Parts Catalog Accessories Catalog How To Articles Tech Forums
Call Pelican Parts at 888-280-7799
Shopping Cart Cart | Project List | Order Status | Help



Go Back   PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum > Mercedes-Benz Tech Information and Support > Diesel Discussion

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #16  
Old 01-19-2010, 09:47 AM
Stevo's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: NW WA
Posts: 6,299
Quote:
Originally Posted by charmalu View Post
I picked up those filters at a Good-Guys street rod show out in the swap meet.

In my first picture, the 3 way connector between the filter and the yellow check valve. It`s one from under the carpets for the door locks. I got rid of the spider connectors, this one makes it look real tiddy and clean.

Charlie
Your whole "engine room' looks totally tidy

__________________


1985 Euro 240D 5 spd 140K
1979 240D 5 spd, 40K on engine rebuild
1994 Dodge/Cummins, 5 spd, 121K
1964 Allice Chalmers D15 tractor
2014 Kubota L3800 tractor
1964 VW bug

"Lifes too short to drive a boring car"
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 01-19-2010, 11:14 AM
MBeige's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: SoCal
Posts: 3,746
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stevo View Post
Thanks much, none of my searches turned that up
No problem! That information was from the other board. Now it's here as well. Cheers!
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 01-19-2010, 12:51 PM
Stevo's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: NW WA
Posts: 6,299
I've had two of these filters on my 79 for a couple years, but Kerry's observation about them be a "early warning" of catastrophic VP failure has prompted me to get off you duff and put them on my 85.

A few years ago I bought a burned up 82 240D that had a good running engine, which I pulled for another car. I disassembled the VP (just to inspect it) only to discover the piston had broken through the top plate but none of the pieces had gotten down into the engine yet, another story but, point is, had there been a filter on the vacuum line oil would have been visible. Good thing the car caught fire as in a few more miles the engine would have been toast anyway
__________________


1985 Euro 240D 5 spd 140K
1979 240D 5 spd, 40K on engine rebuild
1994 Dodge/Cummins, 5 spd, 121K
1964 Allice Chalmers D15 tractor
2014 Kubota L3800 tractor
1964 VW bug

"Lifes too short to drive a boring car"
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 01-19-2010, 03:14 PM
Nate Stanley's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: Watsonville, Ca
Posts: 399
c'mon Charlie,

show us a pic of the rest of the engine. I was really impressed by the polished intake manifold, valve cover and oil filter cover..perhaps the rest of the forum would like to see it too--
__________________
Nate Stanley
(Currently Benzless)
1985 F-250 6.9l 170K
2009 SCION XB 36.5K
2003 LS430 78K
2012 Kubota B 2320
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 01-19-2010, 03:35 PM
MBeige's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: SoCal
Posts: 3,746
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stevo View Post
I've had two of these filters on my 79 for a couple years, but Kerry's observation about them be a "early warning" of catastrophic VP failure has prompted me to get off you duff and put them on my 85.

A few years ago I bought a burned up 82 240D that had a good running engine, which I pulled for another car. I disassembled the VP (just to inspect it) only to discover the piston had broken through the top plate but none of the pieces had gotten down into the engine yet, another story but, point is, had there been a filter on the vacuum line oil would have been visible. Good thing the car caught fire as in a few more miles the engine would have been toast anyway
Thanks to this board and other sources too, the vacuum line filter I installed helped me diagnose a bad shutoff valve, which also prevented the oil from going to other parts of the system. If your EGR is also connected to the vacuum lines (original setup) and the filter clogs up, you'll know it's probably stuck open.
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 01-19-2010, 03:41 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 18,350
I'm actually a little puzzled by one issue to related to this matter. I can understand why a failed shut off diaphragm sucks oil into the system because there is vacuum on the shut off for a long period of time, slowly pulling oil back towards the vacuum pump.
But why does a failed vacuum pump diaphragm get oil in the system? Theoretically, air is being drawn thru the vacuum system, towards the vacuum pump, so there is no 'incentive' for oil to move from the vacuum pump up into the vacuum system. Even if the vacuum pump diaphragm fails, there is nothing pushing oil into the system as far as I can see.
Can anyone explain this? I'm thinking that when oil gets into the system, it's all coming from a bad shut off valve.
__________________
1977 300d 70k--sold 08
1985 300TD 185k+
1984 307d 126k--sold 8/03
1985 409d 65k--sold 06
1984 300SD 315k--daughter's car
1979 300SD 122k--sold 2/11
1999 Fuso FG Expedition Camper
1993 GMC Sierra 6.5 TD 4x4
1982 Bluebird Wanderlodge CAT 3208--Sold 2/13
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 01-19-2010, 06:04 PM
whunter's Avatar
Moderator
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Metro Detroit, Michigan
Posts: 17,390
Answer

Quote:
Originally Posted by kerry View Post
I'm actually a little puzzled by one issue to related to this matter. I can understand why a failed shut off diaphragm sucks oil into the system because there is vacuum on the shut off for a long period of time, slowly pulling oil back toward the vacuum pump.
But why does a failed vacuum pump diaphragm get oil in the system? Theoretically, air is being drawn through the vacuum system, toward the vacuum pump, so there is no 'incentive' for oil to move from the vacuum pump up into the vacuum system. Even if the vacuum pump diaphragm fails, there is nothing pushing oil into the system as far as I can see.
Can anyone explain this? I'm thinking that when oil gets into the system, it's all coming from a bad shut off valve.
Vacuum leak down draws oil backward into the climate control system.
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 01-19-2010, 06:45 PM
layback40's Avatar
Not Banned
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Victoria Australia - down under!!
Posts: 4,023
Roy is correct. Also when the diaphragm fails, the pressure in the crank case forces blow by down the vac lines.
__________________
Grumpy Old Diesel Owners Club group

I no longer question authority, I annoy authority. More effect, less effort....

1967 230-6 auto parts car. rust bucket.
1980 300D now parts car 800k miles
1984 300D 500k miles
1987 250td 160k miles English import
2001 jeep turbo diesel 130k miles
1998 jeep tdi ~ followed me home. Needs a turbo.
1968 Ford F750 truck. 6-354 diesel conversion.
Other toys ~J.D.,Cat & GM ~ mainly earth moving
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 01-19-2010, 06:46 PM
Stevo's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: NW WA
Posts: 6,299
It seems the MB engineers should have covered this one, but...who am I to wonder about such things

Even if you dont have climate control theres still allot of things that can get trashed. This and the "adding that extra tail light bulb" seem like worthwhile "add-ons" for these cars.
__________________


1985 Euro 240D 5 spd 140K
1979 240D 5 spd, 40K on engine rebuild
1994 Dodge/Cummins, 5 spd, 121K
1964 Allice Chalmers D15 tractor
2014 Kubota L3800 tractor
1964 VW bug

"Lifes too short to drive a boring car"
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 01-19-2010, 06:49 PM
pawoSD's Avatar
Dieselsüchtiger
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Posts: 15,438
We put one on the final car in our fleet that did not have one (my dad's '82 SD).....1.5 months later the shut-off failed, and it now has oil in it. It still shuts the car off, but the filter is half full of oil. The car is sleeping for the winter, so we will change the shut-off (have a new one on the shelf) eventually....
__________________
-diesel is not just a fuel, its a way of life-
'15 GLK250 Bluetec 118k - mine - (OC-123,800)
'17 Metris(VITO!) - 37k - wifes (OC-41k)
'09 Sprinter 3500 Winnebago View - 62k (OC - 67k)
'13 ML350 Bluetec - 95k - dad's (OC-98k)
'01 SL500 - 103k(km) - dad's (OC-110,000km)
'16 E400 4matic Sedan - 148k - Brothers (OC-155k)
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old 01-19-2010, 07:49 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 18,350
Quote:
Originally Posted by layback40 View Post
Roy is correct. Also when the diaphragm fails, the pressure in the crank case forces blow by down the vac lines.
That doesn't make sense to me. If crankcase blowby is forcing it's way past the vacuum pump diaphragm there wouldn't be any vacuum in the system causing the brake booster to fail and making most people stop driving and fix the pump to get their brakes back.
__________________
1977 300d 70k--sold 08
1985 300TD 185k+
1984 307d 126k--sold 8/03
1985 409d 65k--sold 06
1984 300SD 315k--daughter's car
1979 300SD 122k--sold 2/11
1999 Fuso FG Expedition Camper
1993 GMC Sierra 6.5 TD 4x4
1982 Bluebird Wanderlodge CAT 3208--Sold 2/13
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 01-19-2010, 11:39 PM
whunter's Avatar
Moderator
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Metro Detroit, Michigan
Posts: 17,390
Hmmm

Quote:
Originally Posted by kerry View Post
That doesn't make sense to me. If crankcase blow-by is forcing it's way past the vacuum pump diaphragm there wouldn't be any vacuum in the system causing the brake booster to fail and making most people stop driving and fix the pump to get their brakes back.
He means the shut off diaphragm fails, crankcase blow-by is forcing it's way into the vacuum system.
Even a small rip or puncture will pass a lot of oil.

With the engine running, shutdown:
* Vacuum is applied to the failed shut off diaphragm.
* Crankcase blow-by is forcing it's way into the vacuum system.
* All of the MB vacuum pumps that do not have a second dedicated vent/output hose; air vacuumed from the system is vented into the crankcase, increasing crankcase atmospheric pressure = making the issue worse.
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old 01-19-2010, 11:48 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 18,350
OK. That I get.
I remember reading somewhere that oil would get into the vacuum lines by a failure in a vacuum pump diaphragm and the clear filter would give warning of a failed pump diaphragm. That's the part that doesn't make sense. Seems to me that oil in the vacuum system must be coming from the shut off diaphragm and not a failed vacuum pump diaphragm.
__________________
1977 300d 70k--sold 08
1985 300TD 185k+
1984 307d 126k--sold 8/03
1985 409d 65k--sold 06
1984 300SD 315k--daughter's car
1979 300SD 122k--sold 2/11
1999 Fuso FG Expedition Camper
1993 GMC Sierra 6.5 TD 4x4
1982 Bluebird Wanderlodge CAT 3208--Sold 2/13
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old 01-22-2010, 03:10 PM
Stevo's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: NW WA
Posts: 6,299
I just finished installing my filters from Phil, one in the brown shut down switch line and one in the door lock and headlight adjustment line. I dont think it would matter which way they go although with the "beveled" end toward the switch it looks like oil would collect on the outside of the filter paper in the event of a ruptured diaphragm, not that you couldn't see it if were on the inside.
__________________


1985 Euro 240D 5 spd 140K
1979 240D 5 spd, 40K on engine rebuild
1994 Dodge/Cummins, 5 spd, 121K
1964 Allice Chalmers D15 tractor
2014 Kubota L3800 tractor
1964 VW bug

"Lifes too short to drive a boring car"
Reply With Quote
  #30  
Old 01-22-2010, 03:34 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 18,350
Just replaced the shutoff valve and put one filter in that line and another in the 'everything else' line coming from the pump.

__________________
1977 300d 70k--sold 08
1985 300TD 185k+
1984 307d 126k--sold 8/03
1985 409d 65k--sold 06
1984 300SD 315k--daughter's car
1979 300SD 122k--sold 2/11
1999 Fuso FG Expedition Camper
1993 GMC Sierra 6.5 TD 4x4
1982 Bluebird Wanderlodge CAT 3208--Sold 2/13
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On




All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:02 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2018 Pelican Parts, LLC - Posts may be archived for display on the Peach Parts or Pelican Parts Website -    DMCA Registered Agent Contact Page