cylinder was leaking air and fuel through the prechamber. I'm not sure when this leak started. It certainly wasn't leaking when the car was last running in January. I don't think it was leaking last week when I did the compression test, else it seems unlikely the fourth cylinder would have tested out at 270 psi. We're looking for a replacement prechamber, and the tools to remove it.

Before discovering this, we had tried starting it on starting fluid. It didn't fire when the fluid was sprayed into the air tube; removed the tube at the housing and sprayed into it, but it didn't fire; sprayed it straight into the intake, but it didn't fire.

Does anyone know of a source for new prechambers? Any suppliers of prechamber tools?
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  #26  
Old 03-18-2009, 03:31 PM
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no start

what finally happened? did you get the car started?
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  #27  
Old 03-18-2009, 06:35 PM
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Car didn't start. Didn't even stumble on the starting fluid. No idea why. I'm trying to address the precombustion chamber leak (see previous post) that just turned up before I expect it to fire.

Current known problems:

# Precombustion chamber in cylinder four leaks fuel and air. Start of leak unknown. It seems unlikely the leak is the original reason that the engine would not start. Last week that cylinder was holding up to 270 psi. Plan: improvise precombustion chamber tools, pull precombustion chamber from a parts car and reinstall on mine.

# Cold compression on cylinders one through three is low. They average about 215 psi, which is just below 15 bar, the minimum for a hot engine as listed in the FSM. Question: if it is permissible for a cylinder to get as low as 15 bar while warm, is it reasonable to assume that it does not need to exceed 15 bar in order to fire when cold? This may be my naive optimism here, but a warm cylinder with 15 bar warm would seem to have much lower cold compression than that.


Possible problems:

# Engine did not fire on starting fluid (brake cleaner), not even when sprayed directly into the intake. This could be a result of low compression. I don't remember which brand we used but from internet research I notice that most brake cleaner specs list autoignition temperatures above that of diesel. (410* C, 375* C, 266* C for brake cleaners I found, 210* C for diesel) Questions: should brake cleaner have worked? Anyone use this stuff as starting fluid?

# Glow plugs are all new and seem to be glowing (resistance wires heat up, voltage passes from plug four to plug one), but the glow plug threads might not be adequately cleared of carbon. Plan: trust that they're actually glowing now, and ream holes if necessary.

# Hand pump on IP was replaced in August. It is of the old style, which needs to be unscrewed before being pumped. The pump seems to be moving diesel from the in-line filter to the spin-on filter, but the air bubble in the in-line filter is only getting bigger over time (increased 2x over the past week). I have begun to doubt it's solid. Question: Should it squirt out diesel when the IP has been fully primed? (Mine is dry; no diesel on the hands, ever.)
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  #28  
Old 03-18-2009, 10:30 PM
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You may not need new precombustion chamber...
I think there is a ONE TIME use crush washer under it... so if someone did not replace it that could be the cheap to fix problem...
Take it apart and look before committing to any parts spending.
I think the member rental section of this forum of this site has the pullers for rent ....
Also, do search , pretty easy to make.... if you can weld... bike part has right threads..
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  #29  
Old 03-26-2009, 01:04 PM
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I have never heard of using brake cleaner, but I know WD-40 will work!
I doubt just one leaky prechamber sealing ring would cause your car not to start, especially since it was running previously.
If there is air in the fuel line caused by the hand pump, the car will still start on WD-40
If you are trying to avoid WD-40 for fear it will somehow damage your engine, I can assure you it will not.
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  #30  
Old 04-04-2009, 05:37 PM
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Interim update

I've been checking valve timing using the camshaft tower method since installing the offset key in February. Each time the reading has been about 6* ATDC.

I checked (and rechecked, and rechecked again) valve timing by the 2mm method this morning. Lo and behold, the raw reading was about 35* ATDC, or 24* off the FSM's 11.5* ATDC.

Taking the difference between the two readings, I get 24 - 6 = 18. I think I jumped a tooth on the crankshaft when doing the offset key job.

On the one hand, this is an encouraging finding because bad valve timing seems to explain why the compression is so low, and why the engine would not fire, even on brake cleaner. On the other hand, from what I hear jumping a tooth is bad news. I'm currently searching the archives for information on it, and I'll report back after I've attempted a fix on it.

...

Kingdoc, thanks for the assurances with regard to WD40. We used brake cleaner for convenience (no "starting fluids" on hand, not even WD40) since it was in his trunk.

Leathermang, I've been hoping you're right. I already have the prechamber seal, and the prechamber tools should arrive Wednesday evening. I'll try to work on it Friday evening.

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